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HomeAircraftHelicopterMain Discussion › Cyclic Rings...does it get any better than this....
11-03-2004 01:02 PM  13 years agoPost 41
davehour

rrElite Veteran

Guayama, Puerto Rico 00785

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Good point about the exponential vs. binding at the corner.

David

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11-04-2004 01:51 AM  13 years agoPost 42
AA8VL

rrApprentice

Columbus, Ohio

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Due to overwhelming PM's here are the ID and OD of the Futaba cyclic rings.

ID=1.150" (29.21mm)

OD=2.20" (55.88mm) (up to 2.37" should work (60.20mm))

My ring is roughly 0.10" (2.54mm) thick. However, I dought thickness realy matters.


The cyclic ring is held on by douple sided tape. You want to use the thinnest stuff as possible...like you can see through it thin. Cover one whole side of ring in this tape...then take an xacto knife and cut around the OD and ID. Peal backing off of tape and stick to TX.

Save time when crossing a one-way street by only looking in one direction

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11-04-2004 01:55 AM  13 years agoPost 43
BigChopper

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Cambridge, UK

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r u a swinger?
My ring is roughly 0.10" thick. However, I dought thichness realy matters.
Jeeez, some people dont think before they type... C'mon fella, this is a family show

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11-04-2004 02:00 AM  13 years agoPost 44
AA8VL

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Columbus, Ohio

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Swinger=Yes

I swing between my raptors, xcells, ergos, centurys, and maybe a kyosho every now and then. I dont realy care, but I do prefer the smoothness of Xcell!!! I guess I swing Xcell most often!

Save time when crossing a one-way street by only looking in one direction

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11-04-2004 02:24 AM  13 years agoPost 45
Ivan

rrVeteran

Wichita

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Ummmm.

I set my heli up so there s no binding in the corners to start with. Then if thee isn't ehough cyclic rate, I use different paddles, or mess with the head mixing ratio.

I can definately see the rings making a "smoother" piro flip, but I have watched closely a video someone put together of a gent doing several consecutive piro flips, and holding the heli stationary over the ground. It looks as if the "circle" made by the stick, was not centered around the center of the travel, and the "circle" tended to migrate around, depending on what the heli was doing, or not doing. this along with the collective being inconsistent, makes me wonder if the ring could eventually be a hinderance?

I am by no means a piro flipping fool, but I can manage a couple in a row, and I don't think I even hit full travel when I try them.

Anyway, this is an interesting discussion, and I think I am learning more about other's techniques, and should come out on top either way.

Ivan

Back to it!

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11-04-2004 02:54 AM  13 years agoPost 46
Havoc

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Ky.

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this along with the collective being inconsistent, makes me wonder if the ring could eventually be a hinderance?
Thats what I am talking about. The cyclic ring is not a piro flip aid. It just aids in preventing the swash from craming against the mast depending on how you like your setup.

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11-04-2004 03:12 AM  13 years agoPost 47
Alistair

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no where land

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i feel like it hinders me... it also gets in the way of piro flips for me.... you stir is not always certred... it changes a bit depending on what you are doing... ie piro-flipping loops, piro-flip circles, squares etc... i don't like anything in the way... i do a lovely piro-flip, and i can do it all day... the ring isn't going to improve your timing. it won't make you do it better... and if you're going 'round the entire ring you haven't got enough cyclic... whether it's your cyclic pitch, your mixing ratios, or your paddles are too heavy.....

squigle

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11-04-2004 03:32 AM  13 years agoPost 48
Helinutnz

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below 42 South

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You hardened guys
Take your Gyro off,. Take your cyclic ring off. Take your glasses off.
Take your GV1/TJ pro off. Get rid of your fast servo's. Ditch the mixture servo. Smash your kline pump. Be an enthusiastic heli flyer and do it the hard way. Dont need any prissy things like these to help your heli fly!!! Never used to have most of these things.
Just let me know when you are going out and I'll go hide in the clubhouse.
These are all great tools to help make your heli fly real nice. Why wouldn't you want them. Technophobia?

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11-04-2004 03:46 AM  13 years agoPost 49
Havoc

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Ky.

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I wasn't knocking it. I have one. But I don't pass it off as an auto pilot either. Its also good on some micro helis where you don't have many setup options on the head to get the cyclic you want without binding in the corners.

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11-04-2004 03:47 AM  13 years agoPost 50
Alistair

rrKey Veteran

no where land

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hahahahaha a ring isn't going to make anything fly better.... again, gyro is not a good comparison... if you don't have a problem going into corners... if you know how to control your heli, and if you learned to fly with out one, then you don't need one. that's all there is too it. if you feel you need one, then by all means use one. good god. not everyone has a liking for them, just like everyone does not like futaba, or JR, or airtronics...

so if we're "hardened" 'cause we can fly with out one, then fine... we are nice and hard... "the beach is that way"

some top fliers use them, some don't... you can't use curtis to vouch for the ring, 'cause he flies with a bloody ski pole sticking out of his radio...

go fly... use your ring... i don't care... i just don't like them...

good day

squigle

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11-04-2004 08:39 AM  13 years agoPost 51
Crusty Commie

rrApprentice

Wales

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oh joy, drama-queen pm's and stuff

I am dsylexia of borg..resistance is fruity...your arse will be laminated

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11-04-2004 03:39 PM  13 years agoPost 52
Dan Lewis

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Tampa, FL

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A cyclic limiter ring is like a skid stop
I think everyone here is right because there are, as always, more than one way to solve a problem. What I take issue with, is the definition of the problem. Please allow me to explain myself and introduce my own analogy of the cyclic limiter ring.

The same way I use rubber to prevent me from wearing and damaging the bottom of my skids on pavement, the plasitc I place around the cyclic gimble keeps me from accidentally moving the swashplate towards a geometrically impossible position. It does not help me fly better. Likewise, a skid stop doesn't train me to make better landings. Neither does a cyclic ring help me to manage cyclic vs collective better. On the contrary, since I'm now able to use the full throw of the swash without any worries of binding, collective management is even more important. You might even consider naming it a cyclic enabler instead.

I can avoid wear on my skids by modifying my flying (e.g. don't land on pavement). I also could never put the stick in the corners when I give cyclic inputs. This is hard to avoid sometimes when your focus is on the model and you're making some radical moves at a very high rate. To never go into the corners 100% of the time would take an unnatural amount of dexterity.

In the past, I avoided binding the cyclic servos by setting up my model's ATV's (end points) for fore/aft/right/left to be less than 100%. Unfortunately there is no radio programmable limit, or end point for all of the 360 degrees that we use. Because of this, I'm prevented from setting the limit in software. I played with many mixes to find a solution in my radio's and there was none. I want and need my end points to be 100% for the four points out of the 360 degrees of the swash that are important to me:

0 deg. @ fore
90 deg. @ right
180 deg. @ aft
270 deg. @ left

However I also want to prevent binding for the other 355 degrees (it is physically impossible to tilt the swash plate outside of the circular arc created by its circular shape). Setting max throws (max ATV's/end points) at these four critical points is the only way to maximize the physical capabilities of your model.

Use of expo with cyclic limiter

If you use this full-throw setup to where all available swash travel is at your disposal, adding expo for a smoother center stick position may be preferable, and I would recommend it depending on the style you fly.

An enhanced cyclic ATV feature

Why not? My throttle to swash mix works in such a way (9Z not 9C) so as to overdrive the servo while respecting the ATV limit and not bind. Modern radio's do have this cyclic limiting feature implemented in software, it's just not complete yet. It's not complete because it only lets us set the limit on 4 of the 359 possible points. I assume this is the case because the radio manufacturers began many years ago by adapting radio's from planes for heli use. The right solution is to provide an enhanced cyclic ATV feature to the software program that we already use. This would allow mode 1 through 4 to work equally well.

We'll eventually get there. For now, I'll snap on the cyclic ring and use my skid stops, both to prevent damage to my heli while enabling me to fly it closer to it's physical limits.

You can also find the FmP cyclic ring at Rick's .

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11-04-2004 03:48 PM  13 years agoPost 53
RotorX

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London

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Ifs its available and you want to use it - do it - if you dont, pipe down ya noisey buggers

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HomeAircraftHelicopterMain Discussion › Cyclic Rings...does it get any better than this....
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