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09-09-2006 02:34 PM  14 years ago
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jaylad

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wolves ,england

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eco 8 which brushless ?
can someone please suggest a motor for me,i want to run in gove mode about 1600/1700 rpm,so please someone give me a clue as to motor and pinion.
i see others used the motor i have(phasor 30-3,23 tooth pinion) but mine must be bust or something as it only has 1500 rpm total which meens i would have to run about 1200/1300 head speed at hover so there would be some left when you give it some pitch,please help
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09-09-2006 06:06 PM  14 years ago
Brett Sumpter

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Roswell, GA

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You're missing the big picture - your rotor rpm depends on more than just the motor itself, battery voltage & pinion size matter (and so does the load you're placing on the motor & battery).

So you need a motor that's geared correctly for the amount of voltage you're using to give you the desired headspeed, and the motor & battery also must have enough power to keep it there under load. The amount of load also depends on what type of flying you're wanting to do...

There are numerous combos that'll do the above, including using your existing motor - what's best will depend on your particular situation. What kind of flying - basic hovering & circuits, or 3d? How much are you willing to spend, and what's the remainder of your current setuo now (batteries, charger, ESC?) What kind of batteries are you using now or do you plan on switching to?
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09-09-2006 08:24 PM  14 years ago
helicrazi

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Beaumont, CA.

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with the phasor 30-3 you would have to go 4s to get the head speed up, if you want to go 3s need a differant motor, I have the same motor and 3s 24t, I was trying to decide, motor and or go 4s, just order'd the ikrus H 8 and stay 3s, packs are cheaper and I already have one, and I want to get another pack and less out of pocket.
two 4s packs = 324
mtr and 3s = 243
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09-09-2006 09:23 PM  14 years ago
jaylad

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wolves ,england

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the battery i have at the moment is a brand new flightpower EVO20 3s1p 4350mah,and the esc is a cc p60,the heli itself is carbon frame,boom and blades with a full ali head.i have just moved up from a zoom so this is a bit bigger for me and to be honest i am hopeing it will help me learn a bit more(not had a flight yet).dont want to do anything 3d or the like just general flying and hovering,its also much cheaper to change the motor than the battery
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09-10-2006 02:45 AM  14 years ago
mjdee14

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Nashville , TN

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motor...
http://help.mcaprint.com/brian/pinion.asp

here is a web page that helps figure out what pinion it takes for certain head speed...

I'm currently using megga 22/20/4 with an 18 tooth pinion on 3300 10 cell nimh batts. The head speed is about 1500 and it flys real well.

http://www.megamotorusa.com/ see mega website

http://www.ikarus-modellbau.de/onli...59ff67.30019612

check out the specs on the H8 motor also

AS said in the other post there are several things you need to consider.... the same motor with a different winding will give a different KV value and therfore a different head speed with a certain voltage.

pinion = target RPM X main gr teeth/KV/volts/.8

1500 X 180/1480/12v/.8 = 19 tooth

Play with the link above and you can try different motors if you have the KV value.

just make sure the motor batts can handle the load....
Mike... Blade CP, HBCP2, Revo w/belt drive, Zoom 400, Eco 8, Hurricane 550, DX7 2.4
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09-10-2006 03:12 AM  14 years ago
helicrazi

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Beaumont, CA.

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jaylad,
Like I said I have the same motor and I run a 24t H/S 1550 and for learning it's fine, I'm just now wantin to step up you might try it, I'm not running in gov. mode, it dose fine for just basic FF it's a good setup for learning. IMO
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09-10-2006 11:25 AM  14 years ago
jaylad

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wolves ,england

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i want to use around 1500-1700 at hover in gov mode ,so this motor aint going to do it, so new motor needed
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09-10-2006 01:50 PM  14 years ago
Brett Sumpter

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Roswell, GA

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With a bigger pinion it will - as long as it's not getting too hot anyways. I haven't used that particular one myself but plenty of others have...worst case you can swap the motor but a pinion is a cheap thing to do first.

I'm running closer to 1400 rpm personally, using a Mega 22/20/3 - I can get more rpm but I don't need it for just flying around, it's more efficient at the lower rpm. I'm also running the asymmetrical blades, which give more lift but of course would suck if you plan on flying inverted
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09-10-2006 07:08 PM  14 years ago
helicrazi

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I'm running the 24t, and couldn't find a 25t pluss don't think I could set mesh without DR, Dremel, and motor alreadi on the warm side, Bret your right head speed is just fine for flying around, I orderd the H-8 it should work out fine, @ 1500 kv, instead out 1200 kv with 3s pack's I should have a lot more options.
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09-11-2006 01:21 PM  14 years ago
jaylad

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wolves ,england

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the info that came with the p60 esc said you should gear the head speed to what you want at 70% stick, by changing pinions,in fixed end point mode, and then switch to gove mode, and straight line the graph at that head speed,thats fine, but with the 23tooth pinion and my 3s lipos i only get about 1200/1300 rpm at 70% stick and think the 24 tooth would only bring this up a little bit.see here- heli basic setup- http://www.castlecreations.com/down..._beta_info.html
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09-11-2006 03:24 PM  14 years ago
helicrazi

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Hi jaylad,
I'm useing the same setup exept w/ 24t, I'm not useing gov. mode, useing Helicopter Fixed Endpoint is for fixed pitch helicopters and collective pitch helicopters when a manually set throttle and pitch curve is used on the transmitter. this work's fine. I have seven electric helis setup like this and they all work great !!! includeing a Raptpr, T Rex 6000, Logo 10 Eco 8 T Rex 450, Humming Bird 3d pro abd a Bldae CP, I don't fly hard, but others that help me do and this work's fine even for 3d, my setting's for the Eco 8
throttle are, -10/70/100/100/100 this is in normal mode, in mode i
we set the bottom up so it dosen't go in to startup when doing stall turns mode 1: 45/70/100/100/100 I also setup mode 2 the same incase I hit the switch by mistake.
jaylad I may play around with Gov. mode but so far this is working great. why not try it first since you have every thing, then if you don't like it get a differant motor and go for it.
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09-11-2006 07:26 PM  14 years ago
Brett Sumpter

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Roswell, GA

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How much the headspeed goes up when you change the pinion is just basic math, there are a number of online calculators that'll tell you as well. I've used this one with reasonable results:

http://www.e-helis.com/helicalc.php/

Keep in mind that 70% stick isn't always the same thing as 70% actual throttle, every radio brand is different & it'll change depending on your exact endpoint setup too. Your setup should be getting far more rpm than that, your "70%" definitely isn't...

Don't be afraid to play around with governor mode if you've got a tach - if you can get the desired rpm without the red light on the controller coming on (which means full power), try flying it. If it's not bleeding down much or at all & your motor + batteries aren't overheating you're good to go.

I use governor mode on mine, with a CC45 - works fine, depending on which firmware. There were a few versions that did odd things...
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09-11-2006 07:57 PM  14 years ago
jaylad

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wolves ,england

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let me get this then---you set the end points so that 1st the esc will arm at btm stick,2nd it shows a full on red LED on the esc at full stick to show full throttle(as per castles instructions) BUT do you have to set the full throttle end point with the motor connected ? if you disconnect the motor you just get the flashing LED to say that start up has failed and you can not set the end point
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09-11-2006 08:11 PM  14 years ago
Brett Sumpter

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Roswell, GA

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I didn't mess around with fixed throttle at all on mine - I knew what rpm it should be capable of given my motor, pinion, and battery combo (from both other people's reports & doing the math) & just set the throttle percentage in governor mode where I needed to get that rpm. Ended up being around 85% throttle for me, but as I said that can vary a bunch depending on your setup.

I've got a 3 different throttle curves set up - one that's "normal" (0-25-50-etc only used for starting & shutting down) & the other two with flat throttle curves for constant governed rpm.

Much easier than mucking around setting pitch & throttle curves like in the old days on gas motors
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09-11-2006 08:47 PM  14 years ago
jaylad

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wolves ,england

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this is the info i am following but dont know if you have the motor connected while setting full throttle end point ?

Helicopter set up basics
To get your electric helicopter to fly well and for the new helicopter throttle settings to work properly you need to set your helicopter up correctly. The Heli Throttle types will not compensate for an improper system set up and you may damage your motor, your ESC or your batteries. To make sure your helicopter is set up correctly start with ‘Heli: Fixed Endpoint’ mode. In ‘Heli: Fixed Endpoint’ adjust the endpoints on your transmitter until the system will arm with the stick in the bottom position and the red LED comes on solid on the ESC at full throttle (Solid red LED means full throttle on the ESC). This gives you a full throttle range on your transmitter which assures that your throttle percentages will be correct. Now set the heli up to get the head speed you want at about 75% throttle in ‘Heli: Fixed Throttle’ mode. Gear as needed to get the desired headspeed at 75% throttle on you transmitter. Set up like this your motor will be running within its efficient operating speed with enough headroom that the motor can maintain this speed with hard collective use. Gearing here is the key. Once you get the headspeed you want at about 75% throttle in ‘Heli: Fixed Throttle’ mode your helicopter will fly well in either ‘Heli: Fixed Throttle’ or in one of the governor modes. If you decided to use the governor adjust your throttle curve to a straight line that gives you the same headspeed as you got at 75% throttle in ‘Heli: Fixed Endpoint’ mode. Start with Heli: Governor Low’ If you cannot get this headspeed in ‘Heli: Governor Low’ go to ‘Heli: Governor High.’ If the heli is set up right in ‘Heli: Fixed Endpoint’ mode it doesn’t matter what throttle % gives you your desired headspeed in governor mode.

If you can’t gear to get the headspeed you want at about 75% throttle in ‘Heli: Fixed Endpoint’ by gearing you need a different motor or battery voltage. If you cannot get the headspeed you want at about 75% throttle in “Heli: Fixed Throttle’ your helicopter is not set up right and will not work in correctly in ‘Heli: Fixed Endpoint’ or either ‘Governor’ Modes
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09-12-2006 04:06 PM  14 years ago
helicrazi

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Beaumont, CA.

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installed the H 8 motor w/ 22t pinion last night, wasn't able to tach it, but H/S is up, feels like around 1700 I'll fine tune it this weekend, temp's are great, mtr. 121* Esc 106* battery 111*
she's very snappy and responcive so with this I can go up two more 23t/24t if needed, I'll also put logger on and get amp/watt's draw ect.
jaylad I use the castle link for setting esc, I think when setting up w/ TX motor is conected, main blades off, make sure in setup mode !!! but not sure haven't setup without link in a long time. the link makes it so easy.
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09-12-2006 10:26 PM  14 years ago
jaylad

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wolves ,england

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all done at last got everything set up using gove and 1400rpm and it flys,proper test later on ,thanks for the help
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