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Other › In need of a little help with esc/motor.
10-16-2005 01:16 AM  12 years agoPost 1
Eyefly

rrVeteran

Charlotte, NC

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OK, here is my setup:

T-rex 400X
CC35 esc
Align 400-S
TP 2100 gen 2 battery
HS 55 servos all the way around.

Here is the situation:

Mind you I am still new to this and I am learning L and R hovering right now.
For the first flight, everything is great. No glitches / twitches and the heli hovers great. After I disconnect the battery, which gets pretty warm, I notice the little motor gets unreal hot. You can feel the heat radiate from the motor. Forget even trying to touch it.

For the second flight, things start to go a bit bad. I will be hovering 3 feet above the ground and all of a sudden, the motor just stops. The throttle stick is at about mid way on the Tx. And as you can imagine, the little bird falls out of the sky with the same authority as a brick. If I throttle back, and than forward, the motor starts back up. I am lucky sometimes however, on occasion I have have to deal with a bit of dammage.

I cant help but think there is a motor issue. I recall when I had a GWS 350 on an airplane with a 3 Cell pack, I had the same experience;
motor stops-throttle back- throttle forward-motor runs again. Can any of you motor gurus give me a heads up? I purchased a NEU 1107-2Y and am about to install it. Perhaps the power is simply too much for the little 400S. But why than would Align even make it if it couldnt handle the T-rex.

Thanks in advance...

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10-16-2005 01:37 AM  12 years agoPost 2
MikeInMobile

rrElite Veteran

Mobile, Alabama

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Disable current limiting on the CC35 ESC. The ESC sensed an overcurrent situation and disabled the motor. Once current limiting is disabled, this will not happen again. Also, invest in the TP2100 Pro-Lites. These batteries will reduce the temperature of your motor and batteries.

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10-16-2005 01:45 AM  12 years agoPost 3
Luckylandings

rrVeteran

Oregon USA

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You could also play around with different pinions. Take some load off your motor... Or just get a good outrunner..

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10-16-2005 01:49 AM  12 years agoPost 4
dkshema

rrMaster

Cedar Rapids, IA

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First, the Align motor gets roasty-toasty hot. When you're done flying, you could probably fry eggs on it, that's not unusual for the 400S.

Do you have the Phoenix link cable for your ESC? IF you do, then use it to download and install at least version 1.14 SW into the ESC. Anything older will cause you grief. I'm using the 1.161 version, it seems OK, but 1.14 is probably the more solid of the two versions. That being said:

CC35 setup:

DISABLE the CURRENT LIMIT feature. This will cause the ESC to cut out randomly if set to anything besides DISABLED.

Setting the cutoff voltage value kind of depends on if you have that Phoenix link cable or not. Try setting the cutoff to 9 volts (can go lower if you have the cable and pay attention to the signals the heli is giving you about the battery voltage).

Brake type: DISABLED. For a heli this is the ONLY setting to use.

Throttle type -- depends on how you want to fly, and what SW version you have. If you have SW older than 1.14, then don't bother with the Governor modes. If you have 1.14 or newer, you can give them a try.

DON'T use AUTO-Calibrate in your heli. This mode requires you to go to full throttle each time you apply power to the ESC so that it can figure out where full throttle setting is.

If you're not using one of the Governor modes, then you are using FIXED mode for THROTTLE. When using fixed mode, you need to set the transmitter throttle endpoints, both low and high. You need to set the low throttle and low trim setting to arm the ESC and enable it to run. Then you need to go to full throttle and adjust the high throttle endpoint up until the red LED comes on and stays on solid. I usually do this by holding the heli carefully above my head with one hand while bumping the throttle endpoint adjust with the other. BE CAREFUL.

Timing Advance: You can leave the timing advance at the default, or if you're feeling adventurous, set it to high advance.

CUTOFF TYPE: set to soft so you don't get any nasty surprises like you're already getting with the motor shutting off.

SOFT START -- I use "soft". "Softest" takes forever to spool up, Fast makes it go, but might be a bit much of a jolt for the mechanics.

PWM SWITCHING RATE: Leave this at the factory default.

ALSO -- with the CC ESCs, it is nearly imperative that you install a ferrite toroid on the ESC to Receiver three-wire cable. Otherwise you will get glitches galore and the heli will be unflyable as a result.

I bought my ferrite toroid from Digi-Key (http://www.digikey.com) for 49 cents plus shipping. Their part number is P12721-ND. It looks like this:

Gets installed on the ESC to RX cable like this:

(that's 6-1/2 turns on the toroid and works fine -- the more turns you get, the happier your radio will be)

And the whole thing gets installed in the heli like this:

Others have used the ferrite rings that they've found on the cables of old PC parts -- that big blob on the video monitor cable, or some supplies have them inside the PC. Look at a thread called "Glitch Free Configuration" here on this forum, you'll see my pictures as well as the suggestions about where to find those toroids on junk PC parts if you read enough of the replies.

If you're a bit more adventurous and can handle a soldering iron, MikeInMobile can give you some good advice on how to build an in-line PI filter for that cable.

I almost forgot -- let your battery pack cool down a bit before you slap it back on the charger....and make sure you are using the right pinion for the 420S.

Dave

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10-16-2005 01:54 AM  12 years agoPost 5
Luckylandings

rrVeteran

Oregon USA

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Nice post Dave...Wish I had that kind of patiance..

You might suggest removing the main blades if he is just learning to programe the esc though...

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10-16-2005 01:59 AM  12 years agoPost 6
Eyefly

rrVeteran

Charlotte, NC

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Yikes! Thanks fellas. Just one question though. Am I risking cooking the ESC by dumping the current limit?

Alex

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10-16-2005 02:37 AM  12 years agoPost 7
dkshema

rrMaster

Cedar Rapids, IA

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No, you most likely won't fry the ESC with the current limit turned off. Most people here report that you take out the main gear teeth before the ESC goes up in smoke. The chances of smoking your ESC are way way low.

The alternative, that of leaving the ESC set to even "insensitive" will invariably lead to your motor cutting out in flight. The chances of that happening unless you disable the current limit is 100%, and you end up with a crash to repair most of the time.

Disabling the current limit feature and putting in a noise filter on the ESC/RX line is about the ONLY way to keep those pesky motor cutouts from happening.

Dave

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10-16-2005 07:07 PM  12 years agoPost 8
Eyefly

rrVeteran

Charlotte, NC

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Thanks Dave and every one else who replied. I will reprogram the ESC today...

Alex

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10-19-2005 01:58 AM  12 years agoPost 9
Eyefly

rrVeteran

Charlotte, NC

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dkshema,


Thanks for the heads up on the settings. I set everything up as you described and used the fixed throttle setting. I also set up the throttle end points as per the trex tuneing websight. Other than a few tracking issues, the little heli runs smoother than a prom queens theighs. No more motor stops. I thought the light was supposed to be on during flight. Apparently, a solid red light means the ESC is working too hard. everything is great now. Thanks again.

Alex

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10-19-2005 02:11 AM  12 years agoPost 10
nojohnny101

rrElite Veteran

10 miles north of Cincy, OHIO

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hey
the little heli runs smoother than a prom queens theighs


Thanks
~Will~

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10-19-2005 02:36 AM  12 years agoPost 11
kileak

rrNovice

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Do you have a heat sink on the motor? I have one on my 420lf and it doesn't get very hot at all after 14 minutes of hovering.

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10-19-2005 02:58 AM  12 years agoPost 12
Eyefly

rrVeteran

Charlotte, NC

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Yes it has a heat sink. But it still gets stupid hot. I will be changing to the 1107-2Y soon. It just came in the mail. I understand they run alot cooler. I can hover 12-14 minutes as well. So I need to buy a few more batteries.

Alex

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