RunRyder RC
 3  Topic Subscribe
WATCH
 1 page 1229 views POST REPLY
HomeAircraftHelicopterThunder TigerOther › Roll Rate
11-06-2004 05:12 PM  13 years agoPost 1
daren

rrVeteran

Hampshire Sponsored by Quick UK

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Hi all,
Been scratching my head on this one for a week,Having had a Raptor 60 fitted with an os91 ps,8.27 gear ratio, sab 680 blades and loads of bling including the multi holed seesaw.

After a very heavy tail first arrival and needing everything aft of the main frames replaced i decided to change it all to the correct 90 size parts including sab 710 Blades.

My problem is that my roll rate sucks, Before with the smaller disk it was fast enough to do 2 rolls on the way up to a stall turn but now with the 710s fitted i'm lucky to do one.

I'm using 9250 servos that are faster than 9252s but slightly weaker do you think this is the problem?

Daren
Using the ground to reverse engineer

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-06-2004 05:33 PM  13 years agoPost 2
Wes Crockett

rrApprentice

Bourne End, Buckinghamshire, UK.

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

The raptor 60/90 definately has a pretty slow rate compared to a lot of other 90 sized helis.

I've experienced the same problem with mine, even after fitting the metal flybar carrier and moving the mixing arms inboard which is supposed to quicken the response.

Had been running 710 V-blades but just switched to the 690's today.
Would say its improved the situation but not as much as I would like.

Not sure how Alan Szabo gets such good response, especially on those aileron metronomes.

Wes

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-07-2004 02:01 AM  13 years agoPost 3
spaceman spiff

rrKey Veteran

Tucson

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

i don't have a rappy 90, but i do know the paddles are the limitation on the 50 size.

Try some light paddles like the V paddles.

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-07-2004 09:13 AM  13 years agoPost 4
Wes Crockett

rrApprentice

Bourne End, Buckinghamshire, UK.

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Not sure about you Daren but I'm using 95mm V-paddles already

Wes

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-07-2004 11:08 AM  13 years agoPost 5
daren

rrVeteran

Hampshire Sponsored by Quick UK

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Not sure about you Daren but I'm using 95mm V-paddles already
thats what i'm using, I had i great roll rate when it was fitted with 680s it would tictoc all day,
In fact it would move better that my fury tempest,

Has anyone gone from 680s to 710s and found the roll rate the same?

Daren
Using the ground to reverse engineer

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-07-2004 11:09 AM  13 years agoPost 6
Skillmaster

rrVeteran

LA cali

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

i dont fly a 90 or anything but i heard in another forum today in runryder that alan flys the smaller 680-690 main blade disk and anything larger than that like the 700 will give u a slower roll rate, lik ei said i dont fly 90's or anything but i heard 3 huys say this i hope it helps

1992 3000gt vr4

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  Attn:RR  Quote
11-07-2004 11:17 AM  13 years agoPost 7
daren

rrVeteran

Hampshire Sponsored by Quick UK

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

cheers skillmaster,
I've read that too, I only thought i'd try the bigger blades because everyone here rants and raves about how great their Raptor90s flew with 710s.

From my experience and the lack of answers i'm getting here you Raptor 90 guys need to try 680s, You will be suprised at the response you'll get from the Raptor.

Daren
Using the ground to reverse engineer

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-07-2004 09:01 PM  13 years agoPost 8
Wes Crockett

rrApprentice

Bourne End, Buckinghamshire, UK.

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

I've spoken to Alan and he's definately using 690 V-blades now. Didn't say anything about using them to quicken roll rate though, just prefers them because they load the head a little less.

P.S Did a bit more flying using the 690's today and they definately feel like the way to go if your into aggressive flying.

Wes

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-07-2004 09:23 PM  13 years agoPost 9
AMainMaker

rrKey Veteran

Nappanee,IN

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

I got mine rolling and flipping pretty fast. I use JR ds 8311 slow servos and have my cyclic maxed out to where it binds up in the corners. Its really rocking now.I too use the 690 V2s on my machine. I also have a TDG aluminum hub with their hard dampers. using MA paddles with a head speed of around 1850.I am hoping to get some V 95s for mine soon. I believe one of Alans specialties is the airtronics 94758 servos with a speed faster than my 9253 tail servo but torque in the 70's you can't get much faster than that. But I also hear he is pretty quick on the sticks also.
Try putting some more cyclic travel in it that is what Jeff Swartz told me to try and it helped a ton. Right now I am seeing how many degrees i can go before the boom gets ripped off. i am at almost 7 dgrees of cyclic pitch right now and like I said it is getting pretty quick and even with slow JR servos at a .18 speed compared to AJs .08 speed.
Hope this helps
Jason

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-07-2004 09:43 PM  13 years agoPost 10
Wes Crockett

rrApprentice

Bourne End, Buckinghamshire, UK.

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Hi Jason


I'm also using the same Airtronics servos that Alan is using but don't seem to get anywhere near the same performance.

Think I could get a lot more cyclic travel on my machine but unfortunately the plastic hoops hit the head of the bolts which hold on the metal mixer arms. Not really sure how to get round that one.

Wes

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-07-2004 10:15 PM  13 years agoPost 11
AMainMaker

rrKey Veteran

Nappanee,IN

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Man I dont know why you are having troubles. It should flip and roll like mad. I have got mine doing pretty fast knife edge tic tocs without trouble at all. what head speed are you running? thta might be some of the trouble but I dont really know you have fast servos , maxed cyclic, killer paddles, and the best blades out there ???? I am at a lost on this one.I know my machine doesn't perform like AJs but I just figured most of it was lack of his talent . Maybe that is the answer???
I dont use the inner holes in the flybar carrier yet so if I think mine is pretty fast now man cant wait to equip it with the 94758s and V paddles and do the hiller arms. gonna have my hands full on that one.
Jason

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-07-2004 11:13 PM  13 years agoPost 12
Wes Crockett

rrApprentice

Bourne End, Buckinghamshire, UK.

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Yep mystery.

I'm running 1850 on the head which is a fairly high headpeed so don't think thats the answer. Obviously Alan is one hell of a flyer and probably a lot of the performance he gets out of his is due to his talent/being able to make any heli fly decently.

All I know is mine does'nt even come close in terms of cyclic response on rolls and aileron metronomes.

Will keep looking into it though, maybe I've missed something.

Wes

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-08-2004 12:25 AM  13 years agoPost 13
blakka_1

rrElite Veteran

London/Enfield

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

i am at almost 7 dgrees of cyclic pitch right now and like I said it is getting pretty quick and even with slow JR servos at a .18 speed compared to AJs .08 speed.
i wouldnt go any further than 7 degrees of cyclic pitch on a r90 otherwise you'll be asking for a boomstrike mate. 7 is about as far as you can go without the risk of boomstriking.

PM  EMAIL  Attn:RR  Quote
11-10-2004 11:26 PM  13 years agoPost 14
AMainMaker

rrKey Veteran

Nappanee,IN

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

I found your fix for the oval links hitting the scre heads Weaselmeister. I found a pic of AJs rotor head and he uses button head screws in place of the socket head screw so he can run major cyclic rates. I have seen his cyclic on a bench and it is pretty dang high. Hope this helps you on your dilema
Jason

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-10-2004 11:32 PM  13 years agoPost 15
Wes Crockett

rrApprentice

Bourne End, Buckinghamshire, UK.

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Thanks Jason.

Saw the same picture on here a couple of days ago

I've already changed the bolts on mine for some button head screws and can now get a little more throw. Hopefully when I test it out at the weekend it should make a difference. I've also noticed Alan is using flybar weights racked all the way inboard so I'll fit some of those too.

Will let you know how I get on.


Wes

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-10-2004 11:49 PM  13 years agoPost 16
CraigH

rrNovice

Maidenhead, Berkshire, UK

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

I've also noticed Alan is using flybar weights racked all the way inboard so I'll fit some of those too.
Dunno why you would be wanting to put flybar weights on Wes unless you want to run different setups depending on whether you want a softer setup or not on the day.

It won't speed things up thats for sure

Looking forward to seeing you wrestle with the results at the weekend

Cheers

Craig

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-11-2004 12:40 AM  13 years agoPost 17
Alistair

rrKey Veteran

no where land

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

i dont fly a 90 or anything but i heard in another forum today in runryder that alan flys the smaller 680-690 main blade disk and anything larger than that like the 700 will give u a slower roll rate, lik ei said i dont fly 90's or anything but i heard 3 huys say this i hope it helps
funny... before he switched to the 690's his heli wasn't slow to roll at all.....

just add more cyclic pitch and/or use lighter paddles and/or manage your collective better in the roll.

squigle

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
11-11-2004 08:03 AM  13 years agoPost 18
Skillmaster

rrVeteran

LA cali

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

lol u copied my messag, but thats what i heard i could under stand the smaller blades gave his heli less off a load in high throttle manuvers so his head got less stress this is what i heard tho, i dont fly the 90's but this is what i heard from guys who do, they tested this theory too, they tried the 690 and 710 both with the same set up and got a fater roll rate with the 690 and same auto performance because the v's 690 has more cord than the 710 even tho the 690 are shorter the cord gave them that extra umf

1992 3000gt vr4

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  Attn:RR  Quote
11-11-2004 09:49 AM  13 years agoPost 19
Wes Crockett

rrApprentice

Bourne End, Buckinghamshire, UK.

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Ok Craig my mistake, was under the impression that flybar weights fully inboard would speed cyclic up slightly but wasn't 100% sure.

Will try anything to get that roll rate quicker.

Wes

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
WATCH
 1 page 1229 views POST REPLY
HomeAircraftHelicopterThunder TigerOther › Roll Rate
 Print TOPIC  Make Suggestion 

 3  Topic Subscribe

Saturday, June 23 - 5:22 pm - Copyright © 2000-2018 RunRyder   EMAILEnable Cookies

Login Here
 New Subscriptions 
 Buddies Online