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HelicopterBergen R/C Helicopters › JR Servo output arm/disc measurements
12-17-2003 06:11 AM  13 years agoPost 21
naren

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Bangalore, India

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All linkages are perpendicular and the swashplate is level w.r.t the heli.

I'm going to add a few millimeters to the 4 swash links to raise it and see how things look.

-Naren

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12-17-2003 06:19 AM  13 years agoPost 22
Chris Bergen

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cassopolis, MI USA

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Are all servos centered, and what pitch is on the blades?

Something else to look for is the amount of elevator travel you have.

You dont want the swashplate hitting binding on the mainshaft at extreme throws. Same for aileron, but with the elevator upgrade, it's more prevalent on for and aft movement.

Chris D. Bergen

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12-17-2003 11:32 AM  13 years agoPost 23
Malorie

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Paw squared, MI

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It could be that the linkages from the aileron and elevator controls to the swashplate are to long. This would put the collective popsicle sticks at a steeper angle at full negative collective and possibly run that linkage into the canopy mount at full negative with full forward elevator.

Just a thought,
Malorie

Life's a journey, NOT a destination.

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12-17-2003 12:03 PM  13 years agoPost 24
naren

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Bangalore, India

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Changing the aileron linkages to the swashplate has had no effect in resolving the binding problem.

I'll increase the length of the elevator linkages and check.

Naren

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01-11-2004 02:10 AM  13 years agoPost 25
naren

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Bangalore, India

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Back to real life...!

Chris,

When the yoke links are lengthened I can get the binding to (almost) go away). However, this results in the washout pins reaching their limit in the grooves pretty soon.

The pitch range is +10 to -9.5 when the instructions are followed.
With the yoke lengthed, the +ve pitch is severely restricted (~4 degrees)

The following link has a few pictures of the control system

Control System Pictures

sigh...

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01-13-2004 11:19 AM  13 years agoPost 26
Chris Bergen

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cassopolis, MI USA

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I'm still amazed that you are hitting the canopy post.

I helped a gentelman here in GA over the weekend with his new Gasser. He also set it up per the instructions, and it was probably the best setup I've seen someone do without experienced help.

With all servos centered, all arms level, and/or at 90 degrees, it had 0 degrees pitch on the blades at center stick with 100% travel in ATV, it had 10 degrees pos and 10 degrees neg. At full positive the pins just bottomed out in the head.

The point is for the moment, forget the rod lengths in the manual. Put all the balls in the servo wheels as shown in the diagram at the beginning of the post.

Work your way from the servo to the next bellcrank, either making it level or 90 degrees as required. Work you way to the next bellcrank again making it level or 90 degrees as needed, continue this for each servo all the way to the swashplate, up to the mixing unit, up to the head, again making sure that each arm is level.

With the servos centered, and stick centered, you should have 0 degrees of pitch measured on the blades, with flybar level.

Now you have to adjust your aileron and elevator ATV's to acheive +- 7 degrees of cyclic.

Typically this is 115% on aileron and 85% on elevator. If you have too much travel, the swash will bind on the mainshaft.

If all else fails, send me the heli.

If needed, give me a call at 404-210-1501

Chris D. Bergen

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01-13-2004 04:34 PM  13 years agoPost 27
naren

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Bangalore, India

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After taking another hard look at the collective linkages, I've concluded that my secondary collective linkages are a bit too long and they are causing the swash to down low enough to cause the elevator upper secondary linkage to hit against the canopy post.

The rest of the system looks good without any binding that I can see (or hear).

I'll work on the collective setup and see how it turns out.

Thanks,
Naren

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01-13-2004 06:20 PM  13 years agoPost 28
naren

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Bangalore, India

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OK.. things look much better now!

The secondary collective linkage length has been reduced from 78mm end-end to 75mm end-end. With this setting, the secondary elevator linkage clears the canopy post at full negative pitch.

I did not have time to measure the pitch range after this change. I'm sure it is not going to be +10 to -10.
I might have to modify the linkages on the head to get (+10, -10).

Will do that in the evening and report on that.


Mebbe I won't have to send it in after all!

Naren

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01-14-2004 12:04 AM  13 years agoPost 29
Chris Bergen

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cassopolis, MI USA

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Well that's some good news!!

I have to Fly to Boston tonight to do some work for Delta, but will check back either in the morning or tommorrow night.

Chris D. Bergen

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01-14-2004 02:03 AM  13 years agoPost 30
rcrebel

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Michigan

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Don't know if it makes any difference, but my kit came with instructions to relocate the canopy mounting post for the fiberglass canopy. It moves the mount from in front of the upper main shaft bearing block to the holes aft of the bearing block. There are two holes vertically, and you are supposed to use the lower hole.

I know this doesn't affect the machines before this new mounting location, but from the pics it looks like your mounting post is still in front of the main bearing block. Does it fit your canopy in this position?

If I'm wrong, it won't be the first time.
rcrebel (Scott)

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01-14-2004 02:18 AM  13 years agoPost 31
naren

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Bangalore, India

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I did not order the fibreglass canopy with the kit (got it later). The instructions did not talk about relocating the posts (OR I must have been blind!)

Anyways, now I'm pretty close to getting the stuff sorted out. All I need to do now is to make another canopy post to replace the one I ground up....a cosmetic issue.

And while I am doing that I will try out what you said...
I might not have to mess with having to readjust the linkages for the correct pitch range!

Naren

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01-14-2004 04:12 AM  13 years agoPost 32
rcrebel

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Michigan

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naren

I just scanned a copy of the instruction sheet for the body post relocation into My Gallery. Click on the link below (or cut and paste to your browser) and you can see the instruction sheet. You can zoom in good if you need to.

I saved it in .PDF format, Adobe Acrobat Reader. If you would like to see it as a .JPG, let me know.

http://www.runryder.com/helicopter/...4/Canopy001.pdf


rcrebel

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01-14-2004 05:56 AM  13 years agoPost 33
TOP CAT

rrNovice

London ,Ontario Canada

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Chris
I too have the same problem as Naren and all links are to specs.
One other problem I am having is that on page 29 in Gasser Manual it is writen ( Attach 1 canopy stand off, long ,to outside top of upper left side frame,with a m3*10 shcs from the inside of the frame) .Also pic shows this.
Now the problem is with full back elevator control and only 60% pitch input the elevator upgrade now hits these bolts holding the canopy stand off and binds at this point.
All travels are at 100 % , don't have the blades on yet so I don't have pitch set in yet , but should be +/- 10 deg
Chris , maybe its the cold weather up hear and we just cain't think, but since your in the warmer area maybe you would have a comment.
Tom

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01-14-2004 06:48 AM  13 years agoPost 34
rcrebel

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Michigan

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TOP CAT

Did you get instructions with your elevator upgrade? I have a set here that I can scan for you. If you have them, step 9 specifies to remove the stock canopy post screw and use the supplied 3 x 8mm Flat Head Screws. If you do not, the elevator upgrade will hit the stock cap screws. Is your canopy mount post behind the main shaft?

You have to remove the stock canopy mounting cap screws, chamfer the holes in the frames (from the inside of the frame) so the new screws seat flush with the frames. I used a 9/32 drill bit to chamfer the frames. I took a pic of mine installed - not the greatest pic but functional.

If you need a copy of the instructions, let me know.
rcrebel

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01-14-2004 07:21 AM  13 years agoPost 35
Chris Bergen

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cassopolis, MI USA

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Hey Tom,

With the elevator upgrade and stock canopy you do need to use the countersunk screws.

If you have the new Canopy(mal's) then move the post to the back as Scott showed.

We must be wearing off on Scott, Now he's helping others too

You have to check to see what pitch you are getting at mid stick with all the servos centered.

Sometimes all it takes is one spline on the servo wheel and everything falls into place.

Chris D. Bergen

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01-14-2004 05:25 PM  13 years agoPost 36
naren

rrNovice

Bangalore, India

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When I ordered by FG canopy I got just that in the mail (no instructions or additionaly hardware like the ones mentioned in PDF file posted by rcrebel)

Also, seems to me that moving the canopy posts to the rear mounting holes (the ones for the antirotation bracket) would be the most optimal in terms of getting the linkages to be according to spec and still move without binding/obstruction.

I say this because my previous attempt to reduce the length of the sec. collective linkage to 75mm cause the collective arm to strike the canopy post at around 85% collective input. So I undid that and now need to relocate the posts to the mounting position in the rear.

Also need to redo the gormmets and holes (in addition to patching up the old holes in the canopy )

Naren

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01-15-2004 03:27 AM  13 years agoPost 37
Chris Bergen

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cassopolis, MI USA

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DId you get the New FG canopy? (Mal's design)

If so, there are "divits" on the canopy where the grommets are to be located.

If not, then the stock mounting location is used. When you got your kit we may have had both styles still in stock.

But this still doesn't change the fact that something is wrong in the setup. You should not be hitting the posts in the forward position.

Chris D. Bergen

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01-15-2004 03:51 AM  13 years agoPost 38
naren

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Bangalore, India

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It's the new canopy.

As to the reason for the post getting in the way of the elevator linkage... I'm up against a blank wall.

Any ideas what I should try.

If somebody could post a link to some pics of the control system (with a ruler for perspective like I did here I'd appreciate that)

Naren

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01-15-2004 02:49 PM  13 years agoPost 39
Malorie

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Paw squared, MI

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If you have the new style canopy, the upper canopy posts are relocated to the anti-rotation hole behind the mainshaft bearing blocks. That should then clear your trouble with clearence. It is best to use a cap head screw rather than using the countersunk screws. The countersunk screws can pull through the frames in a crash causing the purchase of new upper sideframes or having to relocate the posts again (trust me, I have experience in this one. ).

Life's a journey, NOT a destination.

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01-15-2004 04:04 PM  13 years agoPost 40
naren

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Bangalore, India

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Ok, that's what I'm gonna do then.

Naren

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HelicopterBergen R/C Helicopters › JR Servo output arm/disc measurements
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