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HelicopterMain Discussion › Aero ignorance
10-30-2017 01:26 AM  23 days agoPost 1
3dorbust

rrNovice

Hudson Florida usa

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I read RR Post's and all I could about tail blowout and tail holding. The problem I have is my tail whipped around 180 again. I had I happen before and got some good feedback and thought it was done. I also asked if a good hs servo might slow down. It should be NO but I landed checked things and my tail servo was vary warm. Also unhooked the link rod and the servo moves fast one way and slow the other. No binding or tail issues found. I replaced it with new but slower servo and just before liftoff it blows out same way every time no matter what I do. So help? And I read Post's on prop or rotor efficiency wow! It's hard to understand why if a motor has more torque than is being used by the blades that larger ones are less efficient. Am I to believe that smaller tail blades are the way to go? I understand drag but I don't have a glider it's a powered system that is not being over taxed in any way. Why would it hold right up to liftoff then lose hold? Can anyone enlighten me?

I know how Icarus felt

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10-30-2017 01:58 AM  23 days agoPost 2
Gearhead

rrMaster

Vt

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I also asked if a good hs servo might slow down.
if I saw that question I would have answered "yes", I had 2 Futaba tail servos slow down, on the first one I raised the setting in my TX until it got so bad I had to remove it, on the 2nd one I just raised the setting once, when it slowed down again I knew better and removed it
Am I to believe that smaller tail blades are the way to go?
I wont comment about electric Helis, but on my 50 size glow Helis I always enjoyed larger than stock tail blades

Jim
Buzz Buzz Buzz

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10-30-2017 02:44 AM  23 days agoPost 3
3dorbust

rrNovice

Hudson Florida usa

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Aero ignorance

More info. It's a 450 with a new belt and a new mx450 align motor 3400kv. All was good for ten or so flights then the servo went. So I will get a new tail servo and see how it goes. The new motor has plenty power for me and I think my new carbon fiber tail blades are 61 mm does anyone use larger ones on a 450?

I know how Icarus felt

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10-30-2017 04:39 AM  23 days agoPost 4
utahbob

rrVeteran

St. George Utah

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I have two trex 450's

I have used the Futaba 9650 digital servo on both with great results. .it looks a little big mounted on the tailboom..but it really holds..also..do a search on here for "chinese weights" and read up on that mod..it can really help!..i've always used the trex 450 carbon tail blades.

I do a great decending funnel!

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10-30-2017 01:17 PM  22 days agoPost 5
dkshema

rrMaster

Cedar Rapids, IA

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Servos don't operate at normal speed in one direction, and at a different speed in the opposite direction (with no load on the output) unless they are sick.

Getting hot is not normal. Is your flybarless controller operating the servo at a frame rate (update rate) higher than the servo can handle?

Is the gyro gain set incredibly high?

Are you operating at a higher voltage than the servo is able to handle?

Using a slower servo may not help -- If the servo is too slow, you would need to be able to adjust a "delay" setting to make the tail behave properly.

-----
Dave

* Making the World Better -- One Helicopter at a time! *

Team Heliproz

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10-30-2017 06:22 PM  22 days agoPost 6
ticedoff8

rrKey Veteran

Morgan Hill, CA. USA

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+1
I agree with the previous comments.

I would check your FBL gyro 1st.
If you have the option to set the refresh rate of the servos, I would start by lowering it by 1/2 (EG: currently @ 333Hz,, lower it to 170Hz).

I don't think this is an "Aero" problem.

Believe 1/2 of what you see and none of what you hear.
Fake News will be the downfall of our Republic!

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10-30-2017 07:08 PM  22 days agoPost 7
Ladymagic

rrKey Veteran

South Korea

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+1000 for dkshema,

From your description, it really sounds like your pulse/frame rates are improperly set. I would ask you to check your FBL controller's settings after looking up your servo's pulse rate specs online or on the packing if you have it.

If your numbers are incompatible, it may cause your servo to perform poorly and/or eventually fail completely. Having a tail servo fail in flight is always a great time.

Also, double check your output voltage to the tail channel. Many tail servos are not rated to handle over 5V and may burn out running higher voltages over time. Many ESCs are set to operate at 6V unless you adjust time down.

Good luck.

Mellisa

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10-30-2017 08:38 PM  22 days agoPost 8
Flyin for Jesus

rrVeteran

Dana Point, Ca.​92629

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What tail servo are you using?
What servo are you thinking about changing it to?

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10-30-2017 08:51 PM  22 days agoPost 9
SkyKing

rrApprentice

Belvidere, Ill

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If it blows out just before lift off check to make sure your servo is moving in the correct direction. Sounds like it is reversed
Just a thought
Terry

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10-30-2017 08:56 PM  22 days agoPost 10
JuanRodriguez

rrProfessor

The Villages,​Florida

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SkyKing
If it blows out just before lift off check to make sure your servo is moving in the correct direction. Sounds like it is reversed
Just a thought
Terry
If either the servo or gyro were reversed, it would spin continuously and not just 180 degrees described by the OP....

Been there, done that and old enough to know better.....

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10-31-2017 04:51 AM  22 days agoPost 11
dkshema

rrMaster

Cedar Rapids, IA

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After some serious deep Web searches, I find the original tail servo on your Walkera accepted a 333 Hz frame rate and a 1520 us neutral.

If your Savox servo can't handle a 333 Hz frame rate, you are slowly cooking it to death.

Walkera gave up on RC helis ... which is a good thing as most were crap.

You have already fried an ESC and apparently more than one servo. It might be time to flush the Walkera s**t and spend your hard earned dollars on something much more mainstream and proven.

-----
Dave

* Making the World Better -- One Helicopter at a time! *

Team Heliproz

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10-31-2017 05:03 AM  22 days agoPost 12
EEngineer

rrProfessor

TX

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A Logo comes to mind.....

Logo 600SXs, 800XX, TDR IIs

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10-31-2017 05:10 AM  22 days agoPost 13
dkshema

rrMaster

Cedar Rapids, IA

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Savox SC1258 ... good for no more than 165 Hz frame rate. You are cooking most servos that you are using on the tail.

I rarely ever advise dumping equipment in favor of another brand, as I understand the investment already on hand, and what new stuff costs.

But...it is time to use your Walkera stuff as a boat anchor somewhere (or it would make some fine pistol range targets), suck it up, and buy something decent. You're throwing good money after bad and not flying.

-----
Dave

* Making the World Better -- One Helicopter at a time! *

Team Heliproz

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10-31-2017 10:59 PM  21 days agoPost 14
utahbob

rrVeteran

St. George Utah

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I gotta agree..

Switching to a model that is in general use with components that are known to produce good results would change your whole experience in the hobby..I've seen so many guys try to "fly on the cheap" and end up giving up because of it!

I do a great decending funnel!

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