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Home✈️Aircraft🚁HelicopterHIROBOOther › EVO 50 Step 8 'Main Gear Installation' Issues
01-14-2006 08:57 PM  13 years ago
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AirFlex

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Danbury, CT

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EVO 50 Step 8 'Main Gear Installation' Issues
Dear All,

Finally putting my EVO 50 together...at step 8 'main gear installation' I have an issue/questions.

I have the gear assembly complete, but when I hold the shaft and rotate the larger gear (DTDS) there appear to be some friction/noise.

Is this something that is normal or wears in eventually? My concern is obviously that this will cause more resistance during an auto.

Also these other questions with regards to EVO assembly:

In general do you loctite all metal to metal connections (main frame bolt/nuts, setscrews, etc etc) even if it is not indicated in the manual?

Step 4:
The manual seems to suggest using loctite between the 19mm bearing and the bearing holder. The bearing holder is plastic and if i understand right loctite eats plastic. Should I follow the manual?

Step 5/8:
The main gear and counter gear don't seem to mesh well, when i rotate by hand they are noisy and lock up occasionally. How do you adjust the distance between the counter and main gear? The main gear is firmly in place by 3 bearing which are in the frame and the counter gear seems unmoveable as well as it is held in position by the bearing holders which are attached to the frame as well....any assistance/suggestions would be greatly appeciated.

Many thanks,
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01-14-2006 09:23 PM  13 years ago
mrNoodles

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Borlänge, Sweden

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Make sure you pull the head up when tightening the mainshaft lock collar, otherwise the gears can move and interfere with the frame.

You can use loctite on the bearing in the plastic holder if you want, I´v done without any problems.

The gearmesh isnt adjustable, make sure the engine isnt pushed to high up towards the frame. Shouldnt be any problem with the pre-designed distance.
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01-14-2006 09:49 PM  13 years ago
AirFlex

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Danbury, CT

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Just rotating the gear by hand slowly causes them to lock up after a turn or so...maybe i should pull the gear back out...dial indicate them...
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01-18-2006 03:00 PM  13 years ago
jvanscoyk

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Tucson, AZ

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Notchy Gear here as well
I just bought a banged up EVO 50 and I'm in the process of putting it back together. After putting the main gear together I noticed it would lock up when I spun the gear. While doing an inspection of the main gear I noticed something jammed in between two teeth. I pried it out with a small screw driver and all is good now. So check the main gear out. It doesn't take much to cause it to bind. Apparantly the piece of debri had been there for some time since the counter gear has some wear marks on it.

Runs nice and smooth now though I have a feeling a set of Delrin gears might be in my future.

Jim
must go faster, must go faster.........
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01-18-2006 09:21 PM  13 years ago
AirFlex

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Danbury, CT

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How much are the delrin gears and what's the part numbers/locations to buy...

What all is involved with putting on the delrin gears?
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01-18-2006 09:37 PM  13 years ago
Leif

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USA

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Rick's carries the Delrin DTDS set.

Delrin DTDS Gear Set - 412168

Installation is easy. Just pull the links off the outer swashplate balls, pull the lower Jesus bolt out and the whole mainshaft and head will come out. Then it's a matter of removing the stock upper gear from the auto hub and installing the Delrin one in its place. Reassemble in reverse.

Leif
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01-19-2006 01:42 AM  13 years ago
tchavei

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Portugal

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My DTDS gear (delrin) did that too during install. I even posted here worring since my Freya never did that. Most ppl told me to ignore it and yes they were right. If it isn't a lock but just some mild friction (I compare the feeling to a shot bearing ) I wouldn't worry about it. It will bed in.

my 2 cents
Tony

--------------------
"Perfection and patience usually walk side by side..."
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01-19-2006 02:41 AM  13 years ago
Grant H

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Madison, WI

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I am also building my Evo right now and am also on step 8 like you..
In general do you loctite all metal to metal connections (main frame bolt/nuts, setscrews, etc etc) even if it is not indicated in the manual?
I was also wondering this. Mainly for the frame bolts/nuts. I do believe that if you get them tight enough, they should sink into the plastic a tad bit, which should help hold better.

Currious to see what other people do as well.

Not meaning to hijack, but on the same note for these gears. What is the difference between the above listed "constand drive gears" and a driven tail?
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01-19-2006 02:51 AM  13 years ago
Leif

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USA

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Yes, you should loctite all metal to metal threaded joints. This includes the frame bolts. Many guys have replaced the bolts with socket-head bolts and nylock nuts, but I even use a bit of loctite with the nylocks.

DTDS= driven tail drive system = constant drive. All the same thing, a set of main gears that result in a driven tail during autorotations. There are two versions... a cheap molded plastic gear set and a rather expensive machined delrin set.

The symptom of the gear being off center or out of true can be a result of the main gear not being properly seated when screwed to the autorotation hub. Removing the maingear from the hub, turning 90 degrees and re-installing can correct this symptom. The first time you thread those screws they sometimes don't get started straight and then don't tighten down all the way.

Leif
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01-19-2006 02:53 AM  13 years ago
Grant H

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Madison, WI

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Yes, you should loctite all metal to metal threaded joints. This includes the frame bolts. Many guys have replaced the bolts with socket-head bolts and nylock nuts, but I even use a bit of loctite with the nylocks.

DTDS= driven tail drive system = constant drive. All the same thing, a set of main gears that result in a driven tail during autorotations. There are two versions... a cheap molded plastic gear set and a rather expensive machined delrin set.
Thank you for your response Leif. Why do you suppose the manual doesnt call for locktite on the frame nuts/bolts?
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01-19-2006 03:06 AM  13 years ago
Leif

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USA

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Why do you suppose the manual doesnt call for locktite on the frame nuts/bolts?
Prolly because some nitwit would go and use RED loctite and then would never be able to crack the frames apart again. You should do the tail case nuts/bolts with loctite as well. Red loctite it too strong for anything that you won't be able to heat up for removal.
I use 222MS purple low/medium strength, which is pretty easy to remove but holds well. If you can't get 222, blue low-strength is the best for these locations.

Leif
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01-19-2006 03:11 AM  13 years ago
Grant H

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Madison, WI

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Prolly because some nitwit would go and use RED loctite and then would never be able to crack the frames apart again.
I dont fully agree with this. The manual points out other areas that locktite is needed, but does not suggest locktiting the frame bolts. It also says to use the blue locktite.

That still doesnt account for why the manual does not say to locktite these nuts/bolts. I am kinda thinking that it is not needed.
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01-19-2006 03:26 AM  13 years ago
TMoore

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Cookeville, TN

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Blue is the type to use when you use it. Anywhere there is a nylock nut you don't need loctite. You don't need loctite on the engine nut, the clutch bolts or the engine mount itself. A drop of loctite on the 4 screws that secure the engine to the frames won't hurt.

You don't need loctite on the feathering shaft but you do need to get the bolts tight and I mean tight, not like a little girl. Using a drop of loctite on the flybar set screws, paddle set screws and set screws in general is a good idea. Don't bathe the bolts in the stuff either. A drop on each screw will hold it in place and still be able to get the bolts loose when you need to.

When you get the tail drive assy bolted up check the main gear mesh with the engine installed and everything together. Check for clearance issues where the DTDS mates with the tail drive pulley. I've seen this rub. Don't forget to pull the mainshaft up tight once you get the gear stack in place and then secure the SS' on the locking collar with loctite.

TM
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01-19-2006 03:46 AM  13 years ago
Leif

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USA

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I am kinda thinking that it is not needed.
Build it however you like. Personally, I use loctite on all threaded bolts, and have had good success with this procedure. They stay put until I remove them, and with low/medium strength loctite removal is never a problem.

Rather than ask whether it's required to loctite these bolts, I ask myself whether it would hurt. There's no reason not to IMO.

Leif
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01-19-2006 03:48 AM  13 years ago
TMoore

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Cookeville, TN

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Rather than ask whether it's required to loctite these bolts, I ask myself whether it would hurt. There's no reason not to IMO.
It only hurts when you have to disassemble the stuff. There is no substitute for the proper torque being applied to fasteners.

TM
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01-19-2006 06:32 AM  13 years ago
HeliMart

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Shrewsbury, UK

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I have almost finished putting an Evo together, I agree that the manual is not always acurate as to what should have loctite. On all metal to metal fastners I have used blue loctite. I used a small drop of cyano on the outer races of the bearings where they sit in the housings to ensure they don't rotate in the frames. Where screwing in to plastic I sometimes have started the threads with a tap and then let the rest of the screw bite home, on some of these screws I have also used a drop of cyano. To help everything line up properly I left all the frame screws which I replaced with M3X35 cap heads and nylocs one turn loose until everything is in place & then tightened them all. I am very happy with the way the gears mesh and have no tight spots.Martin
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01-19-2006 12:53 PM  13 years ago
RayJayJohnsonJr

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Midwest

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There is no substitute for the proper torque being applied to fasteners.
I think if you could find a torque chart for the the size fastners we're using, you would find in most cases we are OVER torquing anyway. If you tightened these bolts to a recommended torque you would probably find your heli shaking itself apart after a season. USE the locktite and like TMoore said earlier "don't tighten them like a little girl". The bolts that have fiber locknuts are not long enough to effectively use the nut. The end of the bolt just barely comes out flush. Aircraft standards (and these are aircraft, right?) say that ya need at least a thread and a half pokeing out past the nut. There is proper torque for the fastener and then there is the torque we use for the application. Tighten them good and USE the locktite.

-Mark
There, their and they're. It's really that simple.
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01-19-2006 01:40 PM  13 years ago
AirFlex

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Danbury, CT

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I am considering ordering some servo plates and socket cap screw to hold in the servo's. The hirobo screw torque to rubber grommets...a servo plate would provide more even pressure i think...anybody agree?

It looks like i'll be replacing some hardware soon...first candidates:

Frame bolts (already done)
Screws that hold the servo balls in their arms (i sheared already, don't care to take my changes with other)
Servo mounting screws (just in case)

Any other candidates? trying to eliminate as much of the philips head screws as possible...
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