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HelicopterAntiques or Out of Business › Gmp competitor parts compatibility
05-25-2017 03:03 AM  34 days agoPost 1
DeeBee123

Heliman

Rossville, GA

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I start this thread ,because I made what for me was an exciting discovery that allowed me to get a tail speed up drive , as well as be able use more standard main gears without the gearing on top.
I hope that this and other parts interchangeable with the GMP competitor can be listed and discussed here.

When reading a Google Groups group for the competitor.

I found where early Hirobo SST (didn't mention which model with the SST option included stock) tail drives were the original source for the tail speedup upgrade for the competitors.
Any how I found this which is said to be the same part as the tail speed-up for the competitor.
According to VHRC, with 600mm bladez the gph 346 filled the gap between the shuttle and then (1995) larger .60 size birds.

HIROBO GPH 346 TAIL DRIVE PINION ASSEMBLY

Many X -cell 60 parts will work on or are functionally and visually the same as the competitor.
X cell 60 clutch drive , and starter cone interchange with the competitor

Anyone who has any other compatibility information.
Such as what gears might work, a possible belted tail or TT setup that's compatible (early SST?), which tail boxes fit the boom, etc.
Please post it up, with the available parts disappearing fast, current fliers and new adopters such as myself are going to have to depend on more recently made or still produced compatible and adaptable parts to keep these vintage classics alive.

Thanks

https://rc.runryder.com/helicopter/t102330p1/

I noticed this post where someone apparently used a shuttle main shaft, as well as a Kalt Baron 30 tail box
It is also mentioned that shuttle tail grips are the same. These compatibilities are for the Falcon 888 which uses the same main and tail as the competitor.

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05-28-2017 08:58 PM  30 days agoPost 2
DeeBee123

Heliman

Rossville, GA

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Currently tearing down the Competitor to the frame, so I can have the front part of the frame TIG welded. Since this is necessary I have decided to do a full build/restoration on it.
Along the lines of parts compatibility I am working on getting the standard bearing quantities, sizes and locations together and hope to be able to make a complete list.
Bearings in the parts list or listed as 10-15 or 15-20, sometimes they are listed by bearing code.

I know you vintage guys are out there (probably on the field flying) I would greatly appreciate any help getting this info together.
Knowledge and info for these machines is dying fast.
Twice now I found my information was inaccurate on my own and was able to correct it. I hoped those more knowledgeable would have noticed and corrected me.

Metal shielded and deep groove bearings are preferred. Bearing code listed is for double shielded. Sizes in mm
I have yet to pull any other bearings or even check to see if mine is full bearing or bearing/bushing setup.

Bearing info is being placed in an Excell file a raw version will be posted for review and corrections, after which a complete version will be posted likely in PDF format.

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05-29-2017 04:39 AM  30 days agoPost 3
marcw

Senior Heliman

Southern California

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05-29-2017 06:20 AM  30 days agoPost 4
DeeBee123

Heliman

Rossville, GA

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Thanks the exploded parts view and parts list is definitely good for bearing location.
Not always so great for identifying bearing specs so standard replacement bearings can be obtained. For instance the inner main grip bearings #523 and #524 are labeled as bearing 10-15 and bearing 15-20. Which I do believe are 10x15 and 15x20 bearings of an unstated thickness.
Main shaft bearings are listed as 6900zz

Possibly I am just not familiar with the 10-15 style notation. Maybe bearings typically come in certain thicknesses such as 4mm for bearings with a 5mm difference between ID and OD. In that case the thickness could be left off.

I hope to add to the above list one by one as I service and replace bearings.

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05-30-2017 03:10 AM  29 days agoPost 5
marcw

Senior Heliman

Southern California

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Here is some more raw data on the various bearings GMP used. See page 2 onwards of the master GMP parts listing:

http://www.vrhc.co.uk/RC%20Helicopt...p/comp-draw.pdf

That has a whole bunch of bearings listed in formats like BL-6801ZZ-SE, 6800ZZ, etc.

6800ZZ Googles up as a 10mm x 19mm x 5mm Double Shielded Seal bearing:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/302288293470

I’m afraid that between the previously posted Competitor internal GMP company parts list printout, the GMP master parts list printout posted above, and the actual GMP Competitor engineering drawings:

http://www.vrhc.co.uk/RC%20Helicopt...p/comp-draw.pdf

you now have all the original technical documentation known to still exist for the Competitor above and beyond the owner’s manual and other such consumer grade documentation.

So, please post the results of your research when you finish. You will be adding to the collective (no pun intended) knowledge!

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05-30-2017 06:40 AM  29 days agoPost 6
DeeBee123

Heliman

Rossville, GA

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Thanks you very much for the info and for pointing out the usefulness of the various notations in fact 10-15 15-20 etc does refer to a standard bearings.
Gmp bearings listed as CRT x-x is thrust bearings etc.

I was working on the list in the above post but it doesn't line up in a useful manner .
I am now working on transferring those few entries to Excell where I will continue the list.

Thanks again

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06-11-2017 10:40 PM  16 days agoPost 7
DeeBee123

Heliman

Rossville, GA

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I received the HIROBO GPH 346 TAIL DRIVE PINION ASSEMBLY mentioned a few posts up.
A test fit shows that it will line up with both the main gear and the center of the tail boom at the same time. On the competitor, which IIRC has a slightly smaller main gear , new holes will have to be drilled 10-15mm forward of the two original holes and one more hole will need drilled to match the lone forward mounting location on the gph drive assembly.

Another thing to note is that the gph346 drive's receiver is slotted for a 2mm, 3/32", or possibly as large as a 2.5mm drive wire with 2 extensions on the side or otherwise flattened out.

It might be best to use the drive wire/tube for a gph 346, and it's tail box receiver as long as it is the correct length.
Any suggestions or experience concerning mating a shaft to the 346 drive would be appreciated. My goal is to be able to run an old school hh tail gyro with a delay dial and a relatively fast tail servo. Of course this will require a robust drive shaft.

I am considering using a carbon fiber rod supported with bearings, along with the metal ends used to make up carbon tail linkages to get a suitable shaft.
In the front the metal piece would be modded with a short pin welded on either side. For the rear the hole would have to be drilled to fit the metal end firmly, and then clamped in with the set screws. My biggest fear would be that the ends wouldn't hold to the carbon rod well enough. Ideally the end would have a pin on the inside so that the end cap could be epoxied on both inside and out.

I have found places where others have successfully built strong wire drives and or suitable torque tubes, unfortunately the specific pieces and parts used weren't mentioned , often any additional mods to the receiving ends weren't detailed either.

It seems many feel that a HH gyro is unwanted or unneeded, my experience with rate mode includes only hovering and tweaking the center for gyro tuning. I have hardly worked with tuning the various mixes required to make a rate mode tail behave. I really don't think the time to learn is flying a nearly irreplaceable bird.

To Anyone who has successfully shored up a tail drive on one of these your expertise is desperately needed
Thanks

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06-11-2017 11:20 PM  16 days agoPost 8
JuanRodriguez

Elite Veteran

The Villages, Florida

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Is that cigarette part of the assembly??? LOL !

Been there, done that and old enough to know better.....

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06-12-2017 01:40 AM  16 days agoPost 9
DeeBee123

Heliman

Rossville, GA

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No it's extra.

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