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Home✈️Aircraft🚁HelicopterHelicopter Main Discussion › eCCPM, mCCPM,CCPM, non CCPM SWM HPM M&M S&M
07-21-2006 07:50 PM  14 years ago
GimbalFan (RIP)

rrProfessor

Big Coppitt Key, FL

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Logically or not, language evolves. It's human nature. To fight hard for correct usage is admirable but it's also mostly fruitless. English is one of the most illogical languages on the planet but it's the one most commonly used for advanced technologies, and it's a steep uphill battle because of this.

Be a warrior in this battle if it suits you Mr Shaw, but so far you're losing ground to common usage.
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07-21-2006 08:08 PM  14 years ago
shawgl

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Murrieta, CA

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DOUGLAS
That is funny

Me either.

Chaos and gimbal fan.... Funny thing about it is all it would take for me to start using it is for you to show me one "situation" where you have shed some light on some confusion about a control system by using those terms. That is all it would take and I would agree with you and say.....Hmm, I see that there is some confusion stemming from just using CCPM to refer to computer mixing so I should start specifying.

But you guys can't even talk inteligently about the control questions I asked you in reference to a fury. What basic settings do I need in my radio? What swash program?


You guys are awesome. Great help you would be to a newbe.

I will continue to read this for your replys however I am done proving that you guys talk a good game but can't even answer basic questions about control systems. So there is no reason you need extended acronyms to explaing the complex (scarcasm) controls of a raptor. Good on you for saving us all from using inaccurate terms.
In God we trust, everyone else we monitor.
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07-21-2006 08:13 PM  14 years ago
GimbalFan (RIP)

rrProfessor

Big Coppitt Key, FL

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you can't even talk inteligently about the control questions
Can't and won't are two different things. You're looking to prolong a pointless fight by making rude remarks -- not to have an amicable, useful discussion.

No more Throttle Cuervos for you, Mr Shaw. You've used up all your credit at the AB&G (Acronym Bar & Grill).
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07-21-2006 08:37 PM  14 years ago
Micro-Maniac

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Pasco,Washington Formerly: Captain Chaos

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This thread is about correct terminology - Informing people about the use of correct and incorrect terminology regarding mechanical CCPM - As the case was with you - That required proving mechanincal CCPM exists in the first place - Whether the terms actually help anyone solve issues with their helis is completely irrevevent to this discussion - People want to know why we use the various/extended acronyms and this is the reason - To not use incorrect terminology in referring to mechanical CCPM - Use the extended acronyms or not - I really care not - It would be nice if folks would quit using incorrect terminology for mechanical CCPM now that they are informed - But that's up to them and how they want their intelligence judged by the terminology they use - It's information - Use it or don't - But please quit argueing about nothing already - I'd like to stay subscribed to this topic in case someday someone has something intelligent to contribute to it - It was an interesting thread before the petty argueing - Now it just fills up my inbox with garbage.
I would not have jumped on Jeff Marquardt about his post at this point.
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07-21-2006 11:11 PM  14 years ago
shawgl

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Murrieta, CA

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THis is a little snip from the begining of this post by DKSHEMA.... It speaks volumes......
Explain what is being mixed, and how. Explain what is being mixed when only one control input is needed to affect the attitude of the helicopter.

Now, do the same for the "CCPM" machine, and explain how you can get an additional 5 degrees of collective without requiring more than one servo to move, the end result affecting ONLY the collective pitch.

Then explain the other two scenarios without requiring more than one servo to move.

Do this without redefining the term "mixing", or redefining the term "collective pitch". Mixing requires more than one input to change to affect the attitude of the helicopter.

The "m" and "e" designations as part of CCPM are artificial, and are retained by people who insist that mixing can occur with independent, non-related controls as in the "non-CCPM" set up.
What it tells me? That a VERY experienced guy has explained this crap to you over and over again. Along with many others and you still cannot understand that it doesn't explain sh1t when you add another letter. You haven't provided help or cleared up confusion for a single person on this forum by using your terminology.

So in closing.... And this will be my last post on here.

I know what you mean when you say eCCPM or mCCPM. Some new guy is just going to get confused because the products he buys are all labeled CCPM or not. So do the new guys a favor. Leave them alone and let the guys with some tact and good judgement teach them. And if they happen to ask for some help with their XTR or Blade CP and a raptor 50...... Feel free to jump in. That is your experience base anyways. By the way.... What is the Raptor on the post for in your gallery? I haven't seen that before. Seriously. Please share that one for me, orientation demonstrations or what? No scarcasm from me on that. Curious.
In God we trust, everyone else we monitor.
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07-22-2006 12:29 AM  14 years ago
hootowl

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Garnet Valley, Pa.

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The last heli I bought was labeled HPM Wolves don't lose sleep over the opinions of sheep
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07-22-2006 12:31 AM  14 years ago
Micro-Maniac

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Pasco,Washington Formerly: Captain Chaos

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Well somehow these names you keep dropping have made some impression on you that they are somehow the highest authority in model helicopter control and terminology etc etc etc - And since I haven't previously established myself as such for you - I'll will just be some stupid creditless moron that couldn't possibly be right about something if it makes them wrong about it.

Another personal attack or more name droppings and I'll just be unsubscribing to this thread or congradulate you on being the only person to ever achieve my ignore list - Think with your own melon for once or shut the hell up - It's wearing thin.
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07-22-2006 01:01 AM  14 years ago
shawgl

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Murrieta, CA

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Hoot, So you bought a Hirobo Good heli's. Never owned one myself but have flown a couple and built a Hirobo Cobra. Good mechanics. So HPM is what it said on the box right? I love marketing terms, they are catchy. I like.


Chaos,
Well somehow these names you keep dropping have made some impression on you that they are somehow the highest authority in model helicopter control and terminology etc etc etc
They pretty much are the authority in model helicopters.

I am just one along with thousands of others they have helped along over the years. I didn't say you were creditless, you just have continued to tell me how important it is to use correct terminology because the old terms cause confusion but you can't show me once where your "correct" terminology has cleared up someones confusion.

I have not personally attacked you in any way. How ever, I welcome the day that I get to meet you, we'll see if you tell me to shut the hell up I'm betting you won't.

I have however stated some of my personal opinions on your experience level. I have come to those conclusions based on your posts on this forum. Which show that you have are quite experienced with the hornet, CP, and XTR. We won't even talk about the Rappy threads. That is nothing personal, just pointing it out. This serves no purpose for me to argue this with you. I don't personally care what you call this stuff. I call a CP a sh1tbox but hey, I fly a Fury. Who cares. Compared to a fury a CP is a sh1tbox. You on the other hand telling the entire hobby that their terminology is jacked up is a little overboard. If people know what they mean when they say it.....leave them be. Dont' try to impose the "evolved" crap on anyone. If they ask for it and take it....so be it. If you pitch it and they buy it....so be it.... But I dont' have to listen to your propoganda and change my (or the whole hobby in this case) terminology because it's not technically accurate. Especcialy from someone that thinks a .37 is overheating from running too little pitch in a hover. HELLO RUNNING LEAN for one reason or the other.

By the way...... Remember I'm on thin Ice..... I will. Vegas funfly baby. I'm there.
In God we trust, everyone else we monitor.
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07-22-2006 01:07 AM  14 years ago
GimbalFan (RIP)

rrProfessor

Big Coppitt Key, FL

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this will be my last post on here.
You promised.
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07-22-2006 01:10 AM  14 years ago
shawgl

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Murrieta, CA

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I don't respond well to "shut the hell up" Sorry, You never answered the raptor on a stick question. That is interesting. Why?In God we trust, everyone else we monitor.
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07-22-2006 01:12 AM  14 years ago
GimbalFan (RIP)

rrProfessor

Big Coppitt Key, FL

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By the way.... What is the Raptor on the post for in your gallery? I haven't seen that before.
It was a beautiful, windless day at an empty field, and the 3/4" copper water pipe just happened to be in my car. Just a different angle on the same old shots. Plus the grass was tall that day so this let me see the whole machine. Say what you will about Mavrikk parts (I'd probably agree) but their LG is the only kind I buy.
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07-22-2006 01:24 AM  14 years ago
shawgl

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Murrieta, CA

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Cool little idea for pics, I did buy a lot of rappy parts from them when I started. Some good, some bad, but the gear is TOUGH.

Now..... Back to the war.... Man you should know....Don't trust the enemy I just infiltrated the wire


But seriously... I encountered numerous terms since I joined this hobby and due to my job I have found a bunch that just don't match up with full size. For one reason or another. Whatever you have to do to get the new guy to understand is cool with me. I have helped allot of guys and had hundreds of questions and the bottom line is getting guys to understand. Most of the time the KISS theory works. Unless you get guys like you two. KISS is keep it simple stupid. You guys like the "tech" side and more power to you. have fun with it. Just lay off with the telling everyone they are all wrong for using it.


That is my only point.
In God we trust, everyone else we monitor.
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07-22-2006 01:33 AM  14 years ago
GimbalFan (RIP)

rrProfessor

Big Coppitt Key, FL

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Just lay off with the telling everyone they are all wrong for using it.
And you'll do the same? Then fair enough.

But again, Shaw, I must point out that I wasn't attempting to convince you that your choice of terms was incorrect -- just that common usage will determine what terms are used, regardless of accuracy.

You've earned a couple credits at the Acronym Bar & Grill.

Enjoy.

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07-22-2006 01:33 AM  14 years ago
Micro-Maniac

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Pasco,Washington Formerly: Captain Chaos

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I know these people you drop names of and I know their experience and knowledge and I also know their opinions on this subject - None of us need you to tell me for them - They are great minds in this hobby and out but I don't have to agree with everything they think they know.

I also could care less about who you've helped how in other discussions - I haven't looked up any of your other posts to try and determine your credibility, intelligence or knowledge and helpfulness - I could care less about anything beyond what you bring to this specific discussion yourself - There is no prerequisite to possessed knowledge or understanding - I thought at first you had something new to bring to this discussion from the full scale world but it didn't seem to translate well to our models.

Most of my posts are in certain areas because I've long quite using the "Start Here" link and sifting through tons of junk I'm really not interested in and only browsing the areas I am interested in (such as main - off topics - 3D contest - simulators - electronics - bcp/cp2 - ms hornet).

I have not bothered to look up what specifically you fly and have experience with at this moment in time - Models pass through our possession like changes of underwear and matters squat to me.

I am not twisting anyone's arms to accept and use the terms discussed in this thread - I simply informed about the mechanical CCPM and the incorrect terminology associated with it - What anyone does with that information is up to those individuals.

I myself will use this terminology and explain it as necessary - You do as you please likewise.
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07-22-2006 01:44 AM  14 years ago
shawgl

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Murrieta, CA

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Agreed,
My searching for posts was directly related to statements made in this discussion. Mainly the claims of how important it was to use correct terminology to prevent confusion. Not to establish cred but to understand where and if a problem is out there and I'm contributing to the problem. It wasn't to dig up dirt, untill I was told to shut the hell up. Then it's personal.

Chaos, No hard feelings but you should take a look at some of your posts on like page 3 through 9. I went back and re read some to make sure I wasn't out of line. You were correcting people left and right and basically telling everyone they are jacked up by using marketing terms. Just like you told me I was.

To each his own. No hard feelings. Maybe we'll meet one day and you can investigate my eCCPM heli of the month. Hopefully an Aurora or Synergy by then, especially when I win the post count guess. This added about 400 to it.
In God we trust, everyone else we monitor.
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07-22-2006 02:25 AM  14 years ago
Micro-Maniac

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Pasco,Washington Formerly: Captain Chaos

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Looking back to the first post I can't believe this thread is only 1-1/2 months old - I thought you had dug this up from several months ago as it seems like an eternity to me - If you think that's bad you should look closer at some of my more half-cooked stuff from over a year ago - The more this subject is discussed the more evolved and refined my understanding and opinions become.

You seem quite a bit more mellow and rational to me right now and I rarely hold a grudge on anyone anyways - And not to start anything - But apparently as you don't put up with being told to "shut up" - I don't put up with what I perceived as personal witch-hunt/lynching type mentality/behavior or arguing beyond any effectiveness/usefulness - That's the time for all to go back to their corners and wait for something fresh to hatch.

Later
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07-22-2006 02:36 AM  14 years ago
GimbalFan (RIP)

rrProfessor

Big Coppitt Key, FL

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wait for something fresh to hatch.
I just laid an egg. Does that count or do I have to wait for it to hatch?
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07-22-2006 02:39 AM  14 years ago
Micro-Maniac

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Pasco,Washington Formerly: Captain Chaos

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Well - Most effective if it's fully hatched before dishing it out - But we could all help you cook it too.
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07-22-2006 02:43 AM  14 years ago
GimbalFan (RIP)

rrProfessor

Big Coppitt Key, FL

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Agreed -- but quite frankly, the more I look at it this one the less it looks like something that should be cooked.op-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-t
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07-22-2006 02:48 AM  14 years ago
shawgl

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Murrieta, CA

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The more this subject is discussed the more evolved and refined my understanding and opinions become.
Mine also, you know.. When I first started I said that it was CCPM or not. I understand your rationale but fail to see the usefullness of the "fixed acronym". And my rationale behind that conclusion was that I couldn't find any confusion that was cleared up by the "correct acronyms" whether it was by you or anyone else. That was what I was searching for, I had asked you guys to provide that information but never did. Sorry you percieved it as a witch hunt. That is my only issue with this. I just fail to see the purpose for it when it doesn't seem to have much real world use. Troubleshooting problems or otherwise.

The only thing it seems to be good for is a good LOOOOOOOONG thread.

speaking of eggs..... It's breakfast time in Iraq fella's. I'm out.
In God we trust, everyone else we monitor.
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