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Zoom › Just received new zoom400, now what?
05-04-2005 09:32 PM  13 years agoPost 1
Rosa

rrNovice

Canada

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Hello all zoom fliers.Just received my zoom 400 the other day and would like to know what upgrades are needed to make this thing fly right,if any are needed at all.
I have'nt flown it yet as I'm waiting on the electronics.Everything apears to be stock,(white gears,hex tail output shaft)
My biggest concern is the tail gears, they don't look like they will last very long.Before I go and order a bunch of spare gears I would like to hear some input about Tail gears and or belt conversion.(the belt conversions I've seen cost more then the helicopter did,are there alternatives?)

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05-04-2005 10:50 PM  13 years agoPost 2
TomC

rrKey Veteran

Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia

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Rosa, for starters just make sure that the tail output gears are the new beveled ones. Most (but not all) new kits include the beveled output gears, the old straight cut style strip way too easy. Also, replace the stock Al rotor shaft with the upgraded steel one. The stock shaft bends way too easy. If you are not going brushless, the stock one might be ok for now.

These are the 2 main areas of concern. After you get your heli sorted out, search this forum and you will see that the upgrade possibilities are endless! Just make sure that your electronic gear (mainly servo's and gyro) are up to scratch before adding a lot of heli upgrades.

Good luck,

Tom C

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05-04-2005 11:18 PM  13 years agoPost 3
leslie

rrKey Veteran

Hollis, NH - USA

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Hi Rosa,

I've been flying my new Zoom for a few weeks now. I would concur with TomC. Get a set of bevel gears, even if that's what you have. Have an extra set on hand. Same with the main shaft, the stock shaft is butter, get a backup steel on (or two).

I got a battery extender tray, I'm running brushless himax 2025-4200 and TP1320's so it's pretty much required to maintain CG. I also got the wider landing gear kit, I think both from RCHover.

I haven't rushed into belts etc. I've stripped on set of gears (came with the non-beveled type) running into my table saw. Totally my fault Take your time setting up the gear mesh on the tail and main, it will save you alot of problems down the road. They should spin real smooth.

But in the last 4 weeks of daily flying, I have not had any problems so I'm not going to rush into a 75.00 USD (ish) belt kit. Just don't hit anything and stay out of the grass (use a mat)

have fun with it!!

Cheers,
Leslie

Protecting those who protect us

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05-05-2005 07:10 AM  13 years agoPost 4
OICU812

rrMaster

Edson, Alberta, Canada

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Beltdrive, beltdrive, beltdrive.......that will solve allot of future issues in the shogun. Just my opinion. GL

...Once upon a time there were Nitros, flybars and frequency pins...

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05-05-2005 07:34 AM  13 years agoPost 5
Nyala

rrNovice

Basel, Switzerland

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I would stick with shaft first. The belt drive is expensive. I have over 15 hours on one set of bevel tail gears with no sign of wear. Just dont land in grass or strike the tail rotor too often.

If this does not work for you then go to belt drive after.

Mark

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05-05-2005 12:44 PM  13 years agoPost 6
TomC

rrKey Veteran

Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia

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Don't know about the 'Chinese' part but you are right, a small extention of the vertical fin is a very good idea. I extended mine about 20mm (~3/4 inch) by CA'ing a couple of thin plastic strips to the bottom of the fin. Trim the bottom of the strips so it has a little clearance when sitting on a flat surface (table-top). This cheap little upgrade really helps save gears and tail rotor blades!

Cheers,

Tom C

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05-05-2005 08:43 PM  13 years agoPost 7
ericfly

rrApprentice

Cornwall, UK

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I flew with the original gears for ages with no problem. Don't forget to glue in the tail pitch slider pin! Ans dont forget to glue or pin the tail box to the boom to prevent rotation of it.

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05-05-2005 10:32 PM  13 years agoPost 8
OICU812

rrMaster

Edson, Alberta, Canada

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Expensive? I guess in swiss land.... you can find what you need to convert over to beltdrive for less than 20 bucks USD on the net. In my book that is not expensive, way I look at it is rc helicopters hobby is not for the cheaping out kind anyways... is it??. Gears add up in a real hurry as well. And one thing to think about here for the new person getting into hobby is this. People are saying "just do not land in grass", just do not do this etc...... if you are learning sometimes getting things to go exactly where you want them is pretty darn tough. When I first started out it was everything I could do to keep in a small spot for 5 seconds with sweat beading off my skull from stress, lol. Just my opinion folks take what you will with a grain of salt. Good luck

...Once upon a time there were Nitros, flybars and frequency pins...

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05-06-2005 12:12 AM  13 years agoPost 9
leslie

rrKey Veteran

Hollis, NH - USA

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Hi,

OICU812 has a good point, I learned the basics with a hummingbird V2 Fixed pitch. So when I moved to the Zoom I had one altercation indoors with my table saw. I decided outdoors was the place for this machine.

Point being; if you are new to the sport, a belt drive might be economical. I'm past the stage of up and down hard.

I guess it's depends on where you are with your flight training.


Cheers,
Leslie

Protecting those who protect us

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05-06-2005 02:16 AM  13 years agoPost 10
Rosa

rrNovice

Canada

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Thanks for all the input guys.I think I'll stick with the geared tail for now...this isn't my first heli either so I'll try to be careful with the tail.

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05-06-2005 06:57 PM  13 years agoPost 11
TBS

rrNovice

Dacula, GA

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I have had a Shogun since January now and I have yet to fly itfor more than a few seconds at a time. The problems with this thing out of the box are too many to count. I did go to a brushless rightaway which accounted for some of the trouble but I wouldn't expect to fly too much without some changes. Many of my problems and downtime have been due to the fact that I am new to electrics and have had to wait for things like pinion pullers and small files to ship but others have been poor engineering.

The tail is probable the most critical. I would go to a carbon control rod and move the servo back. Glue the pin and lock the shaft in place on both ends with a small screw if you can find one or glue. I had the tail gearbox twist and the tail rotor chopped off the vertical fin.

I am waiting on an aluminum tail rotor gearbow for the belt drive conversion but I think that is the way to go. I have stripped 3 sets of gears, 2 before I put a screw in to hold the gearbox to the tail.

Hope you have better luck than I am having.

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05-06-2005 07:43 PM  13 years agoPost 12
Rosa

rrNovice

Canada

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I'm patiently waiting for the electronics to come.I have a 3700Kv brushless and esc on the way as well as four h56s servos.
I have went over the helicopter a little bit and noticed a few week points with linkages on the tail and washout assembly.
the nice thing about this heli is that you can fab parts for it,I've already added bearings to the elevator assembly as well as a new control arm.
I'm glad I still have that old e-sky piece of crap,it has lots of parts to steal...i.e bearings.

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05-06-2005 07:56 PM  13 years agoPost 13
leslie

rrKey Veteran

Hollis, NH - USA

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Hi Rosa,

Since you mentioned bearings. One of the first things I blew out were the bearings in the tail grips. They are quite cheap, do a search on this forum and you'll see alot of people have had problems with them.

I replaced them with bearing from vxb.com

Once I got over the few, well documented, kinks she's been flying real nice.

have fun,
Leslie

Protecting those who protect us

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05-06-2005 09:47 PM  13 years agoPost 14
OICU812

rrMaster

Edson, Alberta, Canada

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Yes leslie, change the tail bearings you are correcto mundo baby! If you are keeping stock gearcase, definetely change those crappy bearings, preferrably change the ones in the tail rotor grips as well at the same time!!

...Once upon a time there were Nitros, flybars and frequency pins...

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05-06-2005 10:58 PM  13 years agoPost 15
TomC

rrKey Veteran

Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia

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Rosa, Since you are going brushless right away (good move if you already have some heli experience under your belt) I agree with our friends, replace those tail rotor bearings. Go to a bearing shop and buy some quality 2x5x2.5 bearings. Replace the 2 bearings in the tail gear box and the 2 tail rotor bearings.

While you ae there, get a few extra 3x8x4 mm bearings for the tail boom. I use 5 bearing in my boom. Also, check that the middle boom bearing is actually a bearing, not a bushing. The old ones had a bushing and this has caused some drive shaft failures. Just heat up the boom and knock it out with a dowel to get it out.

You want the 2 boom end bearings to be a close as possible to each respective gear and, when assembled, it should be very free running with no axial movement (play) on the drive shaft. I put a small dap of ca on the shaft as close as possible to the output gear and slide a bearing over it. Thread the shaft through the other bearings. but do not insert the input end bearing yet. Just before I install the input gear I put a dab of ca on the outside of the end bearing and slide it over the hex shaft. Push on the input gear and the bearing will slide over the shaft and seat itself perfectly. This should give you a shaft drive that will last a long time and give good tail response, with little or no glitching as well.

Cheers,

Tom C

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05-07-2005 12:09 AM  13 years agoPost 16
TomC

rrKey Veteran

Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia

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Rosa, One more boom tip/trick I forgot to mention. Get yourself some 10mm shrink wrap tubing, the rubbery kind, not the hard plastic kind. Shrink a 1 inch length on each end of the boom (using a heat gun or lighter). This will help give your boom a lot better grip on the frame and gear box. I have not found it necessary to pin the tail gear box (with a small set screw) after this simple mod.

Cheers,

Tom C

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05-07-2005 07:13 AM  13 years agoPost 17
OICU812

rrMaster

Edson, Alberta, Canada

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TOM C ! You have never had the tail gearcase twist with that heatshrink under there? I had on a MicroHeli gearbox on end, even full tight they are not snug. So I thought to use a piece of sandpaper and basically it chewed it up under vibration. I also tried tightly wrapped electric tape, bad idea as well. I took it off and went back to stock one, drilled two small holes on both sides and it is fine. .... However I really wouldlike to venture using the MH one again so I can go with a round ss shaft etc.... wonder.... how confident are you in your heatshrink thing? It has not bundled or wrinkled or poked out of either the frame clamp or gearbox? To shrink.. or not to shrink that is the question....hmmmmmmmmmm

...Once upon a time there were Nitros, flybars and frequency pins...

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05-07-2005 09:52 AM  13 years agoPost 18
TomC

rrKey Veteran

Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia

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The heat shrink work great! After about 20 flights I took the shaft off and the heat shrink was still tight as a drum, no bunches. Once this rubbery heat shrink material (I used 10mm tubing) is properly shrunk it seems to stay there forever. Try it, you'll like it!

I guess if you still want more insurance, you could drill a couple of small holes in your MH gearbox and instal a couple of small screws like you did with your stock gearbox..Good luck.

Cheers,

Tom C

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05-12-2005 08:06 AM  13 years agoPost 19
what_the?!

rrNovice

Adelaide, South Australia

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Very useful thread here....i must say!

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05-12-2005 09:35 AM  13 years agoPost 20
Paul_123

rrNovice

Europe

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Well, first find your tools. Chance is you will use it a lot !
At least I have. And so have all I know who owns this heli.
I'm not sure but maybe the thing I did wrong was going for upgrades right away. Like HS 56/50 & brushless Himax.
I think this kind of engine is way too powerful for the quality of materials this heli is built with.
Yes, belevered gears is fine, but a tad too quick on the throttlestick and the input-gears will strip 4 times out of 10.
This machine is Gods gift to sparepart suppliers.
When it flies, it flies very predictably and all that, but most of the time it sits waiting for repair.
I have just installed belt drive, but it takes a bit of tinkering to make this work as you relokate the mast and this has some concequences for the entire setup.
Would I buy this heli again ?
Not likely.

Paul

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