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HomeAircraftHelicopterHelicopter Main Discussion › Mode 1 piroflips (not what you think)
10-14-2005 09:06 AM  13 years agoPost 1
lpearce

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Pukekohe, Auckland NZ

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Hi, I was wondering if it would be possible to put a few different mixes into a radio so that a mode 1 pilot could do piroflips easier , eg. mix evlevator to ailerone at the flick of a switch. Obviously there would have to be a number of mixes but would it be possible. 4 mixes - forward/left ,backward/left ,back/right and forward/right. Or is this just impossible.

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10-14-2005 01:29 PM  13 years agoPost 2
Jason WAI

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Hong Kong

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you do not need mix.

it is ture that it was much harder to do piro flip in more 1 than in mode 2

In mode 2 , you could do it as if you were stirring a pudding

but it could be done. just need some more practice. You may practice piro first. As soon as you master the skills, you may then try to flip then.

You may try right rudder piro flip. I think it is a bit easier than left rudder piro flip in mode 1

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10-14-2005 11:58 PM  13 years agoPost 3
Jafa

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Sydney, Australia

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I'm not great with the mix programming but I do not believe you can achieve a mode 1 piro flip with a mix - a mix will feed a percentage of the current input from one active channel to another - that is not how mode 1 piro fliping works. As you put the aileron in, you are taking the elevator out, then as you take the aileron out, you are putting opposite elevator in, then as you put opposite aileron in, you are again taking the elevator out. Besides, do you want to get a kick out of flying your heli or watch a computer fly it?

I piro to the left, anti clockwise, this unloads the engine, not a big deal for 90's but could help for the 50's. Piroing to the left also puts the rudder stick in a convienient position to manipulate the elevator.

I used to think I would never be able to achieve a mode 1 piro flip, but after studing the action and inputs needed, I got into practicing them on the sim, in less than a week I was doing them, all be it the heli travelled all over the sky After a lot of practice I can do it with ease, not quite locked in place but very good. It's just hand eye timing.

Hell, I can only fly two orientations, forward upright and forward inverted, yet I can piro flip- in the sim! Have yet to take the plunge and do a piro with nitro, but really looking forward to it.


Protos | Logo 400 & 500 | Sceadu Evo | Freya Evo | Trex600N | Avant FX

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10-15-2005 03:30 AM  13 years agoPost 4
Jason WAI

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Hong Kong

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I piro to the left, anti clockwise, this unloads the engine, not a big deal for 90's but could help for the 50's.
Yes, it is true left rudder piro flip will not load the engine as much as doing right rudder piro flip.

right rudder piro flip , you must do it right in order to flip. or else the engine will be heavily loaded

please correct me if I'm wrong.

I'm doing mainly right rudder piro flips in mode 1 .

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10-15-2005 10:46 AM  13 years agoPost 5
DenisS

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england

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I have a mix on the aileron that takes collective out by two or three degrees if I have the stick right in the corner. I fly mode four which is mode 1 on opposite sticks. The mix means that I don't inadvertantly over pitch the blades whilst on full aileron, either positive or negative, This really helps with rolling circles and to some degree with the piro flips. I'm not good at piroflipping but slowly practicing, both right and left tail, and getting there. As you get better you find you don't need as much mix until eventually you will do away with it altogether. I fly the WCII Futaba so whether it is possible with a JR I don't know.
DenisS

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10-15-2005 11:10 AM  13 years agoPost 6
Harts

rrApprentice

Victoria, Australia

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I know at least 5 guys in Australia that can piro flip on mode 1. 2 can do it VERY well. Ask them and they will tell you the same thing a mode 2 pilot will tell you and that is the manuever takes heaps of practise. A mode 2 pilot may get results a little quick but you still need to learn to fly the heli through the maneuver.

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10-16-2005 02:28 AM  13 years agoPost 7
Secret Squirrel

rrKey Veteran

New Zealander living in Melbourne, Australia

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I've been helping a couple of guys who fly mode one (I fly 2) do piro flips. The easiest way is for you to do only one input (ie aileron, or elevator, but not both while you're learning).

Perhaps one of the most important parts of learning piro flips (which hasn't been discussed here) is the pitch timing. The reason why piroflips are travelling across the sky is because the pitch (not cyclic) timing is wrong.

Si

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Simon Lockington

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10-16-2005 03:28 AM  13 years agoPost 8
lpearce

rrApprentice

Pukekohe, Auckland NZ

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Thats what I have been doing for a while now on xtr and it seems to work quite well (Just using aileron, not elevator and aileron) There far from stationary like that but it does work quite well. especialy when coming into it from fast backward flight. I think its more of a chaos tho than a piro flip would that be correct. I know that the piro flip can be done mode 1 and have seen a download somewhere of the sticks in action while a guy was flying xtr mode 1 I was just wondering about the mixs thats all. I can do them sometimes on the sim with both aileron and elevator but it lasts about 2 seconds before my brain gives up

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10-16-2005 09:13 AM  13 years agoPost 9
u.k. sailor

rrVeteran

cambs uk

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Great post,
i changed from mode 2 to mode 1 on planks following the advice of many times world champion Hanno Prettner because i was interested in F3a. I had a few near misses with a cheap model but definately prefer it. I think it is easier to do rolling circles with this mode on aeroplanes as you stir the pudding and just need timing to be good.
Now i am into the heli's and almost never fly aeroplanes, i have about 18 months flying with them and want to be able to do piro flips and chaos. I watched the Alan szabo video with him stirring the pudding again good timing very necassary, and have been thinking of changing back to mode two to make these manouvers. For obvious reasons it would be good to not change again even if I now have a sim to practice on.
Does anyone think mode 1 has advantages on the heli for say F3c type flying?
It is obvious that all manouvers are possible in all modes it is all down to the pilot, but at age 50 some of this seems to be a brain tester and any detailed help as to the sequence of stick inputs doing a chaos in one direction of rotation would be greatly appreciated

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10-16-2005 09:17 AM  13 years agoPost 10
Secret Squirrel

rrKey Veteran

New Zealander living in Melbourne, Australia

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Whether one mode has advantages over the other is personal choice. I know two guys who went from Mode One to Two and later said they would have been just as well off had they invested that effort into learning the maneuvers in Mode One.

There are lots of guys in the top end of F3C using both Mode One or Two, I really don't think it matters.

Si

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Simon Lockington

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03-13-2007 12:50 PM  11 years agoPost 11
nikprak

rrNovice

Calcutta - India

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I've been doing Mode 1 piro-flips for a while now (though precision is still lacking.) It did take some work on the Sim to get my brain tuned, but once you've got it down to habit, I would say it's as easy (or hard) as Mode 2.

I fly planks as well and it's intuitively easier to do a rolling harrier in Mode 1, where it comes down to a timed 'stirring' of elevator and rudder on the left-stick, while maintaining a constant aileron input on the right (similar to a chaos, minus the collective movement.) But many top 3D planker pilots are Mode 2 guys and they execute it beautifully.

So I totally agree with Simon - it's all about personal choice.

Nik

"Fly not! Crash, or crash not! There is no flying. " - Yodaptor

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