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HelicopterMain Discussion › Any issues with CF tail booms?
12-06-2017 11:04 AM  4 days agoPost 21
MattJen

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UK

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wasn't there an issue in the early days with belts and carbon booms ? where you were advised to spray Anti Static solution onto belt ? I appreciate this was in the 35meg days where we all were paranoid about anything that potentially could cause a glitch/lockout.

I just wondered if that is still the case as all my machine are torque tube.

Just be interested to see what the latest thinking is.

All The Best

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12-06-2017 02:49 PM  4 days agoPost 22
Heli Fanatix

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Fountain Valley, CA

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If you are concern with static electricity, there are a few things to consider:

Humidity
- higher humidity, less chance of static
- there is more moisture to discharge into the air

The pullies is generating AC current
- hold an AC 120V contactless tester and you will see it light up
- the belt and boom is where the static charge is built up
- when there is so much build up of static energy, it has to go somewhere
- usually to the nearest electronic
- etc: gyro or tail servo

Solution
I've seen some pretty elaborate, creative and over kill anti static method. The concept is just to run a conductive path to displace the static charge and minimize any potential build up of static charge.

My simplest approach for my Logo is
- run a wire from the motor plate to the screw where I pin the boom to frame
- test for continuity with a volt meter
- Logo's are susceptible to ESD b/c of its plastic (isolating) material
- to test other heli, just test pulleys against motor plate

Silicone
- ideally it's any type of lubricants
- but silicone grease works to also preserve the belt for quite some time
- the grease help to descrease friction and reduce ESD build up

Your TT will reduce the level of potential static build up ... but there is still a little bit.

Most heli that have an idler pulley attached to CF frame will help displace the bit of ESD such as
- Goblin
- Compass 7HV, Atom 500, etc

Another example would be like this:

Consider you got a cup
- it's being filled with water
- at some point it will fill up and spill out
- than you put a small hole
- water will drain out slowly and not cause a spill out

The heli is the cup
The water filling the cup is the static
The hole is your conductive path
The water not spilling out represents the idea of preventing a Electrical Static Discharge

Hope this helps

- Scott

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12-06-2017 05:37 PM  4 days agoPost 23
Pistol Pete

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Seffner, FL

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Electrical Conductivity (siemens)

In my search for answers outside the heli hobby (sailing-mast) I can share the following:

Is carbon fiber conductive?
Yes.

Can carbon fiber be made less conductive?
Yes, but something reserved especially for commercial applications. The odds that such procedure is done for our toys is nill.

The gravy question...
Is it any more conductive than aluminum?
No, BUT it does require special procedures when used commercially.

Do I ground either of my belt driven tail rotor gasser or align electrics with ALU boom?
Nope...nor have I sprayed them with anything. Living in Florida it's not an issue...yet.

I do recall the first Align gyros having static issues when mounted on boom. They had a shiny metallic finish to them which can make you wonder about FBL units and or servo with metal casing. So, perhaps should consider grounding boom if you have such and as mentioned, live in non humid area.

Would I be the first test pilot for an all carbon composite airplane in an electrical storm?
Nope. (just for fun and giggles)

~~Enjoying the hobby one flight at a time~~

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12-06-2017 06:15 PM  4 days agoPost 24
EEngineer

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TX

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Before adding belt lubricant, you might want to check out what a belt manufacturer has to say about lubing a belt.

https://www.bandousa.com/html/pdfs/vbelt_timingbelt.pdf

Logo 600SXs, 800XX, TDR IIs

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12-06-2017 06:54 PM  4 days agoPost 25
EEngineer

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TX

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Also, have you ever noticed that on your vehicle, the negative connector of you vehicle battery has a smaller diameter cable that attaches to your vehicle frame?

Run a strap from your heli frame to the negative of your ESC connector.

So that any static is referenced from the main battery negative....and not through the electronics.

FWIW

Logo 600SXs, 800XX, TDR IIs

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12-06-2017 07:09 PM  4 days agoPost 26
RM3

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Killeen, Texas - USA

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I think this static issue has alot to do with belt material... I had a belt on one heli that was bad for static and running a thin 30ga wire back from the tail fixed it.... then a heli with a dark belt (lots of carbon) and never had a problem... it was the other heli with Kevlar and near clear belt that had all the issues.

But with Torque Tubes I have never had any issues be it in an aluminum or CF boom.

showing a preference will only get you into trouble, 90% of everything is crap...

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12-06-2017 08:43 PM  4 days agoPost 27
EEngineer

rrProfessor

TX

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And no belt tension issues with TTs....

Logo 600SXs, 800XX, TDR IIs

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12-06-2017 10:07 PM  4 days agoPost 28
ICUR1-2

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Ottawa, Ontario

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Static issues
the protos 500 had that issue when it first came out and was easily fixed by grounding the tail boom.

I guess depending on where you fly it can be an issue.

TT might be more costly in a crash but I never had to re adjust it either or ever worry about static discharge.

spending time, paying attention

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12-06-2017 10:29 PM  4 days agoPost 29
RM3

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Killeen, Texas - USA

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I went with a TT over belt due to the belt resonating at multiple frequencies in my gasser, which changed depending on tension... granted the TT did the same thing until I added a third support bearing. The biggest issue was the drag on the drive system during Autos on the G20... with the additional weight, there wasnt much left at the bottom.

but since going up to 700 on the rotor and keeping the weight very close to the 600 it was born from, the Autos are much more forgiving and the TT helped alot.

I know that reducing the tail boom weight may increase performance slightly, but concerned that maybe as it stands the system is in balance in terms of vibration with the heavier Aluminum tail boom...

I may once again fall into the performance game and play with design, weight and power... but with winter at our door, only things I can do are limited to what can be accomplished on the bench.

showing a preference will only get you into trouble, 90% of everything is crap...

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12-06-2017 11:17 PM  4 days agoPost 30
ICUR1-2

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Ottawa, Ontario

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It is certainly the right time of year for building or rebuilding.

spending time, paying attention

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12-07-2017 11:36 PM  3 days agoPost 31
MattJen

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UK

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interesting answers guys, thanks for taking time to reply to my question.

All The Best

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12-08-2017 12:11 AM  3 days agoPost 32
Pistol Pete

rrProfessor

Seffner, FL

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The biggest issue was the drag on the drive system during Autos on the G20
RM3
I definitely need to have someone video mine and share. Given they are not competition worthy as far as hitting the right spot for a win but ever since I got your custom beefed up eng. mount, I dont hesitate doing them continuosly. Definitely a challenge doing them with a bird that weights like a 700 with 600 blades.

~~Enjoying the hobby one flight at a time~~

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12-08-2017 04:04 AM  3 days agoPost 33
EEngineer

rrProfessor

TX

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Was it nose or tail weights?

Logo 600SXs, 800XX, TDR IIs

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HelicopterMain Discussion › Any issues with CF tail booms?
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