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HomeAircraftHelicopterRadio - Servo - Gyro - Gov - Batt › Gyro gain with S9254 servo
05-06-2005 06:02 PM  13 years agoPost 1
Shagga

rrApprentice

Wiltshire, UK

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What gyro gain are people using on their 9254 tail servos?

I have had 2 burned out in the last 6 months running at about 60-70% on GY401. I did not change the gain settings when I upgraded from the 9253. I kept flying at the same gain settings using the 9254.

I now run at 37%-45% gain on my GY401/9254. The heli holds fine at this setting. This is similar to my GY601/9251 setups. The 9254 speed rating is actually faster - 9254 = 0.6s, 9251 = 0.7s so the whole thing makes sense. The faster the servo the less gain you need.

I must have been running unnecessary high a gain previously. That is why the servos burnt out prematurely. Maybe Futaba should suggest a gain setting with their fast tail servos?

I only use Futaba Gyros - no experience with other makes, but this could be relevant also when using other makes of gyro.

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05-06-2005 08:10 PM  13 years agoPost 2
BarracudaHockey

rrMaster

Jacksonville FL

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Gain setting is just a number without knowing several factors.

Old wisdom was to crank the gain up till wag then back off a few. Futaba is saying now to run the highest gain you need to get the tail to hold in any manuver you perform and no more.

Dr Ben has a write up on the Futaba site under Team Tips which explains it.

Andy
AMA 77227
http://www.jaxrc.com

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05-06-2005 08:34 PM  13 years agoPost 3
blockatvalpo

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Reston, VA

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I run 70% on mine, but like the previous post mentioned there are a bunch of factors that go into setting it. I haven't had to replace my 9253 yet.

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05-07-2005 05:47 PM  13 years agoPost 4
Shagga

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Wiltshire, UK

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I run 70% on mine, but like the previous post mentioned there are a bunch of factors that go into setting it. I haven't had to replace my 9253 yet.
With respect, I am talking about the 9254 NOT the 9253! They are completely different servos. Please read my post.

I am not talking about slop or binding either. None of my tails are prone to this. I am talking within the context of well set up tails. Both my 9254s failed on a well set up slop free EVO 50.

So nobody else out there want to say what gain they are using? With all of these reported 9254 failures. I would have thought this is a big issue.

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05-07-2005 06:20 PM  13 years agoPost 5
dangtsi

rrApprentice

Greenville, Pennsylvania, Mercer

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I am with you regarding the failures of the 9254. I have had three 9254 servos since last July. I too have been running about 70 using a 7CHP Futaba transmitter. I have a 9254 right now (two months old)that I am going to send to Futaba Service which was kicking about 8 inches and suddenly went almost 360 degrees. When they start acting up they seem to usually swing the tail to the right. I use a 3151 servo which works fine but is a lot slower in the mean time.

My EVO 50 is set up correctly and the tail works easily with no slop. My engine is set correctly. The tail belt always has proper tension and I have replaced the gyro tape with the Futaba gyro tape. Some folks may say they use other tape but I prefer to use what Futaba markets.

When I install a new 9254 it works perfectly. I am going to try a lot less gain with the next 9254. Save your receipts and mail them to Futaba is what I am going to do. May be they will make them right eventually. The 9254 servo works great with the 401 but who wants to pay for a new servo every two or three months?

By the way I have flown about 40 gallons of fuel since last July.

dangtsi

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05-07-2005 08:36 PM  13 years agoPost 6
Helitrev

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Suffolk / Norfolk border UK

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On my instructions with a 401 and a 9254 bundled together. it said turn gain to 100%
SORRY THAT IS WRONG I CONFUSED IT WITH THE DELAY.

My sensitivity is set to 90%, sounds like I could be heading for trouble!

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05-07-2005 09:03 PM  13 years agoPost 7
BarracudaHockey

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Jacksonville FL

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Some reading for you

http://www.futaba-rc.com/team/team-tip-002.html

You can also try Raptor Technique he's got several gyro pages.
http://www.raptortechnique.com

Andy
AMA 77227
http://www.jaxrc.com

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05-07-2005 09:15 PM  13 years agoPost 8
dangtsi

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Greenville, Pennsylvania, Mercer

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In the instruction sheet with my 401 under (5) gyro sensitivity setting criteria it states to [QUOTE]start sensitivity adjustment with a gyro sensitivity of 70 ~ 80% when hovering and 60 ~ 70% during flight as the criteria and search for the best sensitivity for the helicopter use.

The 70 percent setting made my EVO solid as a rock in a hover when the 9254 was new. There was not any tail wag during a hover and the helicopter could go straight up without hardly any tail movement.

dangtsi

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05-08-2005 03:32 AM  13 years agoPost 9
blockatvalpo

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Reston, VA

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I did read your post. Like I said I run 70% on my 9253. It is not the 9254, but it will give you an idea of where to have yours. Every set up is different, there are many factors that determine where the gain should be set. The only thing anyone on here can give you is there settings. From there you have to test it out. If someone on here is running 65%, doesn't mean yours will as well. Anything below 50% puts the servo in non-hh mode. Make sure the 401 is in ds mode as well.

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05-08-2005 07:46 AM  13 years agoPost 10
Shagga

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Wiltshire, UK

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Hi blockatvalpo

The 9253 is not the 9254.

That is my point.

You have to set the gain accordingly for the faster servo. The gain setting should be turned down as suggested in the futaba-rc.com website. What I am interested in is - are people still running their 9254/401 & 9254/502 at the Gain settings of 70% -100% the same as with the older 9253 servos. Or are they using lower settings of 37%-60% say with their 9254/401 & 9254/502 combos.

Yes I am in DS mode

Having less than 50% gain does not mean non heading hold! I think you have this whole thing confused.

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05-08-2005 12:32 PM  13 years agoPost 11
Drunk Monk

rrProfessor

Preston, UK

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I run my 401/9254 at 65% on a raptor 50 but do find it doesn't hold good in fast backwards inverted (which is to be expected) but apart from that, everything is pretty good.


Stephen

I only open my mouth to change feet.....

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05-08-2005 02:19 PM  13 years agoPost 12
BarracudaHockey

rrMaster

Jacksonville FL

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Monk, what tail blades are you using?

Andy
AMA 77227
http://www.jaxrc.com

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05-08-2005 02:22 PM  13 years agoPost 13
Drunk Monk

rrProfessor

Preston, UK

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That one has got 90mm NHP's


Stephen

I only open my mouth to change feet.....

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05-08-2005 02:25 PM  13 years agoPost 14
blockatvalpo

rrKey Veteran

Reston, VA

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Actually, I do know what I am talking about. Read here, http://www.runryder.com/t168720p1/?highlight=50%+401 Below 50% put the gyro in rate mode. That is non-hh mode.

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05-08-2005 06:20 PM  13 years agoPost 15
pH7

rrKey Veteran

Sterling Heights, MI - USA

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blockatvalpo & Shagga,

Your disagreement about HH & non-HH may just be which radio you use. My Futaba 9CH will display NORM 0% to 100% which corresponds to 0% to -100% and it will display AVCS 0% to 100% which corresponds to 0% to +100%. So, if you think of the full range of the sensitivity settings on CH5 as running from 0 to100, then anything above 50 is AVCS (HH) and anything below 50 is NORMAL. However the display screen on the 9CH will display as shown above.

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05-08-2005 06:22 PM  13 years agoPost 16
blockatvalpo

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Reston, VA

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I use the JR 8103. This goes into the whole how your system is set up.

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05-08-2005 07:52 PM  13 years agoPost 17
Shagga

rrApprentice

Wiltshire, UK

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ATV and Gain
The amount of gain, HH and non HH are all different, completely unrelated issues.

On my Futaba 9C (in GY mode) I can adjust my 401 gain setting from 0 -100% in HH. Also I can adjust my 401 gain setting from 0 -100% in non HH.

This contradicts what was said earlier:
Anything below 50% puts the servo in non-hh mode.
I think blockatvalpo is getting confused with ATV / EPA setting on the gain channel. In this case the gain value is the absolute amount of ATV from 50% multiplied by 2. 50% ATV being 0 gain.

For example:
25% ATV is 50% gain in normal mode. 75% ATV is 50% gain in HH mode.
20% ATV is 60% gain in normal mode. 80% ATV is 60% gain in HH mode.

My original argument stands.

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05-08-2005 09:04 PM  13 years agoPost 18
dave

rrApprentice

Virginia

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I have 70% dialed in on my Bergen 60, and 65% on my R50.

daveed

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05-09-2005 03:37 PM  13 years agoPost 19
blockatvalpo

rrKey Veteran

Reston, VA

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ATV/EPA for the rudder, sets the piro rate and has nothing to do with the actual gyro. ATV/EPA should be set to 100%, but can be adjusted depending on how quickly you want to piro. So I am not getting it confused. It seems like you have it mixed up if you are using the 8103. If you are using futaba, I have no idea what the settings will be. On the 8103, you have "0" and "1," the "0" is set to 70% for hh and "1" is set to 25% which puts the gyro in rate mode. If you use Futaba, the radio settings will be different than what I am using. I have 70% gain on mine. It all depending on what radio you use. With JR, 70% gain in the gyro sensitivity menu = a little less that 50% gyro. 75% would = 50% gyro. 50% in the JR screen puts the 401 at 0%. So for JR, the 401 is like this 50%-100% is 0-100%. And 0-50% is 100 to 0%.

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05-09-2005 06:10 PM  13 years agoPost 20
Shagga

rrApprentice

Wiltshire, UK

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Ehh?
ATV/EPA for the rudder, sets the piro rate and has nothing to do with the actual gyro. ATV/EPA should be set to 100%, but can be adjusted depending on how quickly you want to piro.
What are you on about rudder and piro rate for??? That's rudder channel - nothing to do with the gain channel on the radio.
You are off on a complete tangent. I give up!

Lets get back onto the right track:

Thanks to those who have responded correctly, stating what gain setting they are using with their 9254 servo. This is all I wanted to know.

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