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HomeAircraftHelicopterMain Discussion › FMA co-pilot for learning 3D
11-21-2006 04:16 PM  11 years agoPost 1
RhelipilotC

rrNovice

Oahu, Hawaii

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I know the general opinion about the FMA co-pilot is that a beginner is better off using a sim. But my question is would it be good for learning 3D? I can fly but I am afraid to try any 3D because I am afraid I will lose orientation and then crash. I can fly decent 3D on the sim, but as soon as I start the Trex, I go about my normal figure 8 routine(ZZZZZZZZ)
What about hooking it up to a "panic" switch to hit just in case?

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11-21-2006 05:02 PM  11 years agoPost 2
PaulJC

rrElite Veteran

Hertfordshire UK

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Panic switch is an option but you have to remember that co pilot only levels the heli and has no control over collective, a level heli is no better off if its coming down full negative to the ground

I think practice is the key and mind/finger programming through burning fuel and sim time is the best way.

I'm working my way through the some practice notes for the IRCHA PPP program that i downloaded somewhere which basically takes you from a hover to 3d/aeros in steps, the best thing about it is it gives you a push towards the moves required in each step so you advance your flying without going to mad at 1st.

If you are happy flying figure of 8's, try some circuits or FF, then stall turns.

If you can get someone else to check your set up and fly some mild aeros with your heli you will then be confident that it wont fall out of the sky if you flip it inverted

Re-entering the atmosphere...

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11-21-2006 08:51 PM  11 years agoPost 3
wurthless

rrElite Veteran

Redding Ca.

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There's alot of info on the CP (it gets to be a heated argument after awhile). Do a search and read about it. I myself use it as a bail out and it had done me right. Saved a ton of money and instead of goin home with a pile to rebuild i was able to keep flying. I am how-ever looking at the ap2000 for my next one.

QUICK! ,,,can someone turn the gravity off for just a second,,,,

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11-21-2006 09:00 PM  11 years agoPost 4
RCtaz

rrVeteran

Leander, TX

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I have never used one of the CP's but to me I think it would be a waste of time and money.

The worst thing you can do is to rush into trying 3d. You NEED to be COMFORTABLE in all orientations before you start going hog wild trying 3d.

Practice and get comfortable with you heli and fly the snot out of the sim. Soon enough you will find your self doing with your heli what you do on the sim and if you can hover nose in, side in, and inverted you wont have a problem.

just my 2 cents.

Mike

~Texas Renegade Rotorz~

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11-21-2006 10:57 PM  11 years agoPost 5
Rick_H

rrKey Veteran

Boulder City, Nevada

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I love when people with no practical knowledge of the Co-Pilot Chime in on a question like this.

Do a search and you will find that people who have Actually used the Co-Pilot as a bail out switch rave about it. Such as myself.

To be able to bring home a flyable heli at the end of a day of trying new moves is allot better than the guy next to you who was tying those same moves and is going home to order replacement parts. Now just who is going to get more stick time? The guy with the Co-Pilot of course.

Rick.

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11-22-2006 12:35 AM  11 years agoPost 6
RCtaz

rrVeteran

Leander, TX

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I love when people with no practical knowledge of the Co-Pilot Chime in on a question like this
I wasnt bashing the thing just saying there is no sub for stick time and knowing attitudes!

Good 3D is more than "stick banging" and if you want to learn to 3D and progress in your flying you have to put in the time. If you feel like you need a "blanky" to be safe maybe your getting ahead of your self!

If your trying to teach yourself how to hover and into FF the CP thingy is probably good for that but if you think your ready to try 3D its time to throw away the "blanky"

~Texas Renegade Rotorz~

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11-22-2006 12:44 AM  11 years agoPost 7
wurthless

rrElite Veteran

Redding Ca.

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If your trying to teach yourself how to hover and into FF the CP thingy is probably good for that but if you think your ready to try 3D its time to throw away the "blanky"
this is exactly the crap that is expected from someone that dos'nt know his a$$$ froma a hole in the ground when it comes to the CP,,,,and then you try to turn it into a sand box fight by using terms like "blanky". Be constructive in your comments and keep the blows above the waist, we've all heard the basic arguments before,,,,let's not go there kiddies

QUICK! ,,,can someone turn the gravity off for just a second,,,,

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11-22-2006 12:56 AM  11 years agoPost 8
RCtaz

rrVeteran

Leander, TX

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this is exactly the crap that is expected from someone that dos'nt know his a$$$ froma a hole in the ground when it comes to the CP
I love it when someone ask for an oppion and other people get bent cause they dont like what you say.

I wasnt trying to start a fight and may have used the wrong wording but I gave my honest oppion!

~Texas Renegade Rotorz~

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11-22-2006 01:27 AM  11 years agoPost 9
greg

rrKey Veteran

Yorkville, IL

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Hey Taz, are you still using the co-pilot. Last time I saw you flying you had it on the whole time even when landing. I know you are finally into forward flight and you told me several years ago you would take it off once you got comfortable with circuits. Guess your not comfortable yet.

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11-22-2006 01:35 AM  11 years agoPost 10
RhelipilotC

rrNovice

Oahu, Hawaii

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Condescending
If you feel like you need a "blanky" to be safe maybe your getting ahead of your self!
Why do you have to be so condescending? Sorry, but not everyone is a pro like I guess you are. The problem with you and alot of others in here (and everywhere else for that matter) is you forget that even you, at one time, were a novice. I am sure you needed a "blanky" too at one time or another. Maybe not a CP but heck, even a sim might be considered a "blanky", no?

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11-22-2006 01:49 AM  11 years agoPost 11
RCtaz

rrVeteran

Leander, TX

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Hey Taz, are you still using the co-pilot. Last time I saw you flying you had it on the whole time even when landing. I know you are finally into forward flight and you told me several years ago you would take it off once you got comfortable with circuits. Guess your not comfortable yet.
I try Greg, but what can I say!
Practice and get comfortable with you heli and fly the snot out of the sim.
Yep Im being condescending!
Sorry, but not everyone is a pro like I guess you are.
Can tell you havent seen me fly!

~Texas Renegade Rotorz~

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11-22-2006 01:57 AM  11 years agoPost 12
greg

rrKey Veteran

Yorkville, IL

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Sorry Taz, just had to do it. Tim told me how bent out of shape you were getting over this thread so I just had to throw some fuel on the fire.

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11-22-2006 01:59 AM  11 years agoPost 13
RCtaz

rrVeteran

Leander, TX

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I can take the heat!! But not so sure about some other folks

~Texas Renegade Rotorz~

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11-22-2006 02:23 AM  11 years agoPost 14
HUTCH964

rrKey Veteran

Taylor,Texas 76574 local airport T74

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Sorry but I have to agree with Taz..
IMHO:
You would be better served buying Nitro Fuel/or Batteries and just getting in some air time and their might be a mentor there that can HELP you along the way!
I have seen those that have used the Co-Pilot and have HELL getting off the rig and in all I think it can do more damage than good IF you don't wean your self off it ASAP much like you would the Roto-Pod..

I think Taz was only trying too Help you out and it has nothing to do with him being a better pilot than others but he has seen tha same as I on how it will and OR can turn the pilot learning a maneuver to lean on the Co-Pilot too much and result in a Crash like said in the above.. It will not stop the heli from smacking the ground or flying the darn thing off into the Wild Blue Wonder too never be seen again..

But in all Different strokes for different Folks…

Good Luck in your Flying! If you were here I would help you!!!

*****

Tim

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11-22-2006 02:50 AM  11 years agoPost 15
wurthless

rrElite Veteran

Redding Ca.

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If you feel like you need a "blanky" to be safe
here is where you were condescending
love it when someone ask for an oppion and other people get bent cause they dont like what you say.
your opinion is welcomed, the above part was the offensive part
I have seen those that have used the Co-Pilot and have HELL getting off the rig and in all I think it can do more damage than good IF you don't wean your self off it ASAP
I would like to know where the treatment center is that is full of these CP addicted pilots,,I mean it was just the other day I put a few bucks in a can that a poor heli pilot was holding along with the sign that read "help me I can't fly with out a CP"...
Come on it's a tool,,,a GOOD tool, you cna use it AND abuse it,,,but dont knock it unless you've tried it,,,,peace to all

QUICK! ,,,can someone turn the gravity off for just a second,,,,

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11-22-2006 03:24 AM  11 years agoPost 16
hedgebird

rrApprentice

New Canaan, 06840 CT, USA & Copenhagen, Denmark

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It is a good feeling have a the option to install a Co-Pilot. I got the co-pilot 3 weeks ago, but have not installed it yet...

But is is sure nice to think about installing it...

I will wait until next crash... then the next one... and so one...

but selling it? no man... It is cool to have stuff...

LOL

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11-22-2006 10:14 AM  11 years agoPost 17
PaulJC

rrElite Veteran

Hertfordshire UK

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I think a lot of the trouble is people forget just how damn hard it was when they first started out, we all at some time crashed more then we could fly and spent time hopping round a field on training sticks.

However, the CP sounds like a good device in its own right, i do believe however that being able to hover unassisted in anyway in any orientation is what helped me progress with my flying back then.

I think that burning fuel is the answer, period! BUT if you want to have the use of a co-pilot on your machine while you burn that fuel then go for it, just dont become reliant on it.

In time your fingers will save the heli through reactions alone far quicker than a co-pilot will, the only way to hone these reactions is to burn fuel and sim time.

Now i'm moving onto inverteds flight/moves i have considered a co-pilot however i think that burning fuel is the way forward for me, it all boils down to confidence in your machine, if you want a co-pilot to help with tha confidence then go for it, another thing that helps it get somebody to fly your heli for you and smack the f out of it for a few flights and you'll then have greater confidence that your machine can handle anything thrown at it and won't fall out of the sky inverted lol

Re-entering the atmosphere...

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11-22-2006 03:50 PM  11 years agoPost 18
RhelipilotC

rrNovice

Oahu, Hawaii

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I do not need the CP to learn how to fly. The new CP supposedly uprights the heli if need be. The last major crash I had, I was hovering inverted when the heli got away from me and panic set in and lost stick to heli orientation (was up down? left right?) and a simple flick of the switch might have saved it. Now when I am flying, I fly up to a height where I am comfortable with trying a new move, but am reluctant in fear of losing the orientation. It is not that I do not know how to do it, its just getting passed the "what if"s

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11-22-2006 05:33 PM  11 years agoPost 19
Rick_H

rrKey Veteran

Boulder City, Nevada

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Better watch out, CP users may become as addicted as Gyro users have. Very few Gyro users have ever been able to break the gyro habit. And they have managed to infect all the newbie's out there. Just a word of warning for all you CP users out there. LOL

Rick

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11-22-2006 08:21 PM  11 years agoPost 20
JerryLu

rrApprentice

Gretton, Northants - England

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Well, in the past I promoted the use of the CP without any experience of it. Seemed to me to be a good idea. Then I had 4 crashes earlier this year and decided to try the CP I got my lad but he never fitted - learns too fast

Well, I have taken it off again because I did not like the effect it had on me Sceadu.

I set it up as bail-out, only coming on with a switch and it would work like magic, though I only tried it from a steep dive. Flick the switch and it was level in a second.

However, even switched off, the CP retains 5% control of the servo's (I checked with UK agent - Aurora). I use a CPM receiver and fit the necessary filter but the result is that the CP is continuously tweeking the servo's and in a stationary hover the heli was twitching too. Further it slowed response and I further lost confidence in my flying. I took it off and feel much more comfortable. I just hope I won't regret not having that bailout switch

Jerry

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HomeAircraftHelicopterMain Discussion › FMA co-pilot for learning 3D
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