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02-07-2006 04:23 PM  12 years agoPost 21
Daniel Wee

rrVeteran

Singapore

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I see.. interesting.

So what you're saying is that there are in fact legit 450TH's out there which have different specifications. If the specs are true, the 2950kV motor is rated for 200W only whereas the 3000kV ones are rated for 300W. Or are you saying that the 2950kV/16.5A/200W rating is out-dated now although some still advertise using the old specs?

Daniel

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02-07-2006 04:46 PM  12 years agoPost 22
Ville Erkkilä

rrApprentice

Oulu, Finland

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Hello,

I am planning to buy 450TH from Germany. There is a picture in their homepage and it looks like JGF 450TH. This one is 2900kV. I e-mailed and asked if this is JGF 450TH. Their answer was:

"Hi,

JustGoFly is only an distributor and no manufacturer. The motor
comes from the same producer in Taiwan. We are the german
distributor for this motor type."

Maybe this will help.

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02-07-2006 05:29 PM  12 years agoPost 23
RV-4Mike

rrApprentice

San Diego, Ca.

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This confusion is why I asked about JGF in the other thread. I have a Max Motors (also packaged as Aurora) 400DH that I got from allerc. From what I've been able to determine it is exactly the same motor that JGF sells.

Not trying to bash JGF but some guys on here talk about his motors as if they are his own custom manufacture and if your 400DH/450TH comes from any other source it's a POS clone. I'd just like to hear the facts.

Also, some months ago when I was considering buying a Hummingbird Pro I was looking at a JGF motor (I think it was a 400F?). I noticed that his specs were different from what was published for the motor from other sources. He explained that he thought the motor was "underspec'd" and performed much better than the published spec would lead you to believe. So his website for that motor published his "as tested/measured spec". There may be some validity to this since many people find that these motors routinely exceed the spec performance. Look at trextuning resuls for these motors.

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02-07-2006 11:43 PM  12 years agoPost 24
Titan520

rrApprentice

Philippines

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Could it be that JGF had a higher requirement for quality control over their orders from their outsourced manufacturer? I mean it is possible.. I find the JGF 450TH great.. Though I am not concerned nor bothered to purchasing a generic version.. It's just that JGF for me gives some peace of mind. I am looking forward to quality after sales service from JGF in any case.

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02-08-2006 01:27 AM  12 years agoPost 25
NTM

rrVeteran

Lloydminster, Alberta, Canada

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I purchased one of the jgf450th clones from helidirect, believing I was getting the real deal.
There were no notes indicating it was not a jgf when I purchased it.
I spent a couple weeks trying to figure out why it didn't perform and was not working properly with my cc35 speed control until I stumbled across this thread. I immediately e-mailed Steve.

Basically I was told it was my fault that I ended up with the clone because jgf450th motors don't sell for the price he was selling them at .
Very shady.

I wouldn't have had a problem at all with shelling out the extra cash for an actual jgf450th, heck they're a bargain at $55, had I known I wasn't getting the real thing.

I'll not be purchasing anything from helidirect again, and definitally wouldn't recommend them to a friend.

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02-13-2006 06:11 PM  12 years agoPost 26
Vinnie Finn

rrNovice

Rochester, NY 14624

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Guys - I'm Vinnie from JustGoFly and would like to chime in on some misconceptions here. The clone does not come from the same manufacturer in Tiawan. Both motors do come from Tiawan, and I'm sure HeliDirect believes they come from the same manufacturer since they are likely communicating with the clone manufacturer. The clone wants them to believe they are the same motor, but obviously they are not. I can assure you they are not manufactured in the same plant, or by the same manufacturer, and are totally different motors.

The clone manufacturer contacted me over a year ago claiming they fired all the "old" team and they are now the new manufacturing team. So they are upto some really shady workings that HeliDirect is not involved in. They are simply passing along information from a company that is trying to deceive them.

I think you guys picked up on the Motor differences pretty quickly and are not easily mislead. I do spend a fair amount of my time telling individuals that the motor they bought is not one of mine so I hope the moderator will permit my posting this information. I have received notes from dealers who thought they were getting a good deal on the JGF 450TH and were sadly mistaken and stuck with a large stock of motors. We have modified our dealer program to enable them to better decide which motor to carry.

Ashley at T-Rex tuning is doing comparison tests of the 450TH's and will be a very good impartial judge of the performance comparisons of the two motors. I don't know if that review will address many of the failures demonstrated by the clone, but continued posts of issues will certainly resolve that over time.

Vinnie

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02-13-2006 06:37 PM  12 years agoPost 27
RV-4Mike

rrApprentice

San Diego, Ca.

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Vinnie,

The problem I have with this thread is that the impression given by several of the posters here is that if the motor being sold did not come from you it is a cheap knock off. The impression given is that you are the ONLY source for these motors. I dont believe that is true and it's a disservice to the other retailers who are selling quality product.

I bought my 400DH as part of a package deal with my Trex from allerc. Far as I can tell my performance is on par with the 400DH powered Trexs with JGF motors.

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02-13-2006 07:00 PM  12 years agoPost 28
Vinnie Finn

rrNovice

Rochester, NY 14624

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Mike,

I do not have an exclusive on all Skatty motors, although I do have an exclusive on the 450TH and was the very first distributor. I communicate with the manufacturer almost daily and was the reason we came out with the 400DF and 450TH. I am pretty in tune with what you guys want and heard that you wanted more power than the 400DH can provide for extreme 3D on the T-Rex. Although you buy from many dealers in the U.S. the motor is most likely coming from me. The only way you'd know this is if you ran into a problem and needed assistance. I handle support of these products directly. Outside the U.S. there are many dealers. The only exception to this is Balsa Products who still carries the 450TH as well - inside the U.S. and does not buy through me.

I hope this answers your questions. I have asked my dealers to post specific images of the product so you know it is not the clone and is a JGF 450TH. If your motors look like the ones I post on my web site - then they are most likely from the same manufacturer. There are some non-heli motors that would make that statement untrue, but for 400DH, 400DF, 450TH, 450F - that statement is true.

Vinnie

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02-13-2006 11:00 PM  12 years agoPost 29
NTM

rrVeteran

Lloydminster, Alberta, Canada

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I just ordered a 450th (with the 2.3mm shaft) directly from jgf, now I know for certain I'm getting the right motor.

Helidirect is wahing it's hands of this and putting the blame completally on the manufacturer of the clone and also on their own customers. There was no note differentiating the clone from the real thing for some time on their web site. People purchased these motors believing they were jgf motors. Very poor business practice, in my opinion.
I wasn't even given the option of returning the clone and kicking in a few more bucks for the real jgf450th.

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02-14-2006 12:54 AM  12 years agoPost 30
RV-4Mike

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San Diego, Ca.

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Thanks for finely clearing that up for me Vinnie.

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02-14-2006 01:17 AM  12 years agoPost 31
rcdaddy

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Singapore

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Vinnie,

How many teeth pinion do i need for the 450Th that has 2.3mm shaft size? is 9T ok?

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02-14-2006 05:00 AM  12 years agoPost 32
Vinnie Finn

rrNovice

Rochester, NY 14624

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RCDaddy, 9T on 4S(14.8v) is very good, but not on 3S (11.1v). Many of the Extreme Rc guys love the 10T on 4S, but 9T on 3S would be too low. 11T is as low as you should go on 3S. Most like the 13T for 2400-2600 RPM, based on your battery capability. The video posted with Kyle flying is 3S on 13T. I think the ideal pinion would be 14T, but I'm looking to you guys to keep me honest on this.

If you want larger pinions for your 2.3mm motor you can get a brass 2.3 to 3.17 (1/8" ) tube conversion. This was originally posted by Zoom and a great find. For all the conversion tubes you'll ever need - get them here:
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bi...=LXR823&P=0
or drop me a note on your next order.

If you're a 4S extreme 3D flyer - drop over to TRexTuning.com and click on forums and vote for your favorite 4S motor - Direct link here:
http://trextuning.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=3449

I'm very flattered that we're taking on some name brands. You guys are making the industry sit up and notice that a quality motor doesn't have to be super expensive.

Please be kind to your vendors. HeliDirect has done nothing wrong and is just stuck in the middle. We're one of many products they carry. Them carrying both 450TH's motors which simply brings to light the difference in the two motors.

Vinnie

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02-14-2006 05:23 AM  12 years agoPost 33
ShellDude

rrElite Veteran

East Coventry, PA

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I've got HeliDirect's non JGF 450TH and am quite happy with it in my Shogun with an 11T pinion.

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02-14-2006 07:26 AM  12 years agoPost 34
Daniel Wee

rrVeteran

Singapore

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Well, here's what's interesting now. After the debate about the different versions of the 450TH, I decided that to get to the bottom of it, I should get them myself to compare. Again, let me qualify that I'm NOT talking about the HeliDirect version that is so obviously different. I'm talking about the JGF and the MMM version here.

Today I got my JGF 450TH and at the first out look, it seems to be the same as the MMM 450TH. That was until I had them side by side and noticed that the top mounting plate design was different for the two motors. This is the blue metal part. I'll have to take some photos to show this. So too the bottom of the motor where the vents are, are also slightly different. The 6 holes are there but they aren't the same.

The number of poles and the gauge of wire used in the windings appear to be the same though and the style of winding on both motors appear to be similar on visual inspection.

Later I will weigh the two motors and will run some tests to see if they perform identically. I will get to the bottom of these motors (MMM and JGF) and we will know if they're the same.

Daniel Wee

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02-14-2006 03:21 PM  12 years agoPost 35
bwarkent

rrApprentice

Houston Tx

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As for helidirect, I purchased my 450th from them several weeks back. One of the motors said "JGF" in the part number. Both were labeled 450th though. I had to look closely. In the end I bought the Just Go Fly version. I don't think any blame falls on helidirect.

Vinnie, what head speed are you running with 9T and 4S??? Are you running it wide open?

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02-15-2006 05:43 PM  12 years agoPost 36
Daniel Wee

rrVeteran

Singapore

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Okay, I did some tests today and they JGF 450TH and the MMM 450TH appear to perform fairly identically. Although there are some minor variations in the end bell design, the performance does not seem to be affected.

I tached the 450TH on 13T at zero pitch and 80% on the ESC and was getting about 2400RPM thereabouts. As such, I think I can expect around this speed at 100% and 10 degrees pitch.

Have any of you tached the 450TH on 13T running 100% and 10 degrees pitch? What speed are you getting at full load?

Daniel Wee

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02-15-2006 05:48 PM  12 years agoPost 37
genexis

rrApprentice

SG

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i think the issue with 450th is the one from helidirect.

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02-15-2006 10:15 PM  12 years agoPost 38
Vinnie Finn

rrNovice

Rochester, NY 14624

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Danny,

The JGF 450TH has a few different names, so I wonder if your comparing two identical motors? The clone wars are with the 450TH that has the removable axle and ours. You might add another layer of confusion onto this topic unless you provide pictures and the links to where you purchased the two motors. Thanks for the initiative on the tests - I just want to be sure some don't read your posts as contrary to the main focus of this thread.

Vinnie

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10-12-2007 03:07 PM  10 years agoPost 39
stikflyer

rrNovice

Canada

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JGF 450th?
It is interesting that on the sheet of paper that was with the motor I received, the first sentence was " Thank you for puschasing Motor Max brushless motors" I don't think they are a clone just different resellers who are misrepresenting their motors to maybe help with sales.

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10-12-2007 04:18 PM  10 years agoPost 40
TomRex

rrElite Veteran

West Palm Beach Join Date: 12-28-2005

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Try Just Go Fly dot com

Ignorance is the absence of facts.Stupid is lacking the intellectual capacity to comprehend the fact

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