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HelicopterClassifieds - Feedback Mediate › Brand New Scorpion 160hv burns up heli and scorpion says it my fault
11-06-2013 08:01 PM  4 years agoPost 1
504Rone

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New Orleans, LA.

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even though I spent $75 to ship the motor and esc to them to check it out. Basically, they are saying it my fault with the setting used in the esc even though I used the settings per the manual and they couldn't find anything wrong with the motor. I lost hundreds of dollars from the fire that occurred within the 1st min on the 1st flight.

Here is a link to the original thread.
http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=571933

Here is the first reply from Tony

Tony | Scorpion
To Me
Nov 5 at 2:31 AM
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Hi Tyrone

How are you? hope you are doing well.
I want to inform you that we have received your motor and ESC. After the inspection of the motor, there has a borken pieces come from no where, not magnet or others. After I took it out the isolation test is passed(it cannot spin both direction before I took out the tiny pieces). So I think this might cause the ESC burned but cannot sure. (Below the photos are that tiny pieces.)
Generally, this situation is not under covered our manufacture warranty, but we would like to offer you 50% discount as an exception to purchase a brand new 59V 160A ESC OPTO.
Please kindly let us know if it is acceptable.

I informed them that that was unacceptable and I would like a refund or another esc for free and that my motor was spinning perfectly when I removed it from the heli. I also stated that if anything did get in the motor it was during shipping and from the burned esc and sent a picture of the crispy esc all the pieces falling from it. Also that a very experience winder rewound the motor for me.

Here is the response from Chris

Chris | Scorpion
To Me'Tony | Scorpion'
Today at 4:03 AM
Hello Tyrone,

Sorry for us late response.
This is Chris from Scorpion, I heard from Tony that your 59V 160A ESC OPTO was burnt, and we already received your motor and ESC for inspection.
After our investigation, we found that the motor was short circuit and it caused the ESC burnt, in my opinion, this happen shouldn’t related to that little chip that Tony told you on yesterday.
Unfortunately, I couldn’t tell you why it caused the short circuit happened, because it is depends on how you setting and many other affect.
In this case, the best offer we can do is give you 50%discount to purchase a brand new 59V 160A ESC, which is the same condition accordance with the manufacture warranty:
http://www.scorpionsystem.com/info/warranty/.
We will send out the ESC with your motor once receive your confirmation.
Thanks.

My response is how could my motor have a short if Tony already said it passed the isolation test?

Chris Response

Chris | Scorpion
To Me'Tony | Scorpion'
Today at 5:06 AM
Hi Tyrone,

Well noted the situation. We believe that your motor is normal and nice assemble one, but we already explained that the reason caused it short cut and burnt our ESC.
We also found that the bearing failure and necessary to change. Actually your motor can even run on a 300A ESC, the 160A ESC is just can handle it.
Anyhow, we can only offer 50%off discount for you to purchase a new 160A ESC.
Please let me know you decision, and please send email to my direct email address ps1@spihk.com
So I can follow up your case by personally, thanks.

So I have sent another email stating to either give me a full refund or another esc with opto cable for vbar gov. And that the bearing were changed when the motor was rewound only 30 flights ago.

How call an motor in a 700 doing mild 3d need a 300 amp esc??

The last 2 pictures are what they sent me when they first claimed that fire was caused by the motor. The 4th picture is the burned esc. I didnt wrap the motor so if anything did get in it, it was from the esc during shipping.

NO FLYBARS

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11-06-2013 09:23 PM  4 years agoPost 2
mattox

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Phoenix,AZ-usa

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Im very sorry for what is happened. Ive always had great service from Scorpion! The power Dekker motors are very powerful just like the scorpions. 300amps have been reached before with no issue.

Good Luck!!

Mattox

MingDa helicopters,Scorpion US Power pack/Haiyin/Astroid designs

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11-06-2013 09:33 PM  4 years agoPost 3
504Rone

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Maybe so, however,I dont have 300 amp skills. No motor pulls 300 amps on a 14s setup spinning 695's during tic tocs.

NO FLYBARS

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11-06-2013 09:37 PM  4 years agoPost 4
mattox

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True. But a lot of people haven't went to 14s on there 700s yet either. lol
what is the new KV on that motor?

Mattox

MingDa helicopters,Scorpion US Power pack/Haiyin/Astroid designs

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11-06-2013 09:40 PM  4 years agoPost 5
504Rone

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450kv 21 tooth pinion.

NO FLYBARS

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11-06-2013 09:55 PM  4 years agoPost 6
Simmer

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Massachusetts

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Sorry for the loss of your stuff (heli might be useable ? )

its a lot of money in these things. I don't have a 700 but a 500 and I choose to buy the best ESC possible, went with the recommended settings as far as motor, battery pinion and esc.
I don't have a Y connector and I know its how its generally done (I think) but I feel it adds more points of failure. While I don't agree with the scorpion guy, there are too many factors to explain easily, what caused the mishap. Loos connectors, chafing on a wire, bad esc? if I was to take a stab and it really means nothing without the skills or the hardware to look over, I would place blame on the ESC first because that is where the power gets sorted out. Just a lame personal observation. The G500 frame is very sharp, the potential to chaff a wire thru is pretty easy to see.

What I don't like is the English the company tries to convey their observation of the issue. Not to be demeaning or discriminatory, but if your dealing with another country, you ought to be able to convey your argument in much clearer language. It just seems un professional. A custom wound motor? another opportunity for failure (I think) but again, just me feelings here.

I hope you get something more than 50%. But they have a policy in place and your probably only going to ever get that. I assume many companies wont even do that. You cant return electrical parts once used to computer stores. you might be able to get something from the ESC vendor perhaps. Hmm brings up a thought.. maybe someone could offer an insurance policy on our helos.

and one thing that electrics have that nitros do not. Higher risk of fire.

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11-06-2013 10:07 PM  4 years agoPost 7
504Rone

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Esc was purchased from Readyheli, they wont take care of it. The crazy thing is, if you go to any store and purchase something you usually have atleast 14 days to return it working or not. Scorpion seems to think that this esc cannot fail. We all know any electronic can fail no matter how much it cost. We also have to remember that this motor was used on 2 other escs without failure.

NO FLYBARS

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11-06-2013 10:29 PM  4 years agoPost 8
Justin Stuart (RIP)

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So to clarify, you were using a Scorpion Commander ESC with a hand-wound motor? Are you certain the motor was wound correctly? Are you absolutely certain that there were no incorrectly placed wires or other debris inside the motor causing a short-circuit that destroyed the ESC? Nevertheless, I see the pictures and I understand this event is very disappointing from you. I have some connections with the owner of Scorpion Power Systems, Georges van Gansen. He is a great guy, and a fantastic supporter of this hobby. Of course he wants for you to be satisfied with both the motors and the speed controllers that Scorpion Power Systems sells. What could be done to remedy this situation for you?

Avant RC
Scorpion Power Systems
Thunder Power RC
Kontronik Drives

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11-06-2013 10:32 PM  4 years agoPost 9
504Rone

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As this point, a refund.

Yes, I was using a hand wound motor by a very experienced winder with the new scorpion 160hv. Scorpion even said nothing is wrong with the motor.

NO FLYBARS

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11-06-2013 10:36 PM  4 years agoPost 10
GScott

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I had the same experience with a 130HV in an e7. The Scorpion ESC started a fire and caused nearly $1k in damage. Scorpion blamed my motor as well with the same lame excuse that something got into the motor. They replaced the ESC but nothing else. I personally will never run another one of their ESC's.

Funny thing was they accidentally sent me an entire box of motors by accident months later. I should have just sold them on Ebay to cover the damage their flame throwing ESC caused but I sent them back.

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11-06-2013 10:38 PM  4 years agoPost 11
Justin Stuart (RIP)

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Let me send a message to the owner of Scorpion Power Systems and see if he is interested in getting involved with this thread. Scorpion Power Systems stands behind their products, and they want to be known the world over as a manufacturer of premier RC equipment. Let's see what can be done to remedy this situation so that you can be satisfied with the results.

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Thunder Power RC
Kontronik Drives

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11-06-2013 10:55 PM  4 years agoPost 12
504Rone

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I know none of these companies will replace everything but to try to charge me more money after the esc failed on the first flight in less than a min and costed me hundreds, maybe even a thousand is out of the question. 50% off you can keep that. If I spend anymore money on an esc it will be a yge160.
Thanks Justin.

NO FLYBARS

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11-06-2013 10:57 PM  4 years agoPost 13
Tbird

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Indiana

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504 i sent you a pm

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11-06-2013 11:08 PM  4 years agoPost 14
504Rone

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Got it.

NO FLYBARS

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11-06-2013 11:14 PM  4 years agoPost 15
BENTDABOOM

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If this was a home brew wind job am curious to know what wind configuration + termination and size of wire he used

CAUTION!!! politicians may be hazerdous to your well being

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11-06-2013 11:51 PM  4 years agoPost 16
504Rone

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yy winding and 1.32.

NO FLYBARS

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11-07-2013 12:01 AM  4 years agoPost 17
Tbird

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Dekker does top notch "home brew" rewires.....

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11-07-2013 12:31 AM  4 years agoPost 18
icanfly

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ontario

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I would have liked to see the esc without the heat sink, top and bottom. you said the motor was run on 2 other esc's already and your bird was flying for a minute on this one.

Today I put a nail through a puffy lipo, no fire, no smoke, no KABOOM, there was spark and some moderate heat.

I have a heli that has a 300 peak amp motor, not a big one but can be powered 6s. At first I thought something in it was rubbing. After every flight I check for heat on the mot and batteries (and to warm my hands now lol).

If a fragment was stuck on the magnet but did not touch nothing would happen.

Seems the minute mark is a common time period when static build begins to unleash. I had a problem with it a year ago and every time the build up would begin to wreak havoc at the minute mark. (fried a motor and 2 esc's and wrecked several blades and parts before the prob was solved).

Something to think about.

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11-07-2013 03:41 PM  4 years agoPost 19
504Rone

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Got an email this morning stating that a free replacement was on the way.

NO FLYBARS

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11-07-2013 03:54 PM  4 years agoPost 20
Justin Stuart (RIP)

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Got an email this morning stating that a free replacement was on the way.
I'm happy to hear that Scorpion Power Systems was able to help you with this situation. I assure you that there are many satisfied Scorpion pilots the world over. You can feel confident knowing that Scorpion is a manufacturer of premium RC equipment for cars, boats, airplanes, helicopters, and robotics, and they stand firmly behind all the products they sell.

However for future builds, it would probably be a very good idea to use a motor manufactured by a reliable company, instead of something which is hand wound. And it would also be a very good idea to use well soldered bullet connectors covered in shrink-wrap (instead of electrical tape as seen in this photograph). High voltage speed controllers are very susceptible to commutation failures which can occur from a variety of reasons including bullet connectors which are improperly soldered or improperly insulated. Covering your ESC leads with electrical tape is a sure way to cause a commutation failure and to possibly lead to another destroyed ESC.

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Thunder Power RC
Kontronik Drives

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HelicopterClassifieds - Feedback Mediate › Brand New Scorpion 160hv burns up heli and scorpion says it my fault
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