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HomeAircraftHelicopterThunder TigerOther › Raptor 30 dilemma
11-02-2004 05:04 PM  13 years agoPost 1
blockatvalpo

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Reston, VA

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Ok, so I can't figure out what to do, so I will ask you all. I need some more power from my Raptor 30 which I am currently running an OS 32 w/ Weston pipe. I have 15% CP in it. Will 30% give me a lot more power. I haven't used it in a long time, so I am trying to figure it out. I also have a 46 engine that I am not using. So I am trying to figure out if I should upgrade to a 50 and sell the OS 32 and Weston, or keep the OS 32 and just move to 30% fuel. This way I get more power. On 15% I know moving into aerobatics is going to be difficult.

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11-02-2004 05:50 PM  13 years agoPost 2
Al Magaloff

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12,199 Posts- Enough Time Wasted. See Ya!

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Block, old sport! The 46 with 550's, and 8.5:1 gearing. does really well. I also have an OS32 powered Rap on 30%CP. The 46 is the favorite. I just put on some Hirobo 570's. The blades fly nice, but the added drag with the 8.5 gears killed the power. I'm going to try the 570's with 9.5 gears next. The 46 with 550's and 8.5 on the TJ at a headspeed of 2000-2100 is a real fun heli to fly!

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11-02-2004 06:15 PM  13 years agoPost 3
blockatvalpo

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Reston, VA

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Al, hey man thanks for your reply. So instead of upgrading you think I should just change the gearing around. If that is the case, what gears would I need?

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11-03-2004 02:18 AM  13 years agoPost 4
Al Magaloff

rrMaster

12,199 Posts- Enough Time Wasted. See Ya!

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Try the 30, with the 46 and 550 blades on the 30's gearing first. See how you like it. I tried this combo first, then went to the 50's gearing. The 50 heli with 600's will do everything better, but the 46 isn't bad.

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11-03-2004 02:22 AM  13 years agoPost 5
blockatvalpo

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Reston, VA

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I might have to give that a try. Can I use a Maverick 30 pipe on the 46? I know stupid question, but I figure i would ask. The weston is a pipe so I figure it won't be good on the 46. Just thought the Maverick might be.

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11-03-2004 04:29 AM  13 years agoPost 6
ChrisMoore

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Bay Village, OH

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would the newer OS .37 be enough for the raptor 30 v2 as a beginner setup?

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11-03-2004 11:46 AM  13 years agoPost 7
Ultra Vires

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London, England

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Running 30% will not give you more power-that's a common fallacy.

What it WILL do is give easier starting. It'll also allow you to run a much richer main needle setting which will in turn lead to a cooler running motor under hard use and a wider usable power band. I only mention this latter point because you've got a tuned pipe, and these are great if you're an expert and always run the engine at its peak power rpm, but for any other users they're power-robbing bits of heli-bling.

On the downside, you'll not only be consuming far more fuel, but 30% of what's in your tank (as opposed to 15%) won't actually BE fuel. Remember that for all practical purposes in our models, nitro isn't really a fuel in itself, but a fuel improver. The fuel residues will also contain proportionately more nitric acid which isn't good for the environment or your engines internals. Unless you fly most days, you'll need to swamp the engine with after run oil (NOT WD40!!) to neutralise the acids if you want to keep your engine in good condition. This stuff ain't exactly cheap either...

The Raptor 30 is a great machine capable of teaching you 3-D, even on 15%. IMHO it's more important to make sure that the fuel has a high percentage synthetic lube with about 1 or 2% castor oil to protect your engine when you get the occasional lean run on a high loading head overspeed (remember a governor has a slight lag in operation). You'll also learn for yourself the demands that 3-D makes on the engine, airframe and avionics and this knowledge is invaluable when you progress further.

When you finally need more power, there isn't any subtitute for cubic capacity, so if you REALLY need more power at this stage convert to a 50 size machine (or bigger if you've got bottomless pockets). I've got a Rappy 50 v.1 with an OS50SXH and when it's correctly set up I only need to use 10% nitro, with 15% if I'm running it on a cold damp British winter morning. I'm not at the 3-D stage myself yet, but a friend borrows it regularly as it's better for practicing new manouvres on than his Vigor 90.

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11-03-2004 04:26 PM  13 years agoPost 8
drsuessmn

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Ellendale Minnesota USA

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mp 2 curtis is havin a sale on them over at his site if a dont mind the loud version u can get a pretty sweet deal

[align=center][url=http://smmac.com/][color=deeppink]Just What the Dr ordered[/color][/url][/align]

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11-05-2004 04:28 AM  13 years agoPost 9
Dusty

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Edmonton, Alberta - Canada

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Higher Nitro Content
Have to HUGELY disagree with you on the nitro content there bud.

The more nitro the more power. Proven fact!!

When I was using 15% CP I could only get about 3 tic tocs before my 30V2 on OS32 started falling out of the sky...
When I switched to CP 25% it was kickin'... I'm able to keep the tic tocs going for at least 8 before it even considers coming out of the sky.

I AM into the 3D flying... not hard corp yet, but that will change when the 90 is finished and I have to tell you... when I upgraded the fuel, I noticed a HUGE difference like BANG, right now!

A better pipe will help as well... but the jump in nitro will help the OS32 more than a pipe will.

I'd still go with the bigger engine though... especially if you are planning on getting into the 3D stuff.

Another little bit of proof is this... I was having climb out contests with some of the guys around here that also have OS32's and TT39's and I was still the fastest... and I was the only one running anything more than 15% fuel.

Hope this helps.

Shawn

Canada Shawn

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11-05-2004 04:46 AM  13 years agoPost 10
Spitfire_mk5

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Canada

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Nitro is an oxidizer. More nitro == more oxygen in the combustion, so you can run it richer (more ) and thats where the power comes from.

I still want to see someone try 65% pylon blend in a heli bet you woul dbe lucky to get 5 mins runtime to a tank though

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11-05-2004 02:06 PM  13 years agoPost 11
xagent

rrApprentice

Centreville, VA / MHA member

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After run oil
Regarding the comment on the afterrun oil.

How do you get it into the engine, with the carb hidden by the frame.

ML

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11-05-2004 04:06 PM  13 years agoPost 12
MikeO

rrNovice

Chesapeake, VA

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After Run oil.

Just remove the glow plug and add about 10 drops. Then just spin the engine with your starter to circulate the oil thru the engine.

Mike

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11-05-2004 10:23 PM  13 years agoPost 13
flysacessna

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Florida

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Works fine for me
I don't do anything to incredible.. but I have found that once I finally got my OS 32 dialed in, I have plenty of power in my Rappy. I love the ease of starting and running my OS. It's been great.

[b]Me fail English? That's unpossible![/b]

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11-06-2004 02:07 AM  13 years agoPost 14
littleman

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Pasadena, Ca

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you could try the weston engine and pipe combo it has absurd smooth quiet , light power.
A.J.

Proud member of Teams Castle, MSH USA, Futaba, Scorpion, & Nick Maxwell Products

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11-06-2004 02:30 AM  13 years agoPost 15
blockatvalpo

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Reston, VA

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I have a weston pipe on there now. Do they like 30%. I want to say no, but I am not sure which one I got. I believe that there are two different ones, one for high nitro and one for low nitro.

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11-06-2004 02:36 AM  13 years agoPost 16
littleman

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Pasadena, Ca

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cant speak for the pipe but the engine is happy with 15%
A.J.

Proud member of Teams Castle, MSH USA, Futaba, Scorpion, & Nick Maxwell Products

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11-16-2004 02:36 PM  13 years agoPost 17
Ultra Vires

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London, England

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Have to HUGELY disagree with you on the nitro content there bud.
It's the wider useable power band that you're able to tap into that improves the situation. With lower nitro (narrower power band) and an engine that is constantly running at higher temperatures (like in 3-D) a slight drop off in rotor head speed will lose a lot of torque. All engine governors have a slight delay, so do not overcome this particular problem. Once you're out of that peak torque band the governor can't do squat about it until the loading demands on the engine have reduced.

Just re-read the second paragraph of my posting. It doesn't contradict your point at all.

My point still stands: you DON'T have to run expensive and damaging 30% for everyday flying, and you CAN do 3-D on 15%. Sure, competitive flyers might benefit from 30% but it's a trade-off in terms of running costs and engine wear. Although I don't can't do 3-D yet, I've got a friend with a Vigor 90 who regularly uses my machine for practicing such moves, but whenever he runs 30% he normally swaps the engine beforehand. Most of the practice is done at 15% without any problems.

Dragsters run insane amounts of nitro, but use a huge amount of fuel and need an engine rebuild after a race session.

Q.E.D.!

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11-16-2004 07:48 PM  13 years agoPost 18
Billy Zimmerman

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Rainier Oregon

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Running 30% will not give you more power-that's a common fallacy.
I dunno about that, at least for me my raptor came alive with power when I switched to 30% fuel, 30% fuel=more power shorter run times, 15% fuel= not near as much power a few more minutes of run time, so you just sacrifice flight time for power, i went this route!! i love power!

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11-16-2004 09:51 PM  13 years agoPost 19
Ultra Vires

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London, England

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I think you might want to review what you wrote in you last two posts and remove all the bull$hit
Janek, if you want to use the wrong end of your alimentary canal to voice your opinions, that's fine but I'm not getting into a micturating contest with you.

I'm prepared to accept reasoned arguments, but plain abuse is a waste of everybody's time unless it's genuinely entertaining or educational.

Feckless onanist!

Raptor 5: No problem here. See my earlier reply to Dusty, same argument.

Rob

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11-16-2004 10:45 PM  13 years agoPost 20
Unbalanced

rrVeteran

Melbourne, Australia

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So the dragsters that are running high nitro (60% I believe)/methanol mixes are after a more useable power band ? Ah - I think you'd have to give way on the statement about higher nitro not providing more effective power. Like adding a turbo or other forced induction system - a mechanism to allow more fuel to be burned per cycle.

The 30 is a little marginal - ok if you are smooth and have it together. The Weston is a great little pipe and you may be getting about as much as you can expect from the 32. Can't beat the cubes - although I haven't tried the 46. I upgraded my v1 30 (TT36) to a TT50pro just with a change of gearing - left the boom/clutch/blades alone and it is practically unboggable. Just had to cut down a set of R60 tailblades to give me some more tail authority for fast backwards and it goes very well. Might we worth investing in a governor (I have the TJ pro) with the 46 to get the most out of it with smaller blades - my 50 (on 20% nitro) will overspeed 550 blades even with +/-10 degrees. The manual throttle curve has a max of around 85% to keep it at 1800.

Jeff

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