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02-12-2006 02:25 AM  12 years agoPost 81
Apache Snow

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Northbrook, ILL

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Scooter Libby, Michael Brown, and Jack Abramoff start spilling their guts.


This week, special prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald revealed in grand jury documents that Libby testified that his White House superiors authorized him to disclose intelligence information to the media. One of the identified superiors is Vice President Dick Cheney.

Former FEMA director Michael Brown says his superiors knew a levee had broken the night Hurricane Katrina hit New Orleans.

"So for them to now claim that we didn't have awareness of it is just baloney," Brown said.

When asked about Jack Abramoff, who raised more than $100,000 for the Bush re-election campaign, the president said, "I don't know him."

"The guy saw me in almost a dozen settings and joked with me about a bunch of things, including details of my kids." Abramoff wrote in an e-mail. "Perhaps he has forgotten everything, who knows?"


Click Here to read about how the White house squashed investigation of Abramoff in Guam.

Libby, Abramoff, Brown sing like Birds

Libby Says 'Superiors' Authorized Leaks


Golly,, no wonder the White House won't release about a dozen of pictures of Abramoff with Bush.

Greed, Corruption, and Lies ,,, the foundation of the Republican Party
.

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02-12-2006 05:58 AM  12 years agoPost 82
JitsuGuy

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Tulsa, Oklahoma

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Helishop
Please don't bring Moore into this... He's a complete goon and does not influence me and how I view these topics.

I do agree with you about your phd comments. However, don't assume that it is just uneducated, untrained people who are asking questions in regards to 9/11, the war and Bush. I believe that site I posted does make some great points and I believe the data they use is credible.

J

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02-12-2006 06:10 AM  12 years agoPost 83
JitsuGuy

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Tulsa, Oklahoma

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From http://www.911st.org

Recently declassified documents show that in the 1960's, the American Joint Chiefs of Staff signed off on a plan to blow up AMERICAN airplanes (using an elaborate plan involving the switching of airplanes), and also committing terrorist murders against U.S. citizens on American soil, and then blaming it on the Cubans in order to justify an invasion of Cuba...

http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=92662&;page=1

The Northwoods document...
http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/news/2.../northwoods.pdf

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02-12-2006 06:13 AM  12 years agoPost 84
JitsuGuy

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Tulsa, Oklahoma

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n 9/11 why did he continue to read to those kids for over 5 minutes instead of being on the job after the second plane flew into the other tower? he already knew the first plane hit the tower and he continued to visit those kids! any leader with balls would have said excuse me i have to protect our people. so what if some kids may become alarmed.
And along those lines, if they knew the country was under attack, how did the Secret Service know Bush wasn't in any danger at a public elementary school?

Also, from http://www.st911.org

The Secret Service, which is highly trained to whisk the president away from danger and to a secure location in the event of a threat, breached all standard procedures and allowed President Bush to remain at a highly-publicized location for 25 minutes after it was known that the nation was under attack

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02-12-2006 06:35 AM  12 years agoPost 85
Stet

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Key Largo FL

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"authorized him to disclose intelligence information to the media. One of the identified superiors is Vice President Dick Cheney."

wopee dooo, you loons better come up with something better than that

notice libby was not accused of the crime of disclosing the "agent" because that in itself was not illegal, because she was not what the law covered. He's busted for lying to the grand jury, because he was so stupid he thought the press would fall on their sword

Now let's wait to see who gets busted for leaking the NSA wiretap information, that was a crime, unlike the Plame situation.

keepin' it real

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02-12-2006 03:28 PM  12 years agoPost 86
E J Atchison

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Winsted, CT USA

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JitsuGuy
Most of us CAN agree on some things, good. I wish more people would not take to heart as gospel much of the fiction created in Hollywood.
My oldest daughter (degrees from UNH and Berkley) is a believer in Left Coast thinking. The only Left Coaster in the family (thank god). I just love having discussions with her since when good old common sense is injected, she has no defense, yet she is so brainwashed thanks to the phd's and tainted info she has received via certain groups (some mentioned here) that she usually ends debate, since opionions, taken to be fact, can never overcome the real facts.

Just ask. Who makes the best heli? The one I fly of course! My truth based on my opinion.

I'll admit I'm not a great pilot, but I can hover with the best of them.

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02-12-2006 04:56 PM  12 years agoPost 87
Apache Snow

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Northbrook, ILL

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Jitsuguy,, start your own Thread on this 911 conspiracy!
"authorized him to disclose intelligence information to the media. One of the identified superiors is Vice President Dick Cheney."

wopee dooo, you loons better come up with something better than that
It's a crime to divulge Top Secret or Classified Information,, just talk to anyone who has or had a high level security clearance.
notice libby was not accused of the crime of disclosing the "agent" because that in itself was not illegal, because she was not what the law covered. He's busted for lying to the grand jury, because he was so stupid he thought the press would fall on their sword
How do you think they catch most criminals,, they're caught lying while giving testimony under oath. Evidently you've never pulled jury duty.


Is Bush going to give back the 100,000 dollars he got from Abramoff,, I doubt it.


Is Bush going to release the Pictures of him and Abramoff together in the White House,, I doubt it.


Is Bush or the Republicans going to call for an Investigation or Special Prosecutor to look into the sudden demotion of the Attorney investigating corruption and Abramoff in Guam,, I doubt it.


Is Bush going to release the e-mails the White House received during Katrina to the current Investigating Committee,, I doubt it.


Cover-up, stall, and denial,,,, the White House motto.
.

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02-12-2006 11:45 PM  12 years agoPost 88
JitsuGuy

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Tulsa, Oklahoma

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Sorry Apache.

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02-13-2006 12:28 AM  12 years agoPost 89
Stet

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Key Largo FL

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hey apache

my clearance status is not public

and you certainly do not carry one

maybe you should review the law and the job status of Ms. Plame before you show how foolish you are

If it were a crime to reveal her, would you care to explain to us why Libby was not charged with that crime?

keepin' it real

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02-13-2006 02:05 AM  12 years agoPost 90
Stet

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Key Largo FL

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speaking of Rush, Air America has to PAY for airtime in all the major markets, nobody even on the left listens to that drivel. So if it weren't for the Soros' of the world, this message parroted by fools wouldn't be on the air. And I am sure that even the wealthy anti-Americans like Soros will tire of the financial drain. Don't forget his monumental financial committment to unseat Bush in the last election (so much for campaign finance reform) failed. How much did he spend of his own money, 50M? Still failed.

Reagan won the cold war

Bush 1 won the Gulf war

What did Carter win?

One could say Clinton won the war against Serbia, not authorized by the UN, and at the behest of Albanian Muslim separatists (terrorists) who were being rightly exterminated. A war fought only by arial bombardment, with civilian and environmental casualties never revealed. But there were no protests against that war.

keepin' it real

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02-13-2006 02:46 AM  12 years agoPost 91
DOperchal

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Ft Rucker, AL

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Stet

Here is a counter punch

Wilson Won WWI

FDR & Truman won WWII

Truman won Korea

Kennedy "won" the Cuban Missile Crisis

So if you are going by wars won the Dems clearly take the cake.

MAY OFFEND PEOPLE

Peace through superior firepower

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02-13-2006 03:04 AM  12 years agoPost 92
Stet

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Key Largo FL

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Absolutely correct, and I totally agree. I was speaking more of the current living generation of democrats.

That was when the Democratic party was capable of leadership.

And surely there are some good ones still, Lieberman, Knighthorse Cambell, and I could come up with more if pressed, but it seems that they get pushed to the sidelines while Kerry, Dean, Hillary and Gore get all the limelight. I will even give a measure of credit to Finestein who seems to stand on core values instead of trends. Even Richardson of NM I find to be good.

I just want folks who stand for something, instead of standing for whatever is the opposite of what Bush is doing.

It would be nice if we could get back to that, and away from F-Bush and "republicans want to starve children and seniors".

The democratic party has been hijacked by the extreme left.

keepin' it real

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02-13-2006 03:29 AM  12 years agoPost 93
Apache Snow

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Northbrook, ILL

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maybe you should review the law and the job status of Ms. Plame before you show how foolish you are
So now you're an Expert on National Security Law??

You don't know what her status was, I don't know what her status was. Only the CIA does,, she was a CIA Agent for God sakes!! It's not up to You or Me or Bloggers or Libby or anybody to decide what her status should be or take the law and interrupt it any way we please.


Why don't you do this,, go to your local police department and ask them for the real names (not cover names) of NOT currently Undercover Police Officers who are in your area. Just tell them,, You Stet Lastname have decided that since their NOT currently Undercover,, their names should be published in the local newspapers or put on the Internet. That You,,, Stet Lastname has made this decision,, and yep,, this should be done. Go ahead,, see what kind of reception you get.
If it were a crime to reveal her, would you care to explain to us why Libby was not charged with that crime?
You have it fixed in your mind that Libby, Novak, etc are innocent,, this is a witch hunt as MAH has described it in the past,, nothing is going to sway you from that fixed view.

But,, I will use Martha Stewart as an example. Martha went to jail for Lying to Federal Prosecutor's, not for the crime of "Insider Trading" which she was involved in,, and latter admitted to. While under oath,, Martha lied,, it's called Perjury (covered when you went to law school),, because she was trying to cover-up the fact that she was involved and did profit from insider trading.


Libby Lied under oath,, he Perjured himself,, he made: " verifiably false statements under oath ".


Definition of Perjury http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perjury
.

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02-13-2006 03:43 AM  12 years agoPost 94
Stet

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Key Largo FL

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Hey Apache

Answer the question, why was Libby not charged with the crime of exposing a "CIA agent under cover"? Don't you think Fitzgerald would go for everything he can as his fundamental responsibility?

All of your looney blathering really means nothing, compared to what Libby was charged with.

And yes we do know her status, don't you read?

And yes indeed, he was charged with lying. This is really stupid on his part, since his leak was not even illegal in the first place. So if you lie to the Grand Jury, you get what you get, and I have no problem with that.

Now he says he was authorized to leak, which he was not charged with (duh), and he did not say he was authorized to lie. So given he was not charged, even if Cheney authrorized him to leak, still no crime on Cheney's part. Simple logic alludes you Apache.

Remember that Fitzgerals interviewed Plame's neighbors. Wonder why? It was not a secret, tenfold over. Game over, get the guy for lying. Just like Martha Stewart.

keepin' it real

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02-13-2006 06:00 AM  12 years agoPost 95
RCHeliJim

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Orem, UT USA

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How do you think they catch most criminals,, they're caught lying while giving testimony under oath. Evidently you've never pulled jury duty.
Actually most criminals are captured by the police, you know the people that actually work - most of the time the jury just proves the cops right



Go Fly, Have Fun!!
-Team Quick UK

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02-13-2006 12:35 PM  12 years agoPost 96
GrunHerz-JG54

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Village Mills, Texas

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VP Dick Cheney would like to invite any and all Democrats to a "quail hunting event" in South Texas next weekend!

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02-13-2006 03:43 PM  12 years agoPost 97
Apache Snow

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Northbrook, ILL

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And yes we do know her status, don't you read?
STET, so you're saying that you and other people had access to Valerie Plame's complete CIA Personnel File. and you knew exactly what her status was, her past assignments, and current assignments,, and everything.

WOW,, that's powerful stuff!!.

And from this information you, or you and other people, or other people,, determined that it was OK for Robert Novak to publish her name and identify her as an Undercover (but not currently undercover) CIA Agent.

You have to communicate this to the Grand Jury and Fitzgerald,, I'm sure they'll be impressed.
.

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02-13-2006 04:08 PM  12 years agoPost 98
Stet

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Key Largo FL

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Apache

it is pretty plain even for a simple person such as yourself

Actually, I don't need her file, her status was no secret

1) her status as a CIA agent was known to the public

2) she was not operating under cover

3) Fitzgerald did not charge Libby with the crime of exposing a CIA agent.

You might think you are smarter and more informed that everybody else, very obvious you are not. I don't need to communicate this to Fitzgerald, he already knows it, that is why he questioned Plame's neighbors. He actually did his homework. That is why Libby was not charged with that crime.

Furthermore, Joe Wilson, just like Galloway, is a traitor to his country as is his wife for sending him to Sudan for the express purpose of undermining our war effort. Wilson is also a liar, as he stated Cheney's office sent him on the trip, where it was actually his wife who did so (thus the leak). Finally, Wilson's statements upon returning were also lies as documented in the Senate Intel Cmte. report that was released to the public. The entire premise of the whole stink he created was false.

So wilson is a lying coward who hides behind his wife's skirt. Not unlike the rest of the leftist loons. You seem to respect proven liars like Wilson and Galloway.

Go get a big sign and hang out with the rest of the antisocial malcontents in Santa Monica. Nobody cares about your message, except that small community, and they mean nothing in the big picture.

Kinda like your posts. Annoying and meaningless. The perfect troll.

Go join Ramsey Clark in Bagdad, defending Sadaam.

keepin' it real

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02-13-2006 06:08 PM  12 years agoPost 99
divebomber

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California

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Apache Snow,
the overwhelming facts [that we are losing in Iraq] show otherwise,, and you believed him without question.
Really? What "facts" are those? Since they are so 'overwhelming', they should be easy to list.
Not one point in my original post was a lie or an exaggeration,, not one.
Not one, huh? I can't speak to whether any of them are 'lies', since I would have to know your intent. But, as for exaggeration - an exaggeration is a "distortion through overstatement". I think a 'half-truth' would be considered an exaggeration, at least to some degree. I would also say that inferance through partial information also qualifies as an exaggeration. But in the end, what was the point of your list of 'facts'? To try and make a point- that by your estimation, we are losing the war in Iraq.

Your original points:
- Every month 71 US Soldiers die in Iraq.
Incorrect. That's an average, so 71 soldiers do not die every month. Thus, an exaggeration. However, more people than that die in California each month in violence. Maybe we're losing in California too?
- To date 2,260 US Soldiers have died in Iraq. - 16,440 US Casualties
True, but what's your point? Around 55,000 died in Vietnam. Over 400,000 died in WWII. Should we talk about the Civil War or Korea?
- In 2005 Deaths of US Soldiers are up 25% from 2004
OK. Again, what's your point? Are you insinuating that this means we're losing? Again, you exaggerate. More US soldiers were killed in June 1944 than in March, April, and May of 1944. Yet, we managed to win WWII. More soldiers were killed in 1864-65 than in 1862-63, yet the union was preserved.
- The Terrorists are becoming more sophisticated and adapting cells phones to detonate their bombs.
Cell phones were used by the terrorists in Spain to detonate their train bombs. That occured over two years ago. Thus, they are not 'becoming more sophisticated' and again your attempt at deception through half-truth is uncovered. Could it be that the infrastructure improvements that the US has brought to the country has simply given another path to terrorism?
- IEDs are becoming more powerful, better concealed, and harder to detect
True, but again, what's your point? This is not a sign we are losing. The enemy always adapts and improves. Hitler launched some of his most advanced terror weapons in the final months of the war.
- In 2005 the number of IEDs used against US Troops and Iraqi Civilians doubled
OK. Let's assume this is a 'fact'. It demonstrates that the other means they have used have become less effective. Again, not a sign that we're losing.
- In 2005 Terrorists killed over 10,000 Iraqis, a 100% increase over 2004
... but a significant decrease from the 300,000+ that were killed by Saddam and his henchmen before we invaded. In that arena, we've already won.
- The recent elections firmly placed control of the Iraq Government in the hands of Shi'ite Muslims who are aligned with Iran
Not 'firmly placed' as you state, but in a shared power government. In your logic, one could say that the US's government is firmly placed in control of the Republicans. And although that may be your opinion, it certainly isn't 'fact'.
- The Iranian Government is aiding the Terrorists by helping them develop new weapons that are designed in Iran and shipped to Iraq
Show me the backup documentation for this. And even if it is fact, why aren't you concerned about their funding for Hamas? And are you making the point to attack Iran? How does this support your point that 'we are losing'?
- Terrorist Mastermind Abu Musab al-Zarqawi even though the subject of a massive manhunt for over a year,, is still free,, and planning more bombings, kidnappings, and assassinations
Hitler was the focus of bombings and assasination attempts also. Yet, we still won WWII. Maybe Ho Chi Min should've been targeted.
- To date the Iraq War has cost US Taxpayers $239,950,688,827
Again, what's your point? How does giving a dollar amount prove we're losing? How much does any war cost? Does that mean that we shouldn't fight it?
- The GAO projects the war in Iraq will eventually cost US Tax Payers over 1 Trillion ($1,000,000,000,000) Dollars
And the DAO (Divebomber Accounting Office) projects it will be less. It's a guess, not a fact. Again, what's your point? How does that support your defeatest position?
George Bush, the only President in history to call "Illegal Aliens", "Undocumen[quote]ted Workers",, right out of Orwell's - Ministry of Truth.
You might want to do a quick search on the 'Nannygate' scandals during Clinton's administration. What term did they use to refer to illegal aliens? You guessed it! "Undocumented workers". Maybe the true Orwellean aspect of this is the short term memory and the susceptibility to propaganda that you and others like you fall prey to.
I'm not the one filling up screen after screen about Bill Clinton,, who has been out of office for 5 years.
And we're still cleaning up his messes. As for 'filling up screen after screen about Bill Clinton", prove it. Sounds like another exaggeration.
You conveniently forgot to mention, Reid received the campaign contributions and as the law required he reported them. You're using "half-truths" to infer Harry Reid broke the law,, hhhmmmm,, that's called propaganda.
Nope. We're using the a current event to indicate that Reid is a hypocrite in this particular issue and you're being either a.) decietful or b.) a patsy by claiming that "95% of Abramoff's clients were Republicans" and that "Abramoff will do big damage to the GOP".
Rants ?? You must have me confused with someone else.
Are we reading the same posts??? Out of the box,, his first post,, MAH labeled me a "low life". Me angry,, no. I've run into people all my life like MAH,, if you don't see the world thru their tunnel vision,, doesn't matter what kind of sacrifice you've made,, in their eyes you're a "low life". I worked with a Republican electron judge several years ago who believed all Democratics should be lined up and shot. I asked him,, what if they were decorated War Heroes and had saved lives,, he never answered. A Democratic being a War Hero doesn't fit into their Myopic Vision,, only Republicans can be War Heroes.
Sounds like a 'rant' to me. Still trying to figure out what an 'electron judge' is, though.

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02-14-2006 01:19 AM  12 years agoPost 100
Apache Snow

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Northbrook, ILL

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Thanks for pointing out the incorrect spelling


In farm country there's a saying " You can't learn nothin, when your jaws a jackin. "

divebomber, STET, etc,,, keep jackin your jaws,, we learn plenty.
.

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