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Home✈️Aircraft🚁HelicopterCentury Radikal G20-30 N640 Hawk Predator › eCCPM Falcon or Bell Cranked Raven?
08-09-2005 07:25 PM  15 years ago
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jackheli

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eCCPM Falcon or Bell Cranked Raven?

After my last Raven crash, when I stripped all gears on the three CCPM servos, I decided to go for a modification to the Falcon that was devised by Bugsyboy, which he calls “The Blings”.

The idea is innovative and works really well. There is still some development to be done in terms of getting rid of minor differential inputs that were easily mixed out (you can see the elevator bell crank is not exactly at 90 degrees with the servo/rod), but as it stands the system really kicks a$$. I flew it last weekend on my bird and was extremely pleased with the results: the crispness of the Raven is still there, but with all its downsides to servo layout gone. I couldn’t see any real disadvantages to this setup.

Gone are the days where the CCPM servos would be in the line of fire and where low AFR values tended to wear only a small region of the servo throw.

Except for the plates, a couple of screws and two bushings, all the parts are readily available in the Falcon’s mCCPM system.

This simple setup, if endorsed by Century, could finally consolidate the Hawk and Falcon with the Raven so that the outcome of the merge would be a helicopter that could be built in either configuration, selectable by the pilot. Century would then need only offer one model on the 30 size range and one on the 50. I can see huge savings in the production line by doing this.

Well done Bugsyboy and thanks.

More pictures in my gallery.
It's easy to find an excuse to do wrong. Hard is not to find an excuse to do right.
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08-09-2005 10:06 PM  15 years ago
JKos

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Redondo Beach, CA

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Great work Jack! Very good thinking. We'll have to pass on your idea about the kits being able to do both.

> you can see the elevator bell crank is not exactly at 90 degrees with
> the servo/rod

I can't seem to see that in the pics shown. Maybe I'm just not looking for the right thing.

- John
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08-09-2005 10:29 PM  15 years ago
Al Austria

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Sacramento, CA - USA

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I thought of a configuration kinda like that before, but I never would of been able to pull it off as well as you have. My hat's off to you!
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08-10-2005 12:23 AM  15 years ago
jackheli

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Vancouver - Canada

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As much as I would have liked the idea to be mine, I am just helping to tweak the setup.

The cudos go to Bugsyboy.

Jkos,

In my gallery, look at the elevator rod and you will see it does not run exactly parallel to the frames. It will be fixed on the next version.

It's easy to find an excuse to do wrong. Hard is not to find an excuse to do right.
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08-10-2005 05:59 AM  15 years ago
wedge

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Victoria BC, Canada

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So its still an eccpm system right. It just used bellcranks instead of direct servo links to the swash.Victoria BC, Canada, Century Swift,Trex SA 450, Hummingbird V3.
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08-15-2005 04:37 AM  15 years ago
jackheli

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Vancouver - Canada

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Flew my hybrid (or whatever it is) today for 10 tanks.

Man, this setup really rocks! I should have done it sooner.

And the servo tail inside the canopy...

Wow, I love my bird!
It's easy to find an excuse to do wrong. Hard is not to find an excuse to do right.
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08-16-2005 09:00 PM  15 years ago
50feet

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Wilmington, Delaware

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I did this a while ago.....
I have a thread here some where. I guess great minds do think alike

Any way did the mod to get the hawk to fit in a fuse where the pitch arm was a problem. The problem I had was the ele lever rod did not allow the same movement as servos so it would tilt the swash a tinny bit at the top and bottom. It flew my bell 222 when the standard set up would not.
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09-01-2005 06:15 AM  15 years ago
RadioRob

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Schaumburg Illinois USA

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I tried the ccpm Idea by drilling holes in the metal pitch frame on both sides where the aft start shaft screws go in to secured the pitch arm lever from moving. The original rod going to the elevator is a perfect length for the ailerons but you will need 2. I had another laying around. The original aileron rod is now the elevator rod. I put the throttle stick to mid stick made everything 90 degrees, changed the length of some of the swash rods to get 0 at mid stick then messed with the swash mix to get around 10 degrees full throttle stick. it all looks good and moves correctly but I don't have a good Eng to try it out yet.

I have some questions.

1.Did you change to a new swash?
2.And did you have to use any mixing to keep the swash from going up and down with elv movement?


Rob...
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09-01-2005 07:05 PM  15 years ago
jackheli

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Vancouver - Canada

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I used the Raven's eCCPM swashplate. It is 120 degrees, which helps on distributing the load of the elevator. It also gets rid of the interference you have on getting the swash levelled on elevator input.

Make sure that all rods coming from the servos are horizontal and parallel to the frames when seen from the top and from the sides. If not you will have mechanical differential input, which is hard to eliminate on the transmitter.
It's easy to find an excuse to do wrong. Hard is not to find an excuse to do right.
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09-03-2005 09:00 PM  15 years ago
RadioRob

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Schaumburg Illinois USA

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I did it
But with a twist
I tried the 3 servo not 120 with a anti-rotation bar but the control sucked
So I fabricated an aft servo mount from sheat metal and made it a true SWH4 4 servos drive the swash All I can say is wow wow wow!!! what control. Real percice

Its not monday so no pics yet on RunRyder but if you go to rc-groups.com under heli fuel I have post started there.


Rob..
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09-03-2005 09:10 PM  15 years ago
50feet

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Wilmington, Delaware

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I did the same...
with the 4 servo 90 CCPM. but since I had that problem with the ele lever it would put stress on the rear servos by pushing or pulling to much. So took it off. I planned to remove the front servo and use the 2 sided and the rear servo but I had to make a mod to use the anti rotation bracket with a ball out on the end. I never got around to it.
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09-03-2005 09:58 PM  15 years ago
RadioRob

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Schaumburg Illinois USA

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That part was tricky at first.
The aft servo control rod has to be the same length as the original elevator pivot part (53mm). Then I had to find the correct servo horn hole and then it was almost perfect.


Rob..
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09-05-2005 07:11 PM  15 years ago
jackheli

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Vancouver - Canada

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Don't forget to post pictures today!It's easy to find an excuse to do wrong. Hard is not to find an excuse to do right.
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09-05-2005 08:42 PM  15 years ago
RadioRob

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Schaumburg Illinois USA

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My Pics


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09-06-2005 05:47 PM  15 years ago
jackheli

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Vancouver - Canada

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RadioRob:

Looks very cool man!

If I may make a suggestion: I would move the ball on the front elevator servo underneath the horn. This will remove some of the differential you have because of the slanted rod. You can see here that the rod is not parallel to the frame = differential.

How complicated was it to make the swash move up and down levelled? did you check it with bubble levels?

Have you flown it yet? Let us know how it goes.

Good job!
It's easy to find an excuse to do wrong. Hard is not to find an excuse to do right.
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09-06-2005 05:59 PM  15 years ago
wedge

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Victoria BC, Canada

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I really like this Idea, since I had a crash a little while ago and stripped all 3 swash servos. Does it fly the same with the same response as the stock setup. Jackheli how is yours compared to the stock setup.

Thanks
Victoria BC, Canada, Century Swift,Trex SA 450, Hummingbird V3.
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09-06-2005 06:07 PM  15 years ago
jackheli

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Vancouver - Canada

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Yes. Cyclic is still nimble and crisp, although I am using the red dampers...It's easy to find an excuse to do wrong. Hard is not to find an excuse to do right.
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09-06-2005 06:11 PM  15 years ago
wedge

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Victoria BC, Canada

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Did you make the carbon side pieces, if so do you have measurments or did you just do it as ya went, and lined everything up. How thick is the carbon.Victoria BC, Canada, Century Swift,Trex SA 450, Hummingbird V3.
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09-06-2005 06:15 PM  15 years ago
jackheli

rrProfessor

Vancouver - Canada

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PM Bugsyboy

He made the cutting...
It's easy to find an excuse to do wrong. Hard is not to find an excuse to do right.
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09-06-2005 10:55 PM  15 years ago
RadioRob

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Schaumburg Illinois USA

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jackheli
You are right, I should move the ball to the bottom.
I set up the heli with the 3 front servos first then watched the back servo movements with the ball just on the outside of the swash ball so I can see any binding then made shore it matched then attached. After it was level with itself I had to fly then trim it out to find true level.

wedge
I have not let the air out of it yet but in my back yard I had total control of every movement. It has (to me) allot more feel than the stock setup. That must be what the Raven owners feel.
I did not make a carbon setup. Mine is stock with just an added rear servo.

Rob...
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