RunRyder RC
WATCH
 2 pages [ <<    <    ( 1 )     2     NEXT    >> ] 2243 views POST REPLY
05-02-2005 10:33 PM  13 years agoPost 1
chopperguy

rrNovice

edmonton alberta canada

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Hi Just wondering if anyone is using a co-pilot on a gasser camera ship and if so what did you use to get rid of the RF ...? I'm just heard some stuff that it might conflict
please help
Thankz Brendon

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
05-03-2005 07:20 AM  13 years agoPost 2
FCM

rrElite Veteran

Surrey, England

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Angelos
Just about all the regulars on this forum are waiting for Angelos to release his stabilisation system that uses solid state electronics without the need for any horizon to be visible whether that be visible or infrared light.

In my opinion and I have tried a Co-pilot although only on my Raptor 30, the build quality of this unit is way below what you should be considering installing on your gasser especially if you are intend to hang cameras of it as well.

Wait for Angelos and get your name down on his list

Paul.

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
05-03-2005 02:17 PM  13 years agoPost 3
bigdipper

rrApprentice

Wolcott, Colorado

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Copilot
...there's an article in 'QuietFlyer' March 2005 saying that he uses the Copilot in his Benzin 'gas' powered helicopter. "They fly out of sight, and I trust the FS8 all the way." Check it out.

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
05-03-2005 03:47 PM  13 years agoPost 4
pblgml

rrApprentice

Utah

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

I have used the copilot of both my electrics and my hirobo gasser without any problems.

Paul
Fly till you drop! Then fix and fly some more.

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
05-03-2005 08:22 PM  13 years agoPost 5
JETMAN

rrApprentice

WA

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Will they work with ccpm?

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  Attn:RR  Quote
05-03-2005 08:33 PM  13 years agoPost 6
bigdipper

rrApprentice

Wolcott, Colorado

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Coplilot
...Yes. It will work with CCPM.

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
05-03-2005 08:59 PM  13 years agoPost 7
PullPitch

rrApprentice

Bend, OR

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

ccpm
It will work with ccpm IF you use FMAs Rx, which is FM, which some feel have caused gasser crashes.

I'm waiting for the rumored PCM Rx from FMA.

PullPitch
www.skybercam.com

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  Attn:RR  Quote
05-04-2005 12:04 AM  13 years agoPost 8
daveye

rrApprentice

North Carolina

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

I would by anything more from fma. Learned the hard way. Whatever you do, don’t give them your credit card number. I know that dakine is testing a new copilot from a different manufacturer. At least he said he was going to.

David

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
05-04-2005 08:49 PM  13 years agoPost 9
RoadkillBC

rrApprentice

SE Wisconsin

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

It's not a gasser, but...
I spent a month trying to make the FS8 work on my Joker 2, but I never entirely got rid of all the RF interference problems. Range with the motor running was only 130 feet (antenna down on tuned Futaba 9C), and the receiver seemed to inject random glitches which would very nearly bring the heli to the ground. The higher IdleUp1 headspeeds caused even more glitches. I tried every trick in the book - antenna routing, twisted wires, swap with new FS8, use other transmitter, opto-isolators on all channels, move receiver, move sensors, etc. etc. etc. - but I just couldn't trust it. As soon as I moved to the R149DP I was getting over 200' with the range tests, and no more inflight glitches. Rock solid.

It works fine on my airplanes, but it never did play well with my Joker 2.

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
05-04-2005 09:02 PM  13 years agoPost 10
RoadkillBC

rrApprentice

SE Wisconsin

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Oh yea, and I second daveye's credit card comment. They kept my personal card on file without asking me, and then used it on a $1,400 order that my employer placed months later. The company had a different address, different phone number, and was pre-approved to use a purchase order, but I happened to call the order in for them. Because my name was associated with it, FMA used my credit card and then decided not to accept the company's P.O.

I like some of their products, but their business practices and customer support leave a lot to be desired.

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
05-05-2005 12:34 AM  13 years agoPost 11
GauchoVolador

rrVeteran

Tx

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Lets wait for Angelos stabilizer, if it works as claimed it will be perfect for AP/AV, just wait for Angelos device a little more...

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
05-05-2005 12:36 AM  13 years agoPost 12
daveye

rrApprentice

North Carolina

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Roadkill, I think something should be done about those people over there. The RC industry is a close community and it’s a good idea to keep it well informed of businesses that practice like that. As I did I would also inform your credit card company about them. If they get too many complaints they will stop their merchant number.I posted a long winded story about them a while back in another thread I will go and find it.

David

Angelos, bring it on buddy!

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
05-05-2005 02:42 AM  13 years agoPost 13
ehx

rrApprentice

Northern Minnesota

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

just another data point ...
I first used the original Copilot in a Logo 20 (24 cells) three summers ago and it worked just fine. The FS8 version finally came out two Januarys back and I got one to try on my Joker. I spent most of last summer trying to get it to work glitch free. No luck.

Since I had this FS8 version sitting around I recently decided to try it in my Logo 20. The old Copilot had been removed and the heli was setup again for CCPM mixing. I completed 12 careful near ground "flights" with a Rotopod attached and the FS8 receiver acted pretty much like any PPM receiver at this voltage level. An occasional small glitch here or there, but not every flight. OK for fun flying, but not serious camera work.

Yesterday I installed the infrared sensors on the boom and ran the connector wires the same as I had done with the original Copilot a few years back. Again the Rotopod was attached and I flew the heli around a few feet off the ground. It would work fine for a few minutes and then a wicked glitch or two would hit. More like someone reached over and yanked one of your transmitter sticks, but worse. The Rotopod saved the heli. This happened a few more times so I unplugged the sensor cables and flew out the rest of my battery power without incident.

Today I reprogrammed the FS8 and went out to give it one last try and also to confirm that the receiver seemed to be picking up noise through the sensor cables. About 2 minutes into the first flight the heli went over hard. Again the Rotopod saved it from serious damage, but the tail blades did hit the ground enough to break the belt. Without the Rotopod the heli would have been trashed.

All these tests were with stabilization off. Since the tail drive belt broke I couldn't confirm that noise was entering the receiver via the sensor cables, but it seems to be the case. Anyway, in my case the FS8 "failsafe" receiver is more like the "fail for sure" receiver.

The technology is fine within its limits. It too bad FMA's design is just so cheap. Investing ~$25 more into the design - and charging $50 more for a "pro" version - would be profitable I think, but FMA doesn't seem to think that way.

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
05-05-2005 11:37 AM  13 years agoPost 14
daveye

rrApprentice

North Carolina

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Roadkill:
When I had purchased 2 copilots for my observers from Bergen RC with my observers they were both installed by me at the same time. I was new to them was not familiar with their deficiencies. When I began to notice gliching more often I became more obsessed with it. I wasn’t long before I had discovered the deficiencies with the wires and their connectors of the copilot. At this point I had ordered a new unit from FMA and put the complete new unit with wires amplifier and copilot unit on one of the helicopters. Right after doing this I did my test just by moving the ribbon wires a bit with hemostats I notice all kinds of cyclic response from this. I then placed a call to FMA with a complaint regarding the unit. They told me that I was the only that they had ever heard of having this problem! Regardless I had send all 3 of units back to them as they told me that they would replace the original stiff wire with new more flexible braided wire much like the wire that you have on your servo wires and hard wire the units to the pc boards eliminating the cheep connectors. (Just imagine wiring up your servos and batteries with that crap, how much glinching do you think you would have? That sounded great and I was completely satisfied at that point. About 6 weeks later I got a surprise. My units showed to me untouched instead they took 3 brand new units and soldered them! I was really impressed until I got to the bottom of the box and found a bill for 300.00 for this service. What they had done was gone back into their records and retrieved my visa card number then applied this stuff to my card without my approval. I called them up they told me that I was the only one with this problem and they don’t recommend these for people using them professionally. Ironically they knowingly sell boat loads of them to Bergen RC for the observer which is not a helicopter you go buy to put a copilot on and train with! I told them regardless that I wanted them to reimburse me for the money that they decided unilaterally to change on my card. They said that they would do that only if I sent back the 3 fixed units. I had agreed to that only if I could get reimbursed for all 6 six of them that I had purchased and not just the 3 new ones they shoved down my throat. After long negotiation with them they said that they would reimburse me for the 3 new ones they sent if I sent back the old ones with the bad connectors. I was fine with that. I don’t mind paying for 3 if I have 3 that work. I had also filed a formal complaint with visa just for the record.
My card was reimbursed not long after I send the 3 old ones back since then have not had a single glitch on my visa or my choppers.

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
05-05-2005 05:55 PM  13 years agoPost 15
RoadkillBC

rrApprentice

SE Wisconsin

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

daveye - I remember reading about your FMA horror stories during my many co-pilot information searches. What a way to do business! I like your idea about contacting my credit card company - I should have thought of that over a year ago when it happened.

daveye & ehx - I had the same experience with noise entering through the sensor wires. My glitching decreased a little when I disconnected them, but it never went away completely. One of my 30 or so "absolutely final" tests was to mount the opto-isolated receiver 2" away from the carbon body with no sensors connected and the antenna wire strung out away from the heli. When even that test failed I shared my feelings with everyone within a half-mile radius and pouted all the way home. I bought a Futaba R149DP when the tears dried up and all has been well since.

Needless to say I've given up on the FS8 entirely, but since I don't have enough pain and suffering in my life I thought I'd test this unit out too:

http://members.chello.at/general-la..._Elektronic.htm

Just received it yesterday, and it's clearly a MUCH higher quality unit than that bowel-movement from FMA. I'll post a review here once I've had a chance to thoroughly test it out.

Roadkill

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
05-05-2005 08:40 PM  13 years agoPost 16
talk the torque

rrApprentice

SA

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Angelos
Could someone direct me to a webpage or something to get information on Angelos's device. What exactly does this device do? Does it level the pitch and roll pretty much like the older version halo auto pilot but with a better system than using light sensors

Jason

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
05-05-2005 08:55 PM  13 years agoPost 17
daveye

rrApprentice

North Carolina

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Roadkill that is great glad to see your testing that device. Just from the photos it looks like it’s connected much better. I am looking forward to your results as I am nearing completion of my maxi joker and entertain the idea of putting using one of those. I know that Dakine was supposed to test one as well.

David

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
05-05-2005 09:10 PM  13 years agoPost 18
Angelos

rrKey Veteran

nr Oxford, OX11, UK

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Before I make my own autopilot I was using FMA CPD4 co-pilot on a glow heli without problems… other than the usual… not holding too well on cloudy days and being out of trim when you turn the helicopter to a different heading. However, yes the sensor cable could be of better quality and I strongly believe that it should have been shielded. I think this could be the reason many people get glitches on gas and electric helis.

I realise that there are a number of people who are waiting for my system. I am sorry it has taken longer than anticipated but we are now on track and should be available soon. The hardware is now capable to accept a number of analogue and digital sensors and firmware updates can be made at home using USB. We are planning to release a autopilot computer only version first to which you can plug your existing CPD4 analogue sensor if you have one. The digital inertial sensor will follow later this summer.

Jason, the webpage is: http://www.spartan-rc.com/products/ap2000i/ap2000i.htm

Spartan RC R&D

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
05-05-2005 11:29 PM  13 years agoPost 19
capfo

rrApprentice

Texas

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Has ANYONE had good luck with the FS8? I have one that I was going to try on my new Maxi Joker (when it gets here) but now I'm starting to question that wisdom. Way too much invested in this thing to trash it trying.

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
05-06-2005 12:21 AM  13 years agoPost 20
talk the torque

rrApprentice

SA

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Angelos
Thanx Angelos

Looks good, please let me know when you have available and also when you have a price. I want to use this device for a helicam and maybe also a camera stabiliser.

Regards
Jason

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
WATCH
 2 pages [ <<    <    ( 1 )     2     NEXT    >> ] 2243 views POST REPLY
 Print TOPIC  Make Suggestion 

 10  Topic Subscribe

Friday, July 20 - 11:33 pm - Copyright © 2000-2018 RunRyder   EMAILEnable Cookies

Login Here
 New Subscriptions 
 Buddies Online