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HomeAircraftHelicopterBeginners Corner › Hovering Question
11-03-2004 07:03 PM  13 years agoPost 1
Skyquest II

rrNovice

NC

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Hi

I have just gotten hovering down where I can hover ok for a tank of fuel. Today I flew in an approx 5 mph gusting wind, I was hovering and a gust of wind came up which took the heli into the air approx 8 feet this then got rapidly worse as it seems the higher you go the faster the heli ascends? I was now about 15 feet in the air, I brought the heli down which then was to fast so I had to throttle up to slow her down that made her go up again...I had the rotopod on and everytime I brought the heli down she bounced off the ground with the rotopod and shot back in the air again. I was scared I was going to get a boom strike so had to just let her go into the air until I got some control. I am gonna need therapy after learning to fly these things. Eventually I got the heli close enough to the ground and dumped her down. No damage this time. Just fingernail marks embedded in the TX.

My questions are: Why does the heli suddenly start going up alot faster when one gets about 6 - 7 feet off the ground ?

Is nitro unstable or something..I could not keep the RPM of the engine constant to gain control over the hover..If I throttled up the heli sort of shot into the air and if I throttled down the heli came down a little to fast. There was no precise up and down throttle movement? The heli was bouncing up and down as I tried to get under control, sort of like a sideways feedback loop.

"Gravity is the RC heli pilots worst nightmare"

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11-03-2004 07:13 PM  13 years agoPost 2
BarracudaHockey

rrMaster

Jacksonville FL

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Think of the rotor disk as a large airfoil. For a given wind speed it produces a given amount of lift. If the wind speed increases, the lift produced by the rotor disk increases (without a collective increase) and the heli goes up. Compensate with less collective and the wind stops, the heli comes down. Its a viscious cycle and makes life interesting in gusty wind. You will also see the same effect when you start forward flight circuits and turn into the wind it will go up and turning downwind will cause it to drop. Get used to flying both sticks if you want to stick with helicopters.

If you have a sim crank up the wind gusts to 10 knots and variable direction.

Andy

Andy
AMA 77227
http://www.jaxrc.com

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11-03-2004 07:15 PM  13 years agoPost 3
BarracudaHockey

rrMaster

Jacksonville FL

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You may also have too much negative pitch. Start with -2 degrees on the bottom end if your just learning to hover it will make your collective less sensitive.

Andy
AMA 77227
http://www.jaxrc.com

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11-03-2004 07:27 PM  13 years agoPost 4
Drunk Monk

rrProfessor

Preston, UK

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You gotta love the wind. It really will get easier the more you practice. Don't be afraid of a little wind as it will help get your reactions going and as long as you are aware the wind will take your heli up a few feet and don'tpanic then you won't have any problems. Just watch for the heli coming backwards over your head. If the wind picks the heli up abit, you might have to put a little forward cyclic in (or whichever direction the wind is in) to compensate and keep the heli in one place.


Stephen

I only open my mouth to change feet.....

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11-03-2004 07:37 PM  13 years agoPost 5
Skyquest II

rrNovice

NC

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hi

My pitch on the blades is 0 at throttle bottom, 6 at mid stick and 9 at full stick.

Even with no wind why does the heli suddenly shoot upwards when one gets above 6 feet in the air..its like it suddenly has more lift at certain heights ?

"Gravity is the RC heli pilots worst nightmare"

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11-03-2004 07:40 PM  13 years agoPost 6
caz

rrApprentice

Warwickshire

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I know exactly how you must have felt.
I have -4 on my pitch setting and find thats just fine.I have been told as soon as you feel the wind increase watch the heli and be ready to compensate for lift and when it drops be ready for the decent.
Easier said than done when starting but you soon get the hang of it.
You will also find with the training undercarriage on, the wind will tend to catch those too sending the heli in the direction the wind is going.
( I must pratice what i preach )
The rpm increase could down to the throttle curve,i might be wrong on this though.

Caz

You're only young once; you can be immature forever.

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11-03-2004 07:44 PM  13 years agoPost 7
Drunk Monk

rrProfessor

Preston, UK

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0 degrees on the bottom is why it wouldn't come down in the wind. Make the bottom -2 or -3 then when it's windy you'll still be able to bring it down.

The RPM increase will be because the engine suddenly doesn't have to work as hard because the wind it making it easier.


Stephen

I only open my mouth to change feet.....

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11-03-2004 07:45 PM  13 years agoPost 8
Doug

rrElite Veteran

Port Saint Luice Florida....

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You might put about -2 in there to keep your head speed up when you lower the throttle

First member of Member of Bearings Anonymous

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11-03-2004 07:49 PM  13 years agoPost 9
Skyquest II

rrNovice

NC

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Thanks for all the info...

If I put -2 pitch on the bottom throttle and I have to dump the heli on the ground (pull the stick to bottom position) will that cause a boom strike as the blades go negative ?

"Gravity is the RC heli pilots worst nightmare"

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11-03-2004 07:58 PM  13 years agoPost 10
caz

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Warwickshire

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I have dumped mine on the ground a few times and had no boom strikes as yet.

You're only young once; you can be immature forever.

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11-03-2004 08:35 PM  13 years agoPost 11
Drunk Monk

rrProfessor

Preston, UK

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You have to learn to be alittl e more gentle with the collective. Just try not to panic. The training gear will absorb a lot and you shouldn't have a boom strike.


Stephen

I only open my mouth to change feet.....

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11-04-2004 12:13 AM  13 years agoPost 12
kingair200

rrNovice

HKY, North Carolina

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We must not forget about GROUND EFFECT. Your heli will have a different "feel" to it out of GE. Just a thought.

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11-04-2004 04:37 AM  13 years agoPost 13
okw14

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Morgantown, WV

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All of the above are good points ... especially the ones about getting used to the collective inputs. You will probably find that holding constant altitude is just as hard as, if not harder than, holding left/right or fore/aft position. Even more so in the wind.

One thing I'd like to add that you may look for is excessive slop in the collective linkage. This can cause slow reactions to your inputs that will appear as if the heli has taken off on its own.

Also, if you have an airplane radio with the ratcheting throttle stick, consider converting it to have smooth movement ... much easier to control collective.

If you don't have a sim, try to come up with one. It will make the learning process so much smoother. Just try to be easy on the collective and practice, practice, practice!

Keith

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11-04-2004 01:26 PM  13 years agoPost 14
BarracudaHockey

rrMaster

Jacksonville FL

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One of the nice, if under documented features of the Futaba 9C is being able to give trainer control to selected channels. When I start someone hovering I only give over cyclic at first and take care of altitude and tail control until they get past panic mode. Then give them the rudder then collective.

Andy
AMA 77227
http://www.jaxrc.com

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11-04-2004 11:16 PM  13 years agoPost 15
Skyquest II

rrNovice

NC

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I am using Reflex XTR as my sim.

I was wondering when someone would say that maintaining altitude is just as hard as maintaining sideways movement. Gee I wonder what is in store when its time to go into forward flight

I have a JR XP 6102 TX which does have the ratchet type throttle. I am going to adjust the throttle ratchet tension to see if that helps any.

Thanks for all the info.

"Gravity is the RC heli pilots worst nightmare"

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11-04-2004 11:18 PM  13 years agoPost 16
dadman

rrApprentice

Rockford M.I.

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Landing
When I first learned I had a rotopod and snapped the dowels three or four times when my instructor told me not to land until I was ready, just practice on landing diliberatly. Dont let the heli land it make sure you land it, after it was put to me that way it made it a lot easier and I didnt break any more dowels.

dadman

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11-04-2004 11:31 PM  13 years agoPost 17
Skyquest II

rrNovice

NC

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dadman

I soon found out that one can get into trouble when trying to land the heli gently with the rotopod. I found I was going down, and then as the rotopod hit the ground I would lift the throttle up to lighten the impact on the rotopod, well pretty soon the rotopod was going down, I was going up and a bouncing ball effect happened which resulted in the blades hitting the boom. I have found that when coming down now , I get about an inch off the ground and put the heli down in one movement. Throttle down and heli down end of story

"Gravity is the RC heli pilots worst nightmare"

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11-04-2004 11:41 PM  13 years agoPost 18
carcrasher

rrElite Veteran

east coast

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the reason it shoots up like that is that once it leaves the ground effect area it longer is being sucked in its own vortex. also you should have some negative in there just in case you need to bring it down quickly. I take it that you have a 30 or 50 size heli. the smaller helis get thrown around in the wind a little easier than bigger/heavier helis. the only way that you can cause damage landing is if you chop the collective down if you panic. DON'T PANIC! You're flying the heli, the heli is not flying you. practice bunny hops to get used to landing and adding collective if it looks like you're coming in to fast. practice this on the xtr as often as possible.

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11-05-2004 07:28 AM  13 years agoPost 19
dragonlord

rrVeteran

luton uk

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the ratchet can be taken off you will never fly right with it on

im prity new my self m8 and had the same problem flying could hover strait away even flew it with out a gyro but the one thing i found hard was puting down gentaly like you just keep at it the sim will help it will come to you.

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11-05-2004 03:14 PM  13 years agoPost 20
Skyquest II

rrNovice

NC

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Pathogens

I am hovering in normal mode. My engine does not shut off in full down mode.

Not sure if this is correct but before I start the heli I set the throttle trim switch on the TX to just under half way. That allows me to start the heli. I leave that switch there and then flip the left hand toggle switch upwards (toward me) which kicks in the gyro and stabilizes the tail rotor.

TX was set up by a professional pilot and I am still figuring out all the stuff on the TX.

"Gravity is the RC heli pilots worst nightmare"

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