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MS Composit › New Hornet Video and Autorotation
10-15-2005 07:10 PM  12 years agoPost 1
jiri

rrApprentice

Aalborg, Denmark

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Hello,

recently DarkHorse1 challenged me by telling me that he was
surprized that I still fly my Hornet :-) I have not posted anything
new recently, but now I decided to make a short video. Here
is goes:

www.cs.aau.dk/~srba/rc/hornet-auto.wmv

I hope you will enjoy it DarkHorse?

Jiri

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10-15-2005 11:43 PM  12 years agoPost 2
DarkHorse1

rrApprentice

Gloucester UK

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> recently DarkHorse1 challenged me
hehehe I was just happy to see you posting again, evaluating different setups and ideas.

> I hope you will enjoy it DarkHorse?
Yea you know it!
The video is great , thanks jiri, top production. And it's about time to .
I can see you have been silently fine tuning your skills, excellent smooth controlled manoeuvres. Impressive low altitude inverted hover , inverted FF... and you managed to tame the Hornet for successful auto's!!!
Another video to add to my web page lists of vids .

I will get some new moves and skills locked down soon (I hope) but the weather and day light is closing in now. Pulled a couple of scruffy flips this evening and that got my heart pumping hard again . Working on a almost zero crash incident rate means slow progress. Maybe I will have to re-think this approach.


EDIT: Not much room for error on timing. Do you have to kill the throttle then immediately hit full negative pitch on the auto, ride the 'express elevator down', flare out and add pitch to bleed off the speed?

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10-15-2005 11:54 PM  12 years agoPost 3
jiri

rrApprentice

Aalborg, Denmark

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Thanks :-)

For the autos, if not done from a very high altitude, I usually
go into negative and hit the throttle hold immediately after this.

Anyway, the days are getting shorter here so I am afraid that there
won't be many more opportunities for flying ...

Jiri

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10-16-2005 04:01 AM  12 years agoPost 4
Fit

rrApprentice

Temasek

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Hi Jiri,

Nice to see you posting again. I've always loved your videos and watched you piloting skills progress time after time. From your 1st loops till now. I started to try and advance into aerobatics after seeing your 1st loop video but so far progress is sloww...

At times i felt like selling off my H2 and get an X3D and start afresh but after seeing your video with you still sticking to your H2 , i think i will do the same hehe!

What brand or type of blades are those? It seems that those blades makes the heli smoother. I think I am going to do the same to my H2, extend the boom and run zoom/zap 280mm foam blades and try some autos

Hornet X3D : GY401, 9CHP, AXI, MS116+____Evo 50, 50SXH

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10-16-2005 08:22 AM  12 years agoPost 5
johnny b

rrApprentice

Central Coast, CA

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Jiri,

That was a great video. Thanks for sharing.

I've seen your older videos, and I've got to say, its encouraging as a newbie to see someone else progress so well on their flying.

If I maiden the Hornet before Xmastime, and a year later was flying like this last video of yours (assuming LOTS of airtime and sim time), I'd consider it all worthwhile.

I'm convinced that I can get these little ones not only to fly, but to fly fantastically well. Seeing new videos reinforces this dream of mine. Hope others stick with and continue posting videos and tips on the Hornet line.

Great stuff.

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10-16-2005 08:39 AM  12 years agoPost 6
jiri

rrApprentice

Aalborg, Denmark

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Thanks. The reason I was not posting very often lately is that I have
got any problems with my Hornet II so I was rather flying :-) Also when
I post a video I want there to be something new documenting my
progress and the last stage took really lots of time. So far the longest
periods for me where from the first hover to the first loop (almost a year)
and from the first inverted hover to something like on the video (also a year).

Indeed,I think that Hornet II flies very well so I cannot see any particular need
to upgrade to the 3DX. The only reason I would see for this would be
if the heli gets very unprecise and things do not work as good as
before so instead of upgrading a number of moving parts, it could be
better to buy a new heli.

About the blades, I was using Maxir stock blades (white ones) and I guess
that KOK 28cm would work even better but I have not tried them in this
length yet. Next thing to come to my home will be T-Rex :-)

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10-16-2005 10:32 PM  12 years agoPost 7
johnny b

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Central Coast, CA

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How did you extend your boom?

Do the larger Maxir blades make a much better improvement in the flight of the helicopter?

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10-17-2005 07:48 AM  12 years agoPost 8
jiri

rrApprentice

Aalborg, Denmark

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Some guy sold a longer boom for me. Then I simply cut a longer
carbon stick and preferably put two bearings in it.

The difference in the stability is very noticable.

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10-17-2005 09:40 AM  12 years agoPost 9
mattijs

rrApprentice

Keerbergen Belgium

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nice one JIRI


Looks like i am trailing behind you skillwise a couple of months like on the previous video.

Now i am slighly better then your last video but not to the point that i'm nosing in inverted that low.

Keep practicing or i'll get you


BTW how did your flight times fare from going to the bigger blades??

Do you fly with the same headspeed or did you lower the teeth count on the motor pinion?


Are you flying with the lightened flybarpaddles or the normal ones?

What actions did you take to make the maxir blades hornet compatible?

They have a 3mm bolt hole and are slightly thinner at the root aren't they?

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10-17-2005 12:38 PM  12 years agoPost 10
Blade-X

rrApprentice

Singapore

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jiri,
thanks for the impressive video! Is it because of the increased rotor disc that there was a slight pause into gentle landing at the end of the auto? I do not see that in other Hornet 2 auto vids....

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10-17-2005 03:51 PM  12 years agoPost 11
jiri

rrApprentice

Aalborg, Denmark

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mattijs:

my flight times are now 8-9 minutes with TP 1320 or Tanic 1050.
They take back about 900-1000 mAh after the flight

I fly duzi one-way with 12T pinion. The head speed is pretty high,
I am sure that going down can gain some flight time.

I use standard paddles and duzi bell-hiller. The cyclic is very
very fast ... adding lightened paddles would compromise
stability in my view.

I used a washer to make the blades fit into duzi head. The hole
diameter is the same as for Hornet blades.

Glad to hear I am still a few months ahead ... :-) actually, normally
I do not hover that low but you know what people can do for
a good video recording ... :-)

Blade-X:

Indeed, larger (and heavier) blades make autorotation much easier.
This one was not the best, sometimes it can really pause for a while
before landing (but one those occasions there was no video camera).
Thanks anyway.

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10-17-2005 05:55 PM  12 years agoPost 12
johnny b

rrApprentice

Central Coast, CA

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Really encouraging video, Jiri.

How much does it weigh with the longer blades/boom? How did you work out the CG?

How well do you find the Hornet holding up for you? It looks like it flies very well and the tail holds well and its stable while being very, very responsive.

Do you have to do lots of fixing and set-up between flights, or is it reasonable? Sorry for noob questions, just looking to hear insights from someone who flies like I would like to be able to fly after a year or two on the sticks.

Thanks.

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10-17-2005 06:12 PM  12 years agoPost 13
jiri

rrApprentice

Aalborg, Denmark

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If I remember well if weights around 350-360g. The CoG is no problem
with duzi one-way (I can move the battery pack all the way up front as
the motor is put at the back. This is a very convenient configuration.
After changing the boom length, I had to move the pack about 1 cm forward.

The tail holds OK, however, with CSM 560SL gyro, it works much better
(I have this on my Maxir). CSM gyro is much better in pirouettes and
holds the tail better.

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10-17-2005 11:57 PM  12 years agoPost 14
mattijs

rrApprentice

Keerbergen Belgium

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"mattijs:

my flight times are now 8-9 minutes with TP 1320 or Tanic 1050.
They take back about 900-1000 mAh after the flight

I fly duzi one-way with 12T pinion. The head speed is pretty high,
I am sure that going down can gain some flight time."

damn, not what i wanted to hear. I think your heli has about the same power as mine on the kokam blades.

I always planned on going to 28 cm blades because BOYD over at rcgroups said that he did the conversion to his 3dpro and he was able to fly for 20 minutes.
The important thing to note however was that he claimed to be flying for 20 minutes with a headspeed around 3000rpm.

His setup was on 4s though but still, hearing all that made me confident that the hornet in it's current x3d iteration was getting a bit heavy at 360-380 grams for the 25 cm blades and that going to 28 cm was the logical thing to do to regain some efficiency whilst keeping the 3d capability. (dropping the hs probably for efficiency reasons but still having the same oumph because the span is bigger)


I think boyde probably made a mistake calculating the hs or something because he surely knows a thing or two about helicopters.

I guess the only reason now to go to 28cm blades would be to increase the stability, seeing the flightimes don't appear to get longer.

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10-18-2005 12:04 AM  12 years agoPost 15
johnny b

rrApprentice

Central Coast, CA

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How much do you think that AUW matters as far as flight-time, then?

Think I read somewhere a gram of weight difference on a FP Piccolo made about 10 sec flight time difference, all else being equal. I don't know if I'm remembering this correctly or not, but if true, it means you need to find a sweet spot between power, weight, and flight-times.

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10-18-2005 12:41 AM  12 years agoPost 16
mattijs

rrApprentice

Keerbergen Belgium

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I don't think that rule doesn't apply anymore...if it ever did.

In those days having a couple of grams difference meant going up or staying down....having 5 muinute flights and then cruising the ground effect to get those 7 minutes you had been dreaming off.

My guestimate would be that a hornet that looses 20 grams gains about a minute or two maybe three at a very low headspeed. (say from 370 to 350)

At higher headspeeds the weight gets ever less important as the drag that has to be overcome regardless of the weight (at 0pitch) gets higher and higher. (gets to be a significant player in the total ampdraw)

I'd say a 2900 hs hornet at 280 grams probably only loses a minute or so to a 260 one...the top end punch also goes ofcourse but we were talking flighttimes so...


I suddenly remember that when i started this hobby two years ago, when the eric larson hornet I video was over at helihobby, they claimed n their package deal for the hornet thatyou'd be able to do hardcore 3d for 25 MINUTES on an 1200 etec pack.


It makes me smile now knowing everything i know now, thinking about how uninformed i was back then and how i fell for the wow factor of the hellihobby site....Needless to say i bought my hornet I there and almost surprisingly had no problems with them other then having to wait 2 months for it to arrive.


It would be nice though to have a heli capable of hardcore 3d for 25 minutes....

A couple of years from now i'm sure lipo's will have doubled there capacity per weight and have 50c safe dicharge.

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10-18-2005 12:44 AM  12 years agoPost 17
mattijs

rrApprentice

Keerbergen Belgium

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ow and jiri, i really like the song on the video AND the way you fade it out at the and for the auto and then bring it back...

classy

I don't know what the girl is singing about though. I thought Danish would be more like Dutch.

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10-18-2005 08:02 AM  12 years agoPost 18
jiri

rrApprentice

Aalborg, Denmark

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I have to agree, weight (within reasonable bounds) does not matter
that much. Moreover, with larger blades and good pack/motor it
provides more stability while still having lots of punch.

Btw. the song is not in danish, I think she is a singer from Norway.

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10-18-2005 04:35 PM  12 years agoPost 19
mattijs

rrApprentice

Keerbergen Belgium

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does danish resamble norwegian or not even close? Just curious.

Belgian is the same as Dutch and resambles German but not too close.
South african is about the same too

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10-18-2005 05:01 PM  12 years agoPost 20
jiri

rrApprentice

Aalborg, Denmark

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Yes, danish and norwegian are essentially the same languages ...
no problem to understand each other, sweedish is also very close
but not as close as norwegian.

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