RunRyder RC
 21  Topic Subscribe
WATCH
 10 pages [ <<    <     4      5     ( 6 )     7      8     NEXT    >> ] 5450 views POST REPLY
HomeOff Topics › Name Something Good Bush Jr Has Done
11-23-2006 07:31 PM  11 years agoPost 101
jimco

rrApprentice

east texas

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Hey Kook: Yea, it is really strange. If you start looking around the web, you find all kinds of articles, some by known nut cases, but not everyone that has studied this deal is a nut. If you have an open mind, and just pay attention, it comes up kinda smelly. Too many deals went totally wrong on that day, too many things had to come together at the right time for it to remotely , take place.
And the timing is very suspect. Happened when we were playing the same scenario, war games???? Cut me some slack. I was born at night, but not last night.
Have a good thanksgiving, be thankful for the fact that GWB is finished.

Honey, where's the check book, it's Fedex again

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-23-2006 07:41 PM  11 years agoPost 102
Rob_T

rrElite Veteran

..

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

At the time there were approximately 6000 aircraft in flight over the US between Jumbos and flying school Cessnas. After the first plane hit, nobody could immediately say "this is terrorism, not a tragic accident". Only when the second plane hit could you make the rasonable assumption that it wasn't an accident. Then the question is, which plane (of the 6000 flying) represents a threat?

If we scrambled fighters and shot down planes every time a pilot screws up, I'd guess there would be a lot more carnage than happened on 9/11.

I'm not a member of Bush's fan club. He's made enough clear errors of judgement that we really dont need to reach at straws to find things to criticize him for.

PM  EMAIL  Attn:RR  Quote
11-23-2006 07:52 PM  11 years agoPost 103
jimco

rrApprentice

east texas

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Rob: you need to read up on Norad. They can find a knats a$$ at 10000 ft, in a snow storm. Finding aircraft that strayed from the correct course, lost communications, is their specialty. The following , is part of the reason for total failure on that day.
http://www.oilempire.us/standdown.html
Seems like a lot of White House , interferance caused most of the problem.
Heaven help us if Haiti should attack. We would not survive , if this is how Good our air defense has become.
Read the article, very interesting.

Honey, where's the check book, it's Fedex again

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-23-2006 09:02 PM  11 years agoPost 104
Rob_T

rrElite Veteran

..

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Radar technology tells nothing about the intent of the pilot. The problem all along was knowing which of the 6000 planes represented a threat. It was only after the FAA ordered planes to land that there was any chance of identifying the threats. By the time those orders were given, both WTCs had been hit.

Radar procedures are focussed on identifying the entry of unauthorized aircraft into US airspace, and they are good at that. None of the planes involved in the 911 attack entered US airspace- because they had not been outside it. ADIZ did not apply in this case.

Sure procedures could have been more snappy, but I dont think they would have saved a single life no matter how smoothly communications had taken place.

Criticize Bush for what he did afterwards- there's plenty of material with far greater credibility.

PM  EMAIL  Attn:RR  Quote
11-23-2006 09:11 PM  11 years agoPost 105
jimco

rrApprentice

east texas

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Flight 93, was shot down, bye the way. I'll find the link and send it.

Honey, where's the check book, it's Fedex again

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-23-2006 09:16 PM  11 years agoPost 106
jimco

rrApprentice

east texas

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

airspace over the northeastern US is among the busiest on the planet. It is home to the nation's political, military and financial headquarters, the largest population concentrations, and key strategic facilities. A jumbo jet in this area suddenly changing direction and altitude, and refusing to respond to air traffic controllers would be as dangerous as a truck on a busy rush-hour freeway driving the wrong way at full speed. When planes go off course in this busy environment, instant reactions make the difference between life and death -- which is why NORAD (North American Air Defense) practices these kinds of scenarios, and instantly scrambles fighters when there is any hint of a problem.

For critics of the official story of 9/11, the smokiest of the smoking guns is the "failure" of NORAD to intercept the planes. Even if one ignores the abundant evidence that allied intelligence services in other countries provided warnings that the attacks were about to happen, the information from the "insider trading " just before 9/11 that indicated which airline companies would be used, and other clues that clearly show complete official foreknowledge -- there is still enormous evidence that does not fit the official paradigm of "incompetence responding to a surprise attack."

The "timeline" of 9/11 was the first, and most important indicator of a massive discrepancy with the official story. NORAD's fighter interceptors can travel at supersonic speed, yet even the most basic calculations suggested that they had to fly far below even normal subsonic flight speeds to avoid reaching their destination (New York and Washington) in time. (See the "timeline" information lower on this webpage). Apologists for the Bush regime state that since they were not expecting the 9/11 scenario, and thought that the hijacking would be a "traditional" type hijack, but this avoids the question of why the off-course planes were not intercepted (a procedure that does not require Presidential authorization, unlike the order to shoot down the plane).

Honey, where's the check book, it's Fedex again

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-23-2006 09:25 PM  11 years agoPost 107
fiatracer163

rrNovice

Milwaukee Wi

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

bush jr? is that some type of leafy radio?

PM  EMAIL  Attn:RR  Quote
11-23-2006 09:26 PM  11 years agoPost 108
EvoFlight50

rrApprentice

Southbury, CT

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

airspace over the northeastern US is among the busiest on the planet. It is home to the nation's political, military and financial headquarters, the largest population concentrations, and key strategic facilities. A jumbo jet in this area suddenly changing direction and altitude, and refusing to respond to air traffic controllers would be as dangerous as a truck on a busy rush-hour freeway driving the wrong way at full speed. When planes go off course in this busy environment, instant reactions make the difference between life and death -- which is why NORAD (North American Air Defense) practices these kinds of scenarios, and instantly scrambles fighters when there is any hint of a problem.
if you were ATC and the plane went off course and didnt respond theres a list of things that could have happened ... how do they know the plane wasnt having an emergency? ... even if we had scrambled fighters what would that have done? there would have been fighers following the plane as it flew into the building ... or we could have show them down ... id love to see what people would be saying if Bush shot down a jumbo jet full of people over American land ...

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-23-2006 09:30 PM  11 years agoPost 109
jimco

rrApprentice

east texas

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

I would love to see what people would be saying, in he was doing his job. Could be really different, huh.
Check this out.

newsgroup a former Pentagon Air Force Traffic controller writes:
"All those years ago when I was in the Pentagon, this wouldn't have happened. ATC Radar images were (and are) available in the understructures of the Pentagon, and any commercial flight within 300 miles of DC that made an abrupt course change toward Washington, turned off their transponder, and refused to communicate with ATC, would have been intercepted at supersonic speeds within a max of 9 minutes by a Fighter out of Andrews. Period. Why these planes weren't, baffles me. If we could get fighters off the ground in 2 minutes then, we could now."
http://www.flight93crash.com/flight93_military_faq.html

Honey, where's the check book, it's Fedex again

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-23-2006 09:32 PM  11 years agoPost 110
jimco

rrApprentice

east texas

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Here is the flight 93 link. http://www.flight93crash.com/flight93_military_faq.html

Honey, where's the check book, it's Fedex again

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-23-2006 09:37 PM  11 years agoPost 111
jimco

rrApprentice

east texas

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Ultimately, Flight 93 was shot down around 10:06 am near Shanksville, Pennsylvania, although this was kept concealed from the public. It's probable that most citizens would have accepted the "need" to keep this plane from reaching the DC area (assuming that is where it was headed), a loss of life that would have ensured that a worse disaster was prevented. However, acknowledging this action might inspire further questions about 9/11 -- such as why the plane that hit the Pentagon also was not shot down, especially since most of the time it was hijacked it was flying over sparsely populated forest in West Virginia and western Virginia. There are a variety of theories why Flight 93 was shot down (but the evidence it was seems overwhelming - see http://www.flight93crash.com for the best compilation), but perhaps a key issue is the fact the plane left Newark (NJ) airport almost an hour late, and therefore it had to be stopped since enough havoc had already been created, and an additional attack, another half-hour after the Pentagon crash, would have been even harder to explain as "incompetence." It is possible, too, that the "heroic passengers" story was always part of the script, but that is, of course, speculation.

Honey, where's the check book, it's Fedex again

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-23-2006 09:41 PM  11 years agoPost 112
TrexRookie

rrKey Veteran

San Francisco, CA

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

*holds up a white flag*

HAPPY TURKEY DAY!

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-23-2006 09:45 PM  11 years agoPost 113
jimco

rrApprentice

east texas

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

http://www.prisonplanet.com/article...rgamescover.htm
Yall too, see you later, fried turkey is calling. hehe'
Later, Jimco

Honey, where's the check book, it's Fedex again

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-23-2006 11:20 PM  11 years agoPost 114
homer

rrNovice

Gainesville - Florida

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

I would love to see what people would be saying, in he was doing his job. Could be really different, huh.
I would love to see what people would be saying if all this crap being said about President Bush wasn't pushed by the whining demoncrats and he was allowed to do his job. Without being on the defensive all the time. Remember Kennedy the woman killer? He was given the chance by President Bush to help with the funding of the school system. Anything he wanted. He proposed a fix and President Bush approved it without change. Remember what happened next? Old Kennedy boy and the rest of the demoncrats said it wasn't enough. It was their plan not President Bush's and they still bitched. the truth of the matter is if the demoncrats actually took losing like men and quit their political crap we would all be farther ahead. We put these loosers in office to serve the people. All they want to do is take bribes and cause trouble.

Oh and by the way its 'President Bush' not Bush Jr. Have some respect for the man or didnt your parents teach you that as your were growing up.

Homer

PM  EMAIL  Attn:RR  Quote
11-23-2006 11:30 PM  11 years agoPost 115
jimco

rrApprentice

east texas

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Ok Homer: But even compared to his daddy, he will always be Jr. His dad did have some semblence of snap. The mistake that we made, as voters, was we thought the blood line and snap factor would carry thru..

Honey, where's the check book, it's Fedex again

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-24-2006 12:34 AM  11 years agoPost 116
mrtimbr549

rrNovice

Michigan, USA

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Homers right, have some respect for the WORST US president ever. Good lord its painful to listen to him bumble, and stumble through a speech, and God forbid he has to explain something.
We have becom alienated from the rest of the world thanks to his cowboy antics. Personally, I miss the days when a BJ was the worst thing happening in DC. Now we have Iraq, Haliburton, and a bunch of gay pedophiles running the country.
I am neither Republican or Democrat, I simply rely on my instincts for realizing whats best for our country. All you 'ditto' heads learn to think for yourselves. (Rush Limbaugh is a fat hypocrite, but that deserves its own thread lol)>
And to the person who said 'I got a check from him, didnt you? Typical right-winger ...throw me some money and Im a happly little lap dog.
I Miss Ross Perot!!! Thats how badly I am dissappointed in the current watch.

PM  EMAIL  Attn:RR  Quote
11-24-2006 12:59 AM  11 years agoPost 117
jimco

rrApprentice

east texas

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Mrtimbr: You got that right: I think Ross was too smart to get sucked in the cesspool , of Washington, politics.
He probably would have been assassinated, first week>.
Was not to be someones yes man.

Honey, where's the check book, it's Fedex again

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-24-2006 01:13 AM  11 years agoPost 118
T.J. Kong

rrApprentice

Northern California

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

I generally try to stay out of political discussions on this forum because they usually end up in pissing contests and rarely end up in a productive discussion. However, I felt the need to get involved in this one. As an American and airline employee, I find these arguments offensive. This is not because of a political viewpoint, but because these types of conspiracy theory arguments are based on vague assumptions and the “facts” lack any merit. Furthermore, focusing on these arguments diminishes the focus of the problem, terrorism.

First, the WTC was designed to withstand the impact of a 707. However, there is still a significant difference between a 707 and 767. I don’t know the gross weight of a 707 off hand but I’m quite sure it is at least 100k lbs lighter than a 767. In addition, the threat of a 707 hitting the WTC was based on the Empire State/B-25 accident, i.e. an errant aircraft. The idea of an airplane being flown into the building deliberately was not considered. I’m also quite sure that they figured the airplane would hit at a maximum speed of 250 kts, the maximum speed allowed below 10k ft. (I don’t recall if the speed limit was enforced before or after the WTC was built. However, it would still be a reasonable assumption) the airplanes that hit the WTC were flown well in excess of 250 kts. I’m quite sure that UAL 175 was beyond its designed maximum speed at the time of impact. Remember that force is not linear (F = mass x velocity squared) In addition; both buildings withstood the impact of the airplane, but failed during the ensuing fire. When they designed the buildings, did they consider a fire of that magnitude? I doubt it.

With regards the date of the attack, I’m sure the date was of a greater importance than whether or not there were military exercises going on. They were looking for symbolism, which would be why AA and UAL were the targets and not NWA and Delta. There are many coincidences in life and very few of them have a “higher” meaning.

Al Queda has been trying to kill us for years: WTC 1991, Beirut, USS Cole, African embassies. Why would it be impossible for them to carry out this attack by themselves? I just don’t see the logic of the Bush administration covertly helping or designing these attacks. Please don’t say that it was to attack Iraq. That would be another false argument. It is simply not logical that they wanted the attacks.

Like I said earlier, unless you were directly involved that day, you cannot comprehend the confusion. This was not a Russian attack of 1000 ICBM’s coming over the pole. We were trained differently for terrorist attacks on Sept 10th than on September 12th. Previously, terrorists were to be complied with until a game plan could be established. I don’t know why Bush sat in the classroom for 30 min. Nobody knew what was going on. You have been critical enough of Bush. Maybe he was acting like a poor leader. I’m sure you won’t argue that fact.

With regards to Norad's response, shooting down an airliner was not generally (if ever) considered before 9/11. Yes, 6000 airplanes were safely landed during the attacks. Did any of those have terrorists on board? It is my understanding that all airplanes containing terrorist were destroyed. Again, the confusion was tremendous. Planes were told to land ASAP without explanation. Which planes were hijacked? Which planes were going to targets and which planes were landing at safe airfield? Not knowing which airplanes were where and doing what would be a totally expected outcome.

I can understand different political views, but I cannot comprehend the conspiracy theorists. Sometimes people look for the most obscure “facts” and run with them. These “facts” become truths when they are repeated so many times in forums and blogs.

Before you keep these “truths” alive I beg you to look at scientific facts and unbiased reviews. Those murdered on September 11th 2001 deserve that.

P.S. I wrote this prior to having internet access and reading the most recent comments. Jimco, I find your comments about UAL 93 extremely insulting. I know people who have listened to the cockpit recorders. UAL 93 was not shot down.

PM  EMAIL  Attn:RR  Quote
11-24-2006 01:21 AM  11 years agoPost 119
jimco

rrApprentice

east texas

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Kong: I am only posting what is available on the net. If you back up to the links that I posted, that is where it came from. More than one site carrying the same message.
Not being disrespectabel to anyone, I didn't write it, someone higher up the ladder did. Sorry.

Honey, where's the check book, it's Fedex again

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-24-2006 01:24 AM  11 years agoPost 120
jimco

rrApprentice

east texas

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

One thing that I do have to say: If our air defense had such a hard time with 4 airliners, what in the hell would we do with a full scale attack? Kinda of scarry thought.

Honey, where's the check book, it's Fedex again

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
WATCH
 10 pages [ <<    <     4      5     ( 6 )     7      8     NEXT    >> ] 5450 views POST REPLY
HomeOff Topics › Name Something Good Bush Jr Has Done
 Print TOPIC  Make Suggestion 

 21  Topic Subscribe

Monday, June 25 - 8:58 pm - Copyright © 2000-2018 RunRyder   EMAILEnable Cookies

Login Here
 New Subscriptions 
 Buddies Online