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Home✈️Aircraft🚁HelicopterHelicopter Main Discussion › Anyone tried the real thing?
09-07-2006 02:48 PM  14 years ago
GASMAN

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ROCKLEDGE, FLORIDA

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Hi,
I'm currently in training in the Schweizer 300cbi, and you can read all about it at the ollowing site:

http://www.scalerchelis.com/forum/i...=15&#entry65250

Later,
Eddy
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09-07-2006 03:37 PM  14 years ago
Donovan Dow

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Barrhaven Ottawa Ontario Canada

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💎Sustaining Member
Morning All

Tried the " real thing" and did well. I am now sticking with the un-real thing.

cheers
don dow
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09-07-2006 03:38 PM  14 years ago
scott sr

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SEAFORD

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Has anyone tried one of those heli chairs that looks just like the seat of a real heli and the controls are the same also . The controls on the heli chair hook up to your radio and then you fly you RC bird from the likes of a real heli controls and seat .I don't know how close that would be but I bet it would be a blast to try . I forgot the website I'm sure you can Google it the only problem I think the price for the whole rig chair radio heli all the nuts and bolts was @ $4500.00 . I guess if a club went in for one it would be OK but to get one on your own that's a little steep . Happy FlyingScott Sr. ><> ****Support Our Troops**** ><>
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09-07-2006 03:39 PM  14 years ago
moorecj98

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na

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The Schweizer 300cbi Is a great choice for a trainer i have around 600 hours in all the 269 and 300 series. The 300c with a governor is a dream to fly but i think $12,000 for a governor is a little high
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09-07-2006 04:11 PM  14 years ago
Dennisu

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Langley, B.C. Canada

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I have a fixed wing licence but after buying a couple of R/C heli's I purchased my own turbine ship. The fact that an R/C heli flown tail in simulates the effect of piloting a full scale ship convinced me to go full scale. Had to remove the gyro to give the full effect but it made it a lot easier to make the transition. It is actually harder without the gyro than in a full scale ship as your body will give you the clues about your yaw in full scale instead of relying on your eyes as in R/C. I will go out on a limb here and say that anyone who can fly R/C heli can make the transition to full scale easier than they think. Now the reverse is not true as I have tried with a couple of friends with full scale ships and they have a heck of a time trying to get their head around R/C flying.
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09-07-2006 04:26 PM  14 years ago
NitroPolymer

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Southeast Florida

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The perspective is different, as well as the necessity of using the anti-torque pedals. The gyro in our models masks much of the interaction that occurs between control inputs.
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09-07-2006 08:13 PM  14 years ago
jschenck

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La Vista, NE.

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With a full size ship you ARE the gyro! more specifically, your inner ears.

I got to fly in a Jet Ranger this summer and was pretty sure that with a bit of time and a competent pilot ready to grab the stick I could fly/hover it. I didn't dare ask since my family was in the back and it was JUST a tour ride. If it weren't for the money thing, I'd really like to go for a PPL/heli rating.
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09-07-2006 08:32 PM  14 years ago
Mattiward

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160ft off the deck 10ft from 400,000 volts - U.K.

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The gyro in our models masks much of the interaction that occurs between control inputs.
I agree - next time I have my Rappys out to play i'm gonna fly out of heading hold as I did when I was learning, to see if it brings a more realistic feel.

I've had quite a bit of sticktime and have decided to take the plunge and start to obtain my PPL (h).

R/C is loads harder than the fullscale machines. Mind you I don't half concentrate more when my bum is "x" amount of feet off the deck.
The part of full scale I am struggling with, is the transition from forward flight into the hover - you really apreciate what the vertical tail fin does in FFF & how our 601's mask any requirements of rudder input when we are flying feet firmly on thr ground.

Regards

Matti


http://www.hambleton-helis.co.uk
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09-07-2006 08:44 PM  14 years ago
bscfo1

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Tampa, Florida - USA

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Went up in an old Hiller FH 1100 Helicopter and the pilot let me take the controls. Flying straight and level, it felt very stable, and it needed very little inputs. The sensation of lift is very different from a fixed wing aircraft. It almost feels like your hanging rather that flying. And the slight yaw going back and forth feels like you're slipping through the air.

With decent forward speed even the tail stayed right behind me though. Very gently, I tried my first banking turn. I instinctively did what we all do with our models when we turn in fast forward flight, which is a lot when you think about it. The helicopter responded by pitching up and slowing down. So the pilot, who was covering the sticks but not interfering, put it back into staight and level flight. I said "this is different." He said "just put it into a bank, you won't need much back pressure to maintain altitude and bring the nose around."

I said "OK" and did like he said and made a nice banking turn. Really cool, AND a little scary without the doors in place.

I'm sure he helped me, but he assured me that flying an RC model was a lot harder. He was being modest of course, heli pilots have great skills.

Didn't try to hover, I didn't want to completely freak out my wife and our friend, they were in the back seat white knuckled, holding hands!!!!
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09-07-2006 10:17 PM  14 years ago
Garry s

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Brighton, England

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Spent 7 years (95 - 02) flying in a full size (fixed wing) formation aerobatic team. Came 2nd in the 1998 FAI World Championships in Switzerland. Have flown both full size and models in one guise or another more or less since I was a kid - starting gliding when I was 10 - but quit full size flying in 2002, returned to model heli's a few months ago.

Never had a full size heli licence but have had a few hours stick time on various types, including some lessons. I agree with all the posts above, greater stability of the full size and always looking in the right direction helps, not having a gyro means you are much more aware of the interaction of different control inputs.

On the subject of which is more difficult, I think that in terms of basic handling, getting information about what the aircraft is doing and having a set of guidlines to follow, full size is less challenging than the models. However aircraft handling is ony a small part of full size flying, weather and navigation are really the issues, so the comparison breaks down there.

I do think that the talents of the 3D model heli flyers and full size aero pilots are definitely comparable, although pulling 5g at 200 mph in real life 100 feet above the ground is an experience to remember (to be honest, I'm glad I quit, I'd had enough....)
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09-08-2006 03:43 AM  14 years ago
LanceMD500E

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Savannah, Georgia USA

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I remember how great I felt when I soloed in a full-scale Piper Cherokee when I was 16. I felt WAY better when I soloed in an r/c trainer when I was 30. It was way harder to fly an R/C plane than full-scale, so I`m sure it`d be the same with helis. After flying R/C helis, you`d probably be able to crash a full-scale heli with lots less damage...
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09-08-2006 05:56 PM  14 years ago
CCW

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SGP

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R/C does help for sure. I trained on a Bell 47G2 some 20+ years ago and was the only student pilot who under-controlled the heli. I was landing on a dolly after abt 12 hrs of flight time.

One thing for sure, autos (whether full or with recovery) and decending with power sure is tougher on the heart than with a model.

Have fun.
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09-08-2006 09:25 PM  14 years ago
bigglesbutler

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Aberdeen, Scotland

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I must confess I dont have the time or patience to read everyone's posts above, SORRY.

I was 12 when I got my Shuttle for Xmas, and I was 21 when I got my PPL. I then went on to get me commercial license and got a job on the north sea.

Yes flying visually is easier after flying models, I hovered a R22 within 30 mins of ever getting in a real heli. But when you come to the other factes of commercial life, IFR (flying only on instruments) and fuel/load planning etc it is less usefull. If you can fly model helis, AND play video games well then you are well on your way to being a north sea driver. You just need the mental agility and flexibility to finish off the skills needed.

Good luck
Si
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09-09-2006 01:27 AM  14 years ago
B.Hofferth

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walkerton in.

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the real thing
well after flying choppers for almost five years and taking two helicopter tours i decided to go take a lesson this evening. just got back from flying an enstrom, and all i can say is that i couldn't believe how lathargic the controls were! i could fly it but i always felt like i had no real control like i do with the rc stuff. had a great instructor with 1000hrs+ on this machine so he let me have a hand at hovering 5ft off the deck with full control and let me tell you what using your feet for t/r control plus cyclic control used up my brain like trying to fly for the first time! don't get me wrong i did fly this thing but it wasn't easy. im glad that i went into this with very little gloating about my rc experience, although it was mentioned a few times before we flew. i have no doubt my rc experience helped me fly, but i must admit i think i need at least one solid hour of hovering before i can reprogram my brain for the full size thing. if you have been wondering about trying you must go do it that way you will no for sure what its all about. cant wait to get back up in the air with full size and rc! brian
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09-11-2006 05:38 AM  14 years ago
AH-1 pilot

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Tampa, Florida

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full size
Models planes and helis can to a point for sure, when it comes to control inputs/reg for certain maneuvers. Full size aircraft require many..many more procedures and aircraft limits,procedures ... to learn. Models, I feel are harder to fly, mostly do to orientation...that's for sure! I like to think my days as a kid, flying my rubber band prop jobs, cox control line gas planes, rockets, gliders, RC helis and planes, has all contributed to my success in my military days as Army heli pilot and fixed winged private pilot.

Michael
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09-11-2006 02:14 PM  14 years ago
GASMAN

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ROCKLEDGE, FLORIDA

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I agree, currently I own and fly an ultralight amphibian and all hand eye coordination activities help to hone your skills in the full size.

Later,
Eddy
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09-12-2006 12:20 AM  14 years ago
AV8TOR

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Fort Worth, TX

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In the 80’s I flew Minature Aircrafts Heli-Boy for a year. I was already fixed wing instrument rated with 800 hours at the time. I joined the National Guard and started flying OH-58’s (military Jet Ranger). Probably my fixed wing training helped much more. I could hover the RC very well yet it took 6 hours to get it right with the real thing. There is a lot of delay in the controls you need to get used to. When you drift you need to give input and take it out right away. No gyro in the real thing and it takes you some time until the hands and feet work as one. 3 months later we were flying NOE(what a rush).
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09-12-2006 12:43 AM  14 years ago
Heli Bob Old

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Chesapeake City, MD - USA

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I have been a full scale fixed wing pilot for 37 years and have been flying model airplanes for longer than that.

I had an opportunity to fly and Enstrom about 18 years ago, before I had ever flown a model heli. First the owner had me hover it in ground effect. He worked the collective and power and I worked the rest. It felt like the heli was balanced on a big ball and wanted to roll off in every direction. Controlling yaw was not too hard except that in combination with the cyclic it felt like I was trying to hop on one foot, chew gum, whistle dixey and rub my belly all at the same time. Forward flight was much easier, a lot like flying a fixed wing, although he was still handling collective and power. At this point I could feel an addiction that I cold not afford coming on.

Later, after several years of flying model helis, a friend bought a Hughes 500C. This one had a governor, so power managed itself as long as you kept the transmission load within the limit shown on a gauge (by not pulling too much collective). This time I could comfortably hover and fly the heli with no assistance other than verbal. What a blast!

The Hughes is a lot more heli than the Enstrom, but I'm sure that the big difference was the model heli experience acquired in the intervening years. FWIW. Bob
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09-12-2006 09:27 PM  14 years ago
felix12

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Wales, UK

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I fly the bo105 offshore version, and a bell 212. I flew the full size first and only got into rc because it was harder. I imagine many of the skills are transferrable really, except its easier always facing the way you are going!
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09-21-2006 04:07 AM  14 years ago
GASMAN

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ROCKLEDGE, FLORIDA

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Hi all,
Today, I completed flight training session #5 in helicopter Schweizer 300CBi, N 17915 and logged 1.4 hours, bringing my total to 6.1 hours.
Today’s flight instructor was Steinar Wang.

For today’s session, we stayed at the airport to do hovering, takeoffs, landings, flying the pattern. We staged at spot #2 ( that’s right …the pink spot marked with a 2 in the center).

Steinar took off and hover taxied to spot #2. Once there, I flew the remainder of the session. I hovered, did pedal turns, landed, took off, hover taxied to a spot and landed tail to the wind, took off hovered side to the wind and landed in that attitude. I hovered backward. From a stationary hover, I got tower clearance, then took off to fly a right hand pattern, approach and landing. I did this six times with four standard approaches and two steep approaches. Then from a stationary hover, I got clearance from the tower to hover taxi across the runway, down a taxiway to the helicopter parking area. I hover taxied to a taxiway, pedal turned to line up with the yellow stripe down the center. When I reached the row where our pad was, I pedal turned 90 degrees, and hover taxied down the yellow stripe. There were helicopters parked on each side of the taxi lane and I stayed right on the yellow line until I was even with our landing circle. I pedal turned 90 degrees then hovered to the landing circle and made a nice gentle landing right in the middle of the circle.

YEAH BABY!!!

We went through the cooldown/shutdown procedure and I went in to pay for this magnificient experience.

I had no problems with any of the hovering, flying, approaches, landings or
takeoffs. I feel real good with being able to control the helicopter and having no significant problems in doing so.

I will end my training here and pick back up for more sessions when I get close to finishing my XEL.

Later,
Eddy
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