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Home✈️Aircraft🚁Helicoptere-MikadoOther › Logo 10 Vbar conversion
01-26-2007 08:32 AM  12 years ago
Lorents

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Oslo, Norway

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That is an interesting question Jon! Its hard to tell but a 6S 5000 EVO 20C pack can deliver 2220W continously while the older 10S2P 4000 12C packs that I use on this video can deliver 1776 continously. If you slap a Vbar on that 6S setup in addition you should have more power than mine on the older 10S packs...
For some reason I don't think they feel as much guilt about buying a pair of shoes as we do about a new heli or $1000 heli part
I think you are absoulutely right there Casey!!! We need to understand that there is no reason to feel guilt when we get that extra $1000 part
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01-26-2007 01:56 PM  12 years ago
jrvander

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Camp Foster, Okinawa japan

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Nice vid!
Imagine you could get the same or better flight performance in that video with 400g less weight? I have a Tango 10 that I'm going to try in my new L14 just to see how it will perform with a 6S 20C Evo pack. I think it will fly ok, but I have doubts that it will perform as well as that 10S video.

If Logo 10 6S V-Bar > Logo 14 flybared 10S,

then is Logo 14 6s V-bar = Logo 14 flybared 10S?

I guess my real question is: how much power is consumed by the flybar and associated linkages? 10% of the overall usage? 20%?

I need three packs to fly electric all day. One in the air, one cooling and one on the charger. Factoring in BS time, cooking hotdogs, watching other people fly, etc. I can fly pretty much non-stop on three rotating packs. From a budget point of view, the cost savings from a 10S to 6S is 150 each, so that's 450 overall - almost halfway to a V-bar! Work with me here guys, I'm trying to justify the cost.

My wife used to buy alot of shoes. Not overly expensive, but alot of them. At one time she must've had 40 pairs, all different. I've seen shoes in the expensive stores for $500-$1000 a pair! And they weren't even Gortex!

- Jon
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01-26-2007 03:46 PM  12 years ago
MrMel

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Gotland

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Math:

Comparison 10s1p 3700 and 6s1p 4900

Weight gain is then 220 grams

Logo 14 with 10s1p and Vstabi = 3080 grams
Logo 14 with 6s1p and Vstabi = 2860 grams

Power output:
10s1p 3700 @ 20C = 2738 watts
6s1p 4900 @ 20C = 2175 watts

Logo 14 with 10s1p = 0.88 watts per gram
Logo 14 with 6s1p = 0.76 watts per gram

I stay with 10s.

Flybarless is about 20% more efficient, but most noticeable is that you dont need extreme headspeed for good cyclic, so you can lower headspeed and still get extreme cyclic.
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01-26-2007 05:25 PM  12 years ago
caseyjholmes

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Portland, Oregon

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Flybarless is about 20% more efficient, but most noticeable is that you dont need extreme headspeed for good cyclic, so you can lower headspeed and still get extreme cyclic.
And that is exactly the main reason I want one
I like super fast cyclic that most would consider a "twitchy" heli. I could even go with some more roll rate on my L103D as it is. To fly close to the ground, a quick cyclic rate can help alot. Too slow and you might knife edge doing a low pass roll.

Thats not the only reason I like quick cyclic, but rather an easy way to explain how you can benefit from it.

Now you have me thinking I need to try one of these for sure! (for some reason I forgot that a flybarless heli has much quicker cyclic for a minute there)
My L10 with an even quicker roll cyclic would be about the only heli I would ever want to fly.. besides maybe an L14.

BTW, Nice L14 vid Lorents!
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01-26-2007 06:29 PM  12 years ago
MrMel

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Gotland

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You can basically get better roll and flip rate then your T-rex 450
In other words, super fast, but also superstable in the same time, even if you "up" the fliprate, it wont affect the overall stable-ness of the whole heli (like super-light paddles would do)

Pretty cool.
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01-26-2007 07:01 PM  12 years ago
Lorents

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Oslo, Norway

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Thanks Casey

Fredrik, if I can choose between state of the art 10S and 6S packs I would go 10S too (actually I just picked up 4 10S1P EVO NF packs ). The point is that newer 6S packs should in theory be more powerful than what was considered THE 10S 3D setup about a year ago. Since not everyone needs a ballistic helicopter it could be an excellent option for the L14

Jon, I havent flown with the logger on the Vbar yet but notice that I only put back about 2800 mah in my 4200 packs while I used to charge about 3200-3300 with the same flying times.
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01-26-2007 07:05 PM  12 years ago
TOSH

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UK.Peterborough

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Since not everyone needs a ballistic helicopter
Flybars. Who needs `em.
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01-26-2007 07:08 PM  12 years ago
Lorents

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Oslo, Norway

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Yeah I was surprised by that too Tosh! Just read about something weird called "sports flying" in a heli mag

What comes around goes around.
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01-26-2007 07:23 PM  12 years ago
TOSH

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UK.Peterborough

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"sports flying"
Nar, you got me there mate . Never heard of it, probably a miss print. (l know her sister by the way)
Flybars. Who needs `em.
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01-26-2007 08:56 PM  12 years ago
jrvander

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Camp Foster, Okinawa japan

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pretty close numbers
MrMel gets 20% better performance by his calculations, and Lorents gets pretty close to that (16% by my math). So, if I were pulling 80 amps in a heavy maneuver with the flybared head, with the V-bar I could potentially reduce that to 64 at a signicant savings in current draw and wasted heat. Plus, if you can reduce the head a few hundred rpm yet still retain the cyclic authority, that would be a fair current savings as well.

This is all pure speculation on my part, I'm just throwing out ideas for discussion.

- Jon
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02-03-2007 06:13 PM  12 years ago
Lorents

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Oslo, Norway

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Finally I got some 3D flying on video here. Last time I adjusted the tail gain with the older TP packs in it and it flew great without any waging until I put in my precious EVO pack - the extra rpms the EVO makes it wag in some situations. Now I tried to reduce the throttle %age when flying with the EVO pack but it wasnt enough. I'd better reduce the gain a little

http://www.lojal.no/userfiles/Logo_10_vbar_2.wmv
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02-03-2007 07:17 PM  12 years ago
MrMel

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Gotland

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Nice flying lorents!
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02-03-2007 07:47 PM  12 years ago
caseyjholmes

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Portland, Oregon

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Nice Flyin'!
I'd be nursing frozen fingers
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02-05-2007 09:25 AM  12 years ago
Lorents

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Oslo, Norway

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Thanks guys! Casey, if you just fly hard enough you dont have time to think about those fingers aching in the cold

Yesterday I noticed that after this flight one of the teeth on the .5 main gear where missing so I guess the power in this Logo on the verge of what the .5 can handle. I have ordered .7 gears for it now
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02-05-2007 03:13 PM  12 years ago
lloyd

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Perth,Australia (South African)

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.
Great vid and insane flying...............some are just born with it and others,well, pay there way through..................

lloyd
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02-05-2007 05:42 PM  12 years ago
caseyjholmes

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Portland, Oregon

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Yesterday I noticed that after this flight one of the teeth on the .5 main gear where missing so I guess the power in this Logo on the verge of what the .5 can handle. I have ordered .7 gears for it now
Even with 6s on the NEU motor and flybarED head..
I notice the soft start is almost too much for the .5MOD. My main is already starting to get a tiny bit choppy. No missing teeth yet, but it could happen easily if I spooled up to quickly on accident. I have to be VERY careful at spoolup..

The .7MOD gears fit the L10?
That almost sounds like a mandatory upgrade on my end
I wonder if it will retain it's quietness?

I find the hardest part about flying in the cold to be holding a constant piro rate. Seems when I'm shivering, my rudder input is all over the place
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02-06-2007 04:55 AM  12 years ago
OICU812

rrMaster

Edson, Alberta, Canada

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The .7MOD gears fit the L10?
That almost sounds like a mandatory upgrade on my end
I wonder if it will retain it's quietness?
Yes several including epc2 did this as well.
...Once upon a time there were Nitros, flybars and frequency pins...
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02-06-2007 05:28 PM  12 years ago
Lorents

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Oslo, Norway

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Casey, you need the .7 gear and the .7 tail input gear (I think its #3001). I'll send you a PM when I have tried it in the air

Its not so bad flying when its cold outside as long as its not windy. When its windy you loose the feeling in your fingers after a couple minutes

Thank you for the kind words Lloyd!
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