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HomeAircraftHelicopterMain Discussion › How to fight a County Ban on RC Clubs in Public Parks
10-13-2005 04:01 AM  12 years agoPost 1
kaptkaos

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Miami FL

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We have had a ban on any RC clubs in Public Parks within Dade County for about 15 years now. I wonder how many other counties have similar bans, and if there has been any success overuling them?
We have nowhere to fly safely in this county, and many people fly in rogue areas. Property is too valuable in Miami to open a private club, so what are our options? Can the AMA come in and help? Provide safety facts and lobby to help us get a club?

We have several huge soccer and baseball parks in every neighborhood, with huge facilities and lighting. Most of the people utilizing them have been in this country for a very short time and not contributed as much to the tax pool...

It doesnt seem fair..I dont mind them having a soccer field at every corner, just let me have a single piece of contaminated land to fly my Raptor without driving to the next county...

What can we do?

If you give a Chimp a gun, and the Chimp shoots, DONT BLAME THE CHIMP!!!!

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10-13-2005 04:08 AM  12 years agoPost 2
Saint728

rrProfessor

Honolulu, Hawaii

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Sounds like your having the same problems with flying at public parks as we do. There is no way that they will let you fly at public parks because of insurance and safety issues. There is no way that they can fence off the area, make sure there are no same frequencies in the area, etc. The closest flying field near me is an hour drive each way. I do have a Trex that I can fly at the park if no one is around. Other then that, I have to make take the long drive to fly. Good luck in getting your ban lifted.

Take Care,
Cheers, Patrick

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10-13-2005 04:34 AM  12 years agoPost 3
helidad2

rrApprentice

potosi mo. usa

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there was a post about superfund sites on here a while back . these are toxic waste areas that the tax payers have paid to clean up and i believe ama lobbied the government or whoever and got some accecpance to use these as a flying field .there are some rules regarding them but alot of them are in your favor check out the website as it has a list of all the properties in any area . a call to ama asking about the superfund sites may help
,good luck
david
http://www.runryder.com/t170787p1/?...superfund+sites

even a blind hog finds an acorn now and then

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10-13-2005 04:37 AM  12 years agoPost 4
dkshema

rrMaster

Cedar Rapids, IA

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Organize. One against the government is not a good place to be coming from. A large group of voters can do wonders when talking to elected officials.

Be responsible. Be professional. Be courteous. At all times, no matter what happens. Offer a well researched development plan, and don't go it alone. Back your plan up with numbers, facts, and figures.

Research the pros and cons that caused a county ban, and understand what it takes to lift a ban. If there was some kind of real or perceived "disaster" involving models in parks in the past, find out what really happened. Address the fears that the city/county officials have.

Public Relations. Mall shows, flying demonstrations, work with local schools and the teachers -- especially the science teachers. PUBLIC RELATIONS. Get your group known in the right places, and for the right reasons.

Cultivate a relationship with key city and county officials, get to know who you are up against, find out why the ban is there in the first place. Talk to the people involved who make the regulations, understand the objections. Let them know you are willing to help them.

Financial responsibility. Demonstrate your ability to provide adequate insurance for the site owner and operators. Demonstrate your ability to maintain a site and make improvements. Demonstrate your ability to "police" yourselves to let the ciyt/county types know that you and your group can handle the day-to-day operation of a public site. Educate the office holders about the hobby/sport. Invite them out to where you fly. Show them what you need in the way of a site. Emphasize safety and safe operations.

VOTE for the "right" people and get them into office. Maybe even work on their campaign committees.

Talk to other organizations in your area that have fought the same battle and were successful. Find out what they did right, and what they did wrong. If feasible, enlist their aid.

Go to planning meetings, zoning meetings, parks board meetings to understand the entire process, and become a familiar face -- but not for being a complainer. Be recognized for the right reasons. Dress appropriately for those board meetings. Be dedicated to the cause.

Find someone in the local news media who might be sympathetic to your grand idea and see if you can get some periodic local news coverage. Maybe you can cajole them into championing your cause as a way to improve the "quality of life" in your community.

Identify several possible sites in the area that are ripe for development. Public lands that are set aside for improvements or reclamation. Parks that are in need of restoration. Closed landfills that are planned for reclamation.

Do your homework. Do some research and find out if there are any grants or other public funds available for the development of public areas. Find out what the city/county budget is for parks and park maintenance.

Contact the AMA and get hold of the people who can offer assistance in obtaining and keeping flying sites. I'm not sure they can supply bodies to fight your cause (after all YOU as an AMA member are one of the "bodies" they need -- you ARE the AMA, not some building in Indiana!), but they should be able to provide knowledge on how to overcome obstacles with city and county governments.

It's a lot of work. It takes a long time, and may or may not be fruitful.

It's a daunting task.

Dave

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10-13-2005 05:29 AM  12 years agoPost 5
the collective

rrKey Veteran

Bayside, NY, U.S.A

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A lot of good ideas in this thread so far... but I think the biggest problem we face in trying to find a site is that our sport doesn't involve a ball. Around here, there are countless places for baseball, softball, football, soccer, cricket, etc. on public land.

What you need to do is obvious... petition for an area to play "Heliball" and you'll be all set. Make up some set of rules where you use helis to push a ball around the field and you'll have a flying site in no time. Don't actually try to play ball with the helis for safety's sake. Just keep a large beach ball at the field, and if any town officials show up to see the "game" just tell them that there aren't enough players present for two teams, so you're all just practicing flying and tuning your "heliball" ships.

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10-13-2005 02:30 PM  12 years agoPost 6
pH7

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Sterling Heights, MI - USA

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Yeah - all those sport require only one ball to participate.

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11-07-2005 12:45 AM  12 years agoPost 7
Saint728

rrProfessor

Honolulu, Hawaii

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Buy a piece of land and start your own club. Charge people to join and it will cover the cost of the land, insurance and maintenance. You could also build your house there and live. If I owned a property, I would do that. You could also open up a hobby store at the flying field and make money off of that too. You could also build an on-road and off road track and do the car thing as well. Call it Radio Controlled Wonderland.

Take Care,
Cheers, Patrick

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11-07-2005 01:18 AM  12 years agoPost 8
kaptkaos

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Miami FL

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Things dont work that way in Miami!
The most simple things can be very difficult, and if it doesnt have to do with Soccer or Baseball....you can forget about it. Land is very expensive and they have strict zoning laws.

Maybe in the Outback you can buy land for the price of club dues, but not over here, I guess its the price for living in the big city.

If you give a Chimp a gun, and the Chimp shoots, DONT BLAME THE CHIMP!!!!

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11-07-2005 02:10 AM  12 years agoPost 9
Twobeers

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Toronto, Canada

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You have the power. America is the strongest most powerful country on the face of this planet. Its your sworn duty as a good outstanding, proud american to get yourself elected to public office and change this stupid rule. You can do it!

I lost my infamous tag line.

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11-07-2005 02:17 AM  12 years agoPost 10
Saint728

rrProfessor

Honolulu, Hawaii

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Maybe in the Outback you can buy land for the price of club dues, but not over here, I guess its the price for living in the big city.
You can't buy land here either for cheap, buy you can buy a small 100 year old apartment for $1,000,000.00. Sydney is a very expensive area to live as well. Anyway, I wasn't talking about buying land in the middle of the city to build a flying field. I was talking in the suburbs or near some swamp lands you guys have. I have to drive and hour each way to get to a flying field here.

Take Care,
Cheers, Patrick

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11-07-2005 02:34 AM  12 years agoPost 11
Wayne

rrVeteran

Davidsonville, Maryland

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Hmm, buy your own land. There is an 11 acre lot around the corner for $990k, and that is too small.... Guess we won't be buying a field soon. A one acre lot here cost 300k, and we are rural.

Our county (Anne Arundel Maryland) and I suspect many more are politically driven. The guys with the balls win since there are so many of them and they vote. We are in one of the most heli populated areas, and there is still just not enough heli pilots to get their attention.

I've spent a lot of time working on getting fields. Our club pays rent now for a field I found six years agon, and I think it's the way to go. If you can, find a farmer who thinks helis are cool, and try to work a deal. Soybeans get 5.50 to 6.50 a bushel, and in a good year do 50 bushels an acre. Offer them five times that and see if it gets their attention.

Good luck!

Wayne
http://www.flymha.com

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11-07-2005 03:29 AM  12 years agoPost 12
BC Don

rrElite Veteran

Calgary, AB Canada

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No R/C flying in parks etc. here either. Although I do fly my electrics (including TRex) in these areas when no one else is around.

We've got a "deal" with the city where we are on leased land owned by the city that is by a dump. In a number of years they will expand to where we are but till then we are OK. With another club we're leasing some land from a "sand & gravel, cement" company. They have a large lot where they are pulling gravel but we've got an area away from that.

Some other suggestions:

1) As someone else said, is there a farmer nearby that'll let you use some space. If you lease enough for the runway and parking you should still be able to overfly the crops. We do this at one field.

2) Check out any local reserves (first natives). I know of another club that has a flying field on a reserve. They pay one of the locals to keep the field up.

Good up.

Got Money? Send it to me, I'm a Heli Addict.

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11-07-2005 03:38 AM  12 years agoPost 13
Saint728

rrProfessor

Honolulu, Hawaii

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If you can, find a farmer who thinks helis are cool, and try to work a deal. Soybeans get 5.50 to 6.50 a bushel, and in a good year do 50 bushels an acre. Offer them five times that and see if it gets their attention.
If I was a farmer it would get my attention too, lol. $6.50 a bushel times 5 comes out to $32.50 a bushel. Times that by 50 bushels an acre comes out to $1,625.00 an acre. Now times that by 10 acers (size of field) and that comes out to $16,250.00 a year. Your going to have to get a lot of flyers to join your club to make those payments.

Take Care,
Cheers, Patrick

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11-07-2005 04:00 AM  12 years agoPost 14
Bluefin

rrApprentice

Colorado Springs, CO

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Dave "dkshema" has a very good plan. I saw it work the last
place I lived. I lived near Boston ( another high price area).
Organization and work got time scheduled for us on a
field that was used for soccer most of the time.

Now in Colorado, I'm going to try to make the same thing happen
here.

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11-07-2005 08:00 AM  12 years agoPost 15
w.pasman

rrElite Veteran

Netherlands

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I think Dave is on the right track. But I guess you won't have time left to fly if you follow his plan ...

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11-07-2005 08:36 AM  12 years agoPost 16
lpearce

rrApprentice

Pukekohe, Auckland NZ

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If you wanted to get really silly you could state that your not using the land but the air space above it. What hapens in a situation where you fly on your own private land beside a park for instance but are actually flying over the park sometimes. Can they still get shirty about that. I quess so. My mates and I just found a huge bunch of paddocks (must be a couple hundred acres of flat grass no fences or anything just a dirt road into them.) used to make hay and sillage. We knocked on the farmers door and asked him if he would mind if we flew there(no good in your case tho.). He didnt care at all asl ong as we didnt park on his grass. actually he was quite interested to see them in action, most people are quite happy to help as they are just intreeged by the whole heli thing as much as you or I. Good thing is that its only five minutes from my front door too. We dont have laws like that over here tho and I have flown at parks and school grounds heaps of times and no-one really cares. I think the only thing that people get pissd of with is the constant 2 stroke whinning . But even then its only if youre there all day . then I could understand anyway. I must admit tho I always felt bad when flying in public places and was always waiting for someone to come and tell me to bugger off. I feel for you , its a pain when theres nowhere to fly.

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12-12-2005 02:30 PM  12 years agoPost 17
w.pasman

rrElite Veteran

Netherlands

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Congrats!!
How did you do it?

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12-12-2005 02:53 PM  12 years agoPost 18
kaptkaos

rrKey Veteran

Miami FL

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Thats great news! When can we check it out?

Where have you been Gringo?

If you give a Chimp a gun, and the Chimp shoots, DONT BLAME THE CHIMP!!!!

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12-12-2005 03:01 PM  12 years agoPost 19
hoverking

rrKey Veteran

Tennessee

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we have a sweet deal a closed down airport take a look

ive got an idea move to tennessee!

http://caliber30.com/trwchome1.shtml

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12-12-2005 04:50 PM  12 years agoPost 20
Nick T

rrApprentice

West Sussex, UK

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In the Uk a lot of farmers are actually paid not to grow crops on large areas of land. Some subsidise the fallow plots by sub leasing / informal arrangements - wonder if a non permanent mown strip would be acceptable, especially if you could get a number of you and make it worth his while - Just a thought.

Nick T

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