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Home🌌Off Topics🌌Off Topics Main Discussion › Allah or Jesus ?
07-21-2006 07:20 PM  14 years ago
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2slow

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Allah or Jesus ?
This is a must read -- it is short, but Very Informative!The Muslim religion is the fastest growing religion in the United States, especially among the minority races! I wonder if they know this about it?

Allah or Jesus? by Rick Mathes

Last month I attended my annual training session that's required for maintaining my state prison security clearance. During the training session there was a presentation by three speakers representing the Roman Catholic, Protestant and Muslim faiths, who explained each of their beliefs. I was particularly interested in what the Islamic Imam had to say.

The Imam gave a great presentation of the basics of Islam, complete with a video. After the presentations, time was provided for questions and answers.

When it was my turn, I directed my question to the Imam and asked:

"Please, correct me if I'm wrong, but I understand that most Imams and clerics of Islam have declared a holy jihad [Holy war] against the infidels of the world. And, that by killing an infidel, which is a command to all Muslims, they are assured of a place in heaven. If that's the case, can you give me the definition of an infidel?"

There was no disagreement with my statements and without hesitation, he replied, "Non-believers!"

I responded, "So, let me make sure I have this straight: All followers of Allah have been commanded to kill everyone who is not of your faith so they can go to Heaven. Is that correct?"

The expression on his face changed from one of authority and command to that of a little boy who had just gotten caught with his hand in the cookie jar. He sheepishly replied, "Yes."

I then stated, "Well, sir, I have a real problem trying to imagine Pope John Paul commanding all Catholics to kill those of your faith, or Dr. Stanley ordering Protestants to do the same, in order to go to Heaven! "

The Imam was speechless.

I continued, "I also have a problem with being your friend when you and your brother clerics are telling your followers to kill me." "Let me ask you a question. Would you rather have your Allah who tells you to kill me in order to go to Heaven, or my Jesus who tells me to love you because I am going to Heaven and He wants you to be with me?"

You could have heard a pin drop as the Imam hung his head in shame.

Needless to say, the organizers and/or promoters of the "Diversification" training seminar were not happy with Rick's way of dealing with the Islamic Imam and exposing the truth about the Muslim's beliefs. I think everyone in the US should be required to read this, but with the liberal justice system, liberal media, and the ACLU, there is no way this will be widely publicized.

Please pass this on to all your e-mail contacts.

This is a true story and the author, Rick Mathes, is a well-known leader in prison ministry.

Rex L. Davis University of Nebraska West Central

Research and Extension Center 461 West university

Drive North Platte , NE. 69101

308-696-6722 Fax: 308-532-3823
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07-21-2006 07:26 PM  14 years ago
rkeith2

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Norco, CA

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Excellent -

And might I add a short comment that mad men and people such as this get away with their madness because good men remain quiet and do not get involved.

It will all get corrected in the end but it can sure be scary on the way there.

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07-21-2006 07:45 PM  14 years ago
Rafael23cc

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This same article was posted on my office's bulleting board by an Egyptian Engineer that works for the company I work for.

Rafael
Keep your feet on the ground, but your eyes on the sky.
Team Heliproz.com
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07-21-2006 07:55 PM  14 years ago
Chem Geek

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07-21-2006 07:56 PM  14 years ago
Eury

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Horse $#!t, never happened, just more crap made up to make people hate others. There are sects of any religion that are violent and hate others. Should everyone hate me because I'm Catholic and my religion engaged in the Crusades? Whenever you read something that is over the top like that, go check snopes for validity.

http://www.snopes.com/politics/religion/allah.asp
Nick Crego

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07-21-2006 09:14 PM  14 years ago
Hoverdown3K

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now that is funny...-= I know there is Money in RC helicopters. I put it there=-
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07-21-2006 09:40 PM  14 years ago
helo_chris

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Before you go saying something didnt happen you might want to check for corroborating sources.

http://www.breakthechain.org/exclusives/rickmathes.html

http://www.charityadvantage.com/mis...llahorJesus.asp
"There is a fine line between cutting edge and bleeding edge.."
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07-21-2006 10:22 PM  14 years ago
Rafael23cc

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I do not like to get into religious debates, but I still have to add something.

I was in Iraq between April of 2003 and April of 2004. My unit trained 40 Iraqis to become fire fighters. As the months progressed and the situation in the Nation deteriorated, many of them decided not to continue working in their new field, because they were being paid for by the US Goverment. Their heads had a price if they continued working for us. WE did not see it that way. They were trained so they could stay working for the airport long after we were gone. But since they were working shoulder to shoulder with us in that timeframe, they were seen as helping the Americans, and FEARED FOR THEIR LIVES.

Now, that is not too different from the statement that started this thread. I saw it and lived it.

I do not care if that particular situation occured or not, I know what the thruth is.

Rafael
Keep your feet on the ground, but your eyes on the sky.
Team Heliproz.com
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07-21-2006 11:30 PM  14 years ago
Eury

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Whether it's true or not (I doubt it is, in fact, I'd bet money it isn't), I can tell you one thing. Religion, and the things done in the name of Jesus, Allah, or whoever else you want to intone is the single worst thing in the world today. Religion is crap. 99.99999% percent of it is made up and was written for the purpose of crowd control, and to justify things that could not be explained through the limited scientific knowledge of the day, and the brutal nature of man. Waging wars in the name of whatever deity you happened to be taught to follow is wrong, no matter what the higher powers in your religion, country, or group told you. It's wrong. It's wrong to hate others because they've chosen to follow a different made up character than you.

May as well declare war on Brazil because they don't watch Scooby Doo. It has the same level of validity as any religious war. Personally, I hate my neighbor because he dislikes Transformers, where I collected all the toys when I was growing up. It has EXACTLY the same validity as anyone hating Muslims or any other religion, it just lacks the centuries of history that the religious arguments have behind them.

If there IS a God (which I believe there is) He, She or It is horribly disappointed in any of you who follow the teachings and ideals that make you hate another group of people. I don't care what religion you've decided to latch onto, if you look down on Muslims and pass along ignorant, narrow minded racist views on them, you are disappointing whatever higher power there is out there. It's amazing to think that some of the people out there who think like that are parents and are teaching their kids that hate.

I'm sure I'll get some nice flames saying that I'm sacreligious and other wonderful things, but in the end, if I am deluding myself by believing in a higher power the way that years of torture in Catholic School taught me to believe (loving, forgiving, and kind father figure), at least I live a better life for it, minus all the preaching and hatred that some others have attached to a belief. Maybe SOME followers of some sects of Islam are violent, that does not mean that all are.
Nick Crego

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07-21-2006 11:39 PM  14 years ago
spaceman spiff

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Personally, I hate my neighbor because he dislikes Transformers,
Ahmen brother! Trasnsformers rule! lets kill all who disagree! plankers and Thunder Tiger guys too! then the world will be a better place united under the true toys!
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07-21-2006 11:44 PM  14 years ago
Tioli

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Chem Geek brought up a great web site: http://www.snopes.com

It's a great resource for all these types of urban legends, email chain letters, and what-not.

Whenever I get anything suspect in my email inbox, I check Snopes.
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07-22-2006 12:04 AM  14 years ago
cfranks

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It has to be a fake with a stupid comment like
as the Imam hung his head in shame
.

Charles
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07-22-2006 12:19 AM  14 years ago
helo_chris

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Did anyone actually look at those links? The second one is a link to Mission Gate Ministry, ie. Rick Mathes, the man named in the email. Though he refuses to comment further for fear of retribution he contends that the incident did in fact occur.

As far as passing on ignorant, narrow minded, or racist views, no one is advocating we start lynching Muslims. The intention of the article was to point out the obvious, which many people like to sugar coat and pass off as a small radical faction. If Islam, not Muslims, was a religion of peace and tolerance why do Hamas and Hezbollah hold seats in Parliament in several countries. Ever listen to anything they have to say? Im sure there are many Muslims who wish nothing more than to live in peace and not bother anyone, but that doesnt change the fact that we are at war, and not a war that we started. Do the majority of people not wanting it mean that the religion doesnt teach it? Not hardly, talk to the average follower of any religion, most have no idea what it really teaches. They listen to what they are told and dont know any better for it one way or the other. Those people scare me.

Declaring war on some one for religious reasons is one thing, but when you are attacked you have an obligation to what ever higher power you believe in to retaliate, for no other reason than self preservation. And as for those who bellow from the mountain defending the peaceful and tolerant religion of Islam, when was the last time a radical group of Baptists burned a Church of Christ? Or an Orthodox Jew chopping peoples heads off for being infidels? Stretching with those statements, absolutely. But thats my point, I think the man is just pointing out the obvious.

And Snopes is a great website for all that crap that people like to pass around, stuff annoys the crap out of me. But they dont always get it right. It is after all just subjective investigation.
"There is a fine line between cutting edge and bleeding edge.."
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07-22-2006 04:04 AM  14 years ago
Chem Geek

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And as for those who bellow from the mountain defending the peaceful and tolerant religion of Islam, when was the last time a radical group of Baptists burned a Church of Christ? Or an Orthodox Jew chopping peoples heads off for being infidels? Stretching with those statements, absolutely. But thats my point, I think the man is just pointing out the obvious.
I remember a bunch of nut job Christians bombing abortion clinics. Does that not count?
As far as passing on ignorant, narrow minded, or racist views, no one is advocating we start lynching Muslims.
No, but the email is obviously written in a way to promote Islam as evil and worthless. He hangs his head in shame and he was speechless after being bested by the obviously smarter and more righteous Christian leader. What a load of crap.
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07-22-2006 05:07 AM  14 years ago
Caliber1

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Allah or Jesus?

Darkness or Light?
Evil or Holy?
Lies or Truth?
Hell or Heaven?

There is only one way... as it is written

"I am the way, the truth and the life, no one comes to the father except through me" John 14:6

Only Jesus, no Budda, no Pope, no Allah, no Joseph Smith, can man be saved from the wrath to come.
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07-22-2006 05:17 AM  14 years ago
sharam

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I want no part of anything that will bring "wrath"!

I certainly want no part of anything that says, "believe in me or my wrath will kill you." Sounds like extortion - "pay me to protect you."
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07-22-2006 05:23 AM  14 years ago
Caliber1

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What you want and what you deserve are not the same thing.
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07-22-2006 06:30 AM  14 years ago
sharam

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Nonsensical statement.

Just remember that as strongly as you believe you are right in your beliefs re Jesus, there are at least a few billion people elsewhere who believe otherwise. And, just as strongly as you think the other side, "just doesn't get it", the other side thinks you "just don't get it."

It is pretty arrogant of either side to think they have the right and ONLY answer and that the only path to salvation is through their religion.
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07-22-2006 07:09 AM  14 years ago
Pistol Pete

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Seffner, FL

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The Muslim religion is the fastest growing religion in the United States, especially among the minority races! I wonder if they know this about it?
Caucasians are muslims?
~~Enjoying the hobby one flight at a time~~
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07-22-2006 10:39 AM  14 years ago
Eury

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"I am the way, the truth and the life, no one comes to the father except through me" John 14:6

Only Jesus, no Budda, no Pope, no Allah, no Joseph Smith, can man be saved from the wrath to come.
There's that ignorance and cultural bias again. While I agree with you, I don't come on here spouting it off and expect others to believe. You happened to be born in a culture that teaches that, to not recognize that you lack not even a shred of proof that you are correct, and that any religious discussion ultimately comes down to faith (no matter what religion it is) is ignorant, and arrogant. Comes right back to my previous statement (slightly modified), that you may as well say that everyone in Brazil is going to burn for eternity because you watch Scooby Doo and they dont.
Nick Crego

Citizen #0168
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