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HelicopterCentury Radikal G20-30 N640 Hawk Predator › Need advice on Century 222
12-20-2003 10:14 PM  13 years agoPost 1
DHDaniel

rrApprentice

Houston Texas Area

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Ok tomorrow is the big day, its all ready to fly, I have flown the mechanics and my other Hawks at 6 degrees pitch at half stick,
Do I need to change or modify the pitch or throttle curve before I attempt to fly, This thing is considerably heavier than the chassis alone. What can I expect?


Thanks

Dave
Also I have pics in my gallery now of this project

Predator60,Falcon50,HawkSport,Raven30

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12-21-2003 01:13 AM  13 years agoPost 2
MG

rrKey Veteran

California

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It should lift of with no problem. You will notice the heli will not be as quick as it was but it will lift off and fly very nicely with your current settings.

Time wasted = Life not lived to the fullest.

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12-21-2003 02:18 AM  13 years agoPost 3
oldfart

rrProfessor

Vancouver, Canada

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Lifting the B222

The lift generated by a rotor head is a direct function of its' disc area, blade design, rotor speed and pitch.

The only things that are in that mix that the pilot gets to deal with is the rotor speed and the blade pitch. (Of course if he has medium lift blades he can also change them out for a blade design that is more "lift" oriented.) So if we pick a relevant rotor speed (e.g. 1600) and your hover pitch (6 degrees) and have discovered that it will lift a light 6 lb. weight into a hover, we can safely say that this combination of is generating enough force to suspend 6 lbs.

So if we now want to suspend 8 lbs in the air it will take 33.333% more force to do so (8-6=2, 2/6 x 100 = 33.33%). So believe me, the same settings will NOT hover your Bell222.

So if you add more throttle to your throttle curve at the point on your stick where you want to hover without changing pitch, this extra power will result in a higher rotor speed at that point. Let us say 1800. So you will be generating more lift. Wether that is 33.33% more, I doubt it. So you may have to also increase your hovering pitch at that position of your stick to maybe 7 degrees or 8, and play with your throttle and pitch curves at that settings to get it to do hover.

Phil Noel
Leisure-Tech Support - Canada

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12-21-2003 03:24 AM  13 years agoPost 4
MG

rrKey Veteran

California

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Phil,

You are spot on as usual, but from experience I know for sure that his 222 will still hover and fly with his current setup but like I mentioned before it will not perform as well.

Time wasted = Life not lived to the fullest.

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12-21-2003 04:17 AM  13 years agoPost 5
Lift

rrElite Veteran

Houston, TX

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DH,
Wonderful job!!!!

You should be ok like MG said to get the heli to hover like you have it. But, what will be different is that it will most likely have a lower headspeed because you simply have more weight hanging from the disk. What you MIGHT need to do is add about 5% more throttle in to get the equivalent results.

Just remember thought that it will take a tad more control effort on your part to:
1) Start FF.
2) Stop FF.
3) Auto
etc...

That extra weight will make it hover more steadily on a windy day though!

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12-21-2003 04:21 AM  13 years agoPost 6
AGRAV8

rrProfessor

Mosquito Coast......Houston Texas

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Dave

Cool........where you going to fly tomorrow?? I may get a chance to see it. You should be fine......just go slow with the initial liftoff......and get a feel for it. We'll be rooting FOR ya........so you won't need to !James

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12-21-2003 06:47 AM  13 years agoPost 7
oldfart

rrProfessor

Vancouver, Canada

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flying Bell 222

MG,

Absolutely, no doubt about it, the 30 size Bell 222 will fly, and very well indeed for a scale ship with retracts, using the stock blades and an OS-32SXH or similar for power. (I would even do some milder aerobatics with mine like shallow loops, rolls and 540 stall turns!)

I owned one for a couple of years and logged a fair number of flights on it. (I find doing such things is a good way to learn about a unit in order to answer questions that would be forthcoming from some of our customers). I was finally persuaded to sell it to one of our field reps here in Canada. As I was not flying it that much anymore, and had subsequently built the 50 size Bell 47GII, I grudgingly relented ownership :-))

But what I am explaining is that it will take an adjustment of the throttle pitch/curve once installed in the fuselage. One that is relative different to that from the mechanics only version without the fuselage.

I thought I would explain why, to insure that Century flyers can always come here to the Dark Side forum for more "light".

Phil

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12-21-2003 03:28 PM  13 years agoPost 8
MG

rrKey Veteran

California

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Damn, now that I see that pic I want a 222!

Time wasted = Life not lived to the fullest.

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12-21-2003 03:57 PM  13 years agoPost 9
DHDaniel

rrApprentice

Houston Texas Area

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Report on Bell 222 flight

Ok guys It Flew! I raised the throttle curve a bit. All is well.
It is a lot more sluggish on left ,right and fore ,aft cyclic I have a Futaba
9c, is there a fix to adjust this sluggishness

Thanks
Dave

Predator60,Falcon50,HawkSport,Raven30

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12-21-2003 06:00 PM  13 years agoPost 10
oldfart

rrProfessor

Vancouver, Canada

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Increasing cyclic after increasing weight

....and I do not mean after a big Christmas dinner

The easiest way to increase the cyclic is to increase the rotor speed. The Sport head with 550mm blades that weigh as much as 110 grams can easily turn at 1800. In scale you would not want to go much higher then this because no real helicopter sounds like an angry bumble bee.

I am assuming that you are using an aileron to throttle mix and an elevator to throttle mix. This should be used on ANY heli but specially on one with a high disc loading. Here you will need at least 50%. Just be sure there is no "overthrow" of the throttle servo at full cyclic.

Next, remove the flybar weight from your flybar. If you even want more cyclic on your scaler then...

..... change out the flybar paddles. I do NOT recommend the K&S or similar type units (even though we distribute them here in Canada) because they take away too much stability in the hover. And in a scale machine, a "jitterbug" hover just "does not compute". But the MinAir white paddles for the 3mm flybars work a treat.

Don't forget, the extra energy needed to carry the extra weight means that much less energy will be available for cyclic acceleration through a manuever (even a hard turn).

This should give you all the cyclic you would want and more on a scale ship.

Phil

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12-21-2003 10:06 PM  13 years agoPost 11
beast

rrVeteran

Laurel MD

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Hmm. i always wanted a 222. that was suppose to have been my winter project last year. MG i think we should get one.

.Beresford

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HelicopterCentury Radikal G20-30 N640 Hawk Predator › Need advice on Century 222
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