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Roban Scale Helicopters
› Adjusting Phasing on Roban PNP Head
03-09-2016 02:56 PM  21 months agoPost 1
TailKiller

rrApprentice

Panama City, FL

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Phasing is not supposed to be and issue with these PNP heads but I find on mine that it needs fbl software adjusting... Looking at the nose then down the boom... I seem to be in phase when the rear blade is at the 1:00 o'clock position. At that position I get no blade movement when I give elevator input so swash phase adjust is needed.

Not a problem, can do that. Question is has anyone elese had to adjust the PNP heads phasing?? I've not read or heard of any needing adjustment and I am concerned about being the only one and that I am wrong..
If no adjustment is needed then why am I off center boom??

,Dennis
http://pcrcheliclub.com/
700 Astar Super Scale T-600 Bell 206 Trex 600 Naza H DX8

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03-09-2016 04:54 PM  21 months agoPost 2
Copter Doctor

rrProfessor

Enterprise/ft.rucker ,al- home of army aviation

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you shouldn't need to but I will tell you my experience with phasing, I have had a machine or two do exactly what you are experiencing, but I didn't realize it was just a little off til I was looking at things on the bench. I was flying it with no noted issues with control input. give it a hover and see if anything feels funkey and if not, I say go with it. if it does feel funny, then take the time to adjust it. I believe if its off just a fraction of a degree or two, its no big deal. Sometimes what you see on the bench and what you feel in the air are two different things.

drive a rotary, fly a rotorcraft

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03-09-2016 05:31 PM  21 months agoPost 3
TailKiller

rrApprentice

Panama City, FL

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Thanks Doc.. understood. Yeah I did note during test flights that it was moving off from given input a bit. For example if it was tail in hover and I gave only direct rear elevator input.. it did track back and to the left.. I was thinking it was the blades and even the large landing gear causing it until I saw it was off on the bench. I think I will adjust before testing the new blades.

,Dennis
http://pcrcheliclub.com/
700 Astar Super Scale T-600 Bell 206 Trex 600 Naza H DX8

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03-10-2016 01:42 AM  21 months agoPost 4
TailKiller

rrApprentice

Panama City, FL

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It turned out that it was 11 degrees clockwise out of phase. Once that was adjusted and re zeroed pitch again.. the head and tracking while still on the bench became rock solid and smooth. Not to mention the new blades are bad a$$... High winds here.. will try to get in the air tmr.

,Dennis
http://pcrcheliclub.com/
700 Astar Super Scale T-600 Bell 206 Trex 600 Naza H DX8

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03-10-2016 04:16 AM  21 months agoPost 5
Copter Doctor

rrProfessor

Enterprise/ft.rucker ,al- home of army aviation

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wow, that's quite a bit out. cant wait to hear how it goes, keeping my fingers crossed

drive a rotary, fly a rotorcraft

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03-10-2016 02:38 PM  21 months agoPost 6
TailKiller

rrApprentice

Panama City, FL

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You trying to scare me?? Well it's working!!! As in the photo.. that was the range to adjust back to to get no movement over the tail. Am I missing something?

,Dennis
http://pcrcheliclub.com/
700 Astar Super Scale T-600 Bell 206 Trex 600 Naza H DX8

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03-10-2016 03:10 PM  21 months agoPost 7
ssmith512

rrKey Veteran

Indianapolis, IN USA

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Are checking for blade movement with a blade DIRECTLY over the tail boom?

Steve

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03-10-2016 03:30 PM  21 months agoPost 8
TailKiller

rrApprentice

Panama City, FL

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Yes Sir.

,Dennis
http://pcrcheliclub.com/
700 Astar Super Scale T-600 Bell 206 Trex 600 Naza H DX8

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03-10-2016 04:02 PM  21 months agoPost 9
ssmith512

rrKey Veteran

Indianapolis, IN USA

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OK good. I was questioning it because your pics do not show a blade over the boom.

Well I agree with E, it seems unusual that a "PNP" head would be 11deg out of phase "out of the box". But the swash/blade movement does not lie. And if that is what it takes, then that is what it takes.

Check, double check; take a break, and check again.

Good luck with the test flight!

Steve

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03-10-2016 05:51 PM  21 months agoPost 10
Copter Doctor

rrProfessor

Enterprise/ft.rucker ,al- home of army aviation

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You will be ok. I have learned that sometimes even you own way, ur natural way if holding and moving the sticks can cause interaction in the controls. This is why sometimes a heli that feels perfectly trimmed to you, may feel slightly to way out if trim to another. I discovered this from years of teaching people to fly rc, helis especially. Phasing will work fine if its even just a dew degrees off. When it feels right to you, its right on regardless of how many degrees off you had to adjust.

drive a rotary, fly a rotorcraft

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03-10-2016 10:23 PM  21 months agoPost 11
TailKiller

rrApprentice

Panama City, FL

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Well that's what it took to get the movements correct. I still have not put it in the air yet but... I can tell on the bench that this is now one smooth, low vib, good tracking head now. Disk rotation to stick inputs look to be spot on in the direction imputed. Between the phasing and the blade switch has mad the difference.

I thought the ball links on the swash were in the wrong spots but they were not. so when the blade is over the tail the swash links do not line up with each other. So the picture with the blade off center was where there was no movement and adjusting 11 degrees put the blade back over the boom as is should be with no movement... I can't explain it better then that. I think it has something to do with the swash and J arms but don't know.

,Dennis
http://pcrcheliclub.com/
700 Astar Super Scale T-600 Bell 206 Trex 600 Naza H DX8

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03-10-2016 11:01 PM  21 months agoPost 12
Copter Doctor

rrProfessor

Enterprise/ft.rucker ,al- home of army aviation

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Ok great but I had a thought, if you are determining the phasing based on what u are seeing on the bench, it may not be so when u get it in the air. A correctly phased head will look like the inputs are off when its sitting on the ground so if you make it look like you think it should while its fixed on the ground, it may be off when its in the air. Remember gyroscopic precession exists with s rotating mass. This is why the ball links to the blades are getting their input 90 degrees early.
Not trying to scare you now but my experience with phasing makes me think about that stuff

drive a rotary, fly a rotorcraft

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03-10-2016 11:35 PM  21 months agoPost 13
TailKiller

rrApprentice

Panama City, FL

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Ok.. was just making observations.. Before the head and tracking were all over the place.. So all i am trying to do is get no movement when the blade is over the tail which is the correct way to have it.. To adjust the phasing would be correct right? Or is there a mechanical way of doing this that I don't know about.??

,Dennis
http://pcrcheliclub.com/
700 Astar Super Scale T-600 Bell 206 Trex 600 Naza H DX8

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03-10-2016 11:49 PM  21 months agoPost 14
Copter Doctor

rrProfessor

Enterprise/ft.rucker ,al- home of army aviation

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We really need to get together, we live too close to each other. In person I can make sure things are squared away and there's no doubt. Mine has been flying like a dream

drive a rotary, fly a rotorcraft

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03-11-2016 12:34 AM  21 months agoPost 15
Mojave

rrElite Veteran

Palos Verdes, Ca. USA

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Don't let a little bit of blade wiggle over the tail boom fool you. It's almost impossible to get the blade to be perfectly still over the boom when giving elevator input. Put the blade at 90 degrees to the tail boom and give elevator input, it should go positive in pitch. This is a quick sanity check. As Emile stated, it's all about how it flies that matters. If the phasing is close, it will fly ok, it's not going to jump all over the place. See how it flies, then make small phasing changes until you like it.
Barry

All helis and planes have an expiration date stamped on them...you only find it after you crash!!

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03-11-2016 01:01 AM  21 months agoPost 16
TailKiller

rrApprentice

Panama City, FL

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Ok.. I'll let it go and put it back to 0 degrees and fly it again. It flew before so I suspect it will again. I thought it needed to be on the mark to be correct.. Is anyone else using this 3 blade PNP head and not had to adjust phasing?

,Dennis
http://pcrcheliclub.com/
700 Astar Super Scale T-600 Bell 206 Trex 600 Naza H DX8

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03-11-2016 01:23 AM  21 months agoPost 17
Copter Doctor

rrProfessor

Enterprise/ft.rucker ,al- home of army aviation

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I put my 3 bladed pnp head on Roy's compactor mechanics when I was doing my vibration hunt on his machine and I set it up straight forward with no issues. I didn't even do the boom and wiggle check because I kow it works, I just mounted it and go. It flew flawlessly.

drive a rotary, fly a rotorcraft

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03-11-2016 02:03 AM  21 months agoPost 18
TailKiller

rrApprentice

Panama City, FL

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Ok.. so I finally saw the right video.. I got it now. It was correct from the start. I was worried about the blade over the tail and having no elevator movement on that blade. When I shou;d have had one blade 90 to the frame and see the the control link was directly behing the elevator link and when giving aileron the 90 blade should not move. So the phasing is advanced 90 degrees.

,Dennis
http://pcrcheliclub.com/
700 Astar Super Scale T-600 Bell 206 Trex 600 Naza H DX8

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03-11-2016 04:07 AM  21 months agoPost 19
Copter Doctor

rrProfessor

Enterprise/ft.rucker ,al- home of army aviation

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ok great. explaining how phasing should be set can be very confusing. over the boom, 90 degrees to the frames etc. glad you have it correct. better get the flight in quick as the weather is supposed to get sucky over the weekend. I will be flying tomorrow and Saturday morning.

drive a rotary, fly a rotorcraft

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03-12-2016 02:33 AM  21 months agoPost 20
TailKiller

rrApprentice

Panama City, FL

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I didn't get around to flying today. My head just wasn't with it today. I zero the phasing and got the shakes backb on the bench so I moved on to other things.

I haven't talked about some of the things I'm doing to this heli. This is only my 2nd semi scale project. They call them super scale but I agree that they are far from that. I'n ot going to try and fix things on this model.. I'm just going to try and make it a nice comfortable flying heli. I have been working on the cabin.. carpet painted seats and seat backs made. Still need to do controls sticks and rudder an so on..

I have all the lighting installed and am arranging and mounting the Shock Wave sound system. I really like this sound system.. It really make the heli come to life.

I have also started with my vibration and sound dampening foam inside the fuse.. It just makes for much quieter heli...

,Dennis
http://pcrcheliclub.com/
700 Astar Super Scale T-600 Bell 206 Trex 600 Naza H DX8

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Roban Scale Helicopters
› Adjusting Phasing on Roban PNP Head
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