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HelicopterFlybarless Rotor Head SystemsV-Bar › Cant get it set up right
01-28-2012 08:28 PM  6 years agoPost 1
Scott1115

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Greenwich, CT

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I cannot seem to get the Vbar set up to my liking. The FB heli responds better Both are Trex 660N's - all same except vbar vs FB head.

1. The piro rate is too slow even though it is set to 110%.
2. There is a small tail wag. The gain was at 70% and now its up to 85%.
3. The cyclic is a bit sluggish compared to the FB head. I don't want it to be more twitchy, just more "connected." It's response rate to input is okay, just does not feel crisp - best way to explain it.
4. lastly, in FFF it leans to the left (port side), but seems to fly straight. WTF?

Please advise me - thank you.

~Scott

Compass 7HV, Trex 550E
RCRCC

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01-28-2012 09:12 PM  6 years agoPost 2
PJRono

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Minnesota, Ya!

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Use a longer servo arm on your tail gyro. I've had to do this on mine as well.

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01-28-2012 09:16 PM  6 years agoPost 3
PJRono

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Minnesota, Ya!

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As far as the other things we need to know a little more information as to where your other settings are in the V-bar. Cyclic style, agility, and gain.

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01-28-2012 09:21 PM  6 years agoPost 4
PJRono

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Minnesota, Ya!

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Did you walk through the step by step tabs starting from the beginning when you set it up? Did you start with a fresh program and set the transmitter to the V-bar centers and endpoints? Did you make sure to level the swash/heli at that step?

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01-29-2012 04:11 AM  6 years agoPost 5
Scott1115

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Greenwich, CT

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PJ, thanks for your help. I wont be bak infornt of the computer with the vbar until Sunday night. I will post as much info as possible once I am there. I appreciate the assistance.

Compass 7HV, Trex 550E
RCRCC

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01-29-2012 03:07 PM  6 years agoPost 6
bkervaski

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Birmingham, AL, USA

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Take your paddle sim up to 40, that will liven up center.

Also, upgrade to pro if you haven't already, you get access to more settings.

The VBar likes longer tail servo horns. On the futaba "plus" shaped horn, I used the outer hole, this gave me the best tail performance. Not sure of the exact distance. On other systems, the second to last hole seems to work best, but the VBar likes the extra throw.

Team Synergy Factory Specialist / Scorpion / Thunder Power / Byron's Fuels

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01-29-2012 03:44 PM  6 years agoPost 7
PJRono

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I'm out another hole or two farther than that.

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01-29-2012 05:14 PM  6 years agoPost 8
GetToDaChopper

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Las Vegas , NV

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The VBar likes longer tail servo horns. On the futaba "plus" shaped horn, I used the outer hole, this gave me the best tail performance. Not sure of the exact distance. On other systems, the second to last hole seems to work best, but the VBar likes the extra resolution.
moving the ball out on the servo arm doesn't give you more resolution it gives you less i'm sorry to say, maybe i don't understand what it is your trying to say here ???

just think of it this way, when you have a shorter arm the servo has to turn further for the ball to move say a 1/4 of an inch but a servo with a longer arm will have to turn far less to move the ball a 1/4 of an inch there for less degrees of servo rotation = less servo resolution, the shorter arms allow more servo resolution and more accuracy, but to take advanage of the increased resolution that a shorter servo arm provides you need a faster servo or shall we say quicker servo, all fbl systems usually benefit from increased resolution via shorter servo horns......

i hope this helps.

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01-29-2012 06:11 PM  6 years agoPost 9
PJRono

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Minnesota, Ya!

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He was asking two questions here:

One, his tail wasn't fast enough
Two, his cyclics had too much throw for the flybarless system

I think he just mixed them together by accident

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01-29-2012 06:21 PM  6 years agoPost 10
Santiago P

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South West, Ohio

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3. The cyclic is a bit sluggish compared to the FB head. I don't want it to be more twitchy, just more "connected." It's response rate to input is okay, just does not feel crisp - best way to explain it.
4. lastly, in FFF it leans to the left (port side), but seems to fly straight. WTF
Like PJ said, you need to specify where the Cyclic style, agility, and gain curently are.

I would not be cranking up the paddle simulation until you find the sweetspot for the aforementioned settings.

On the left lean during FF, this is normal. All helicopters do it to some degree, you just happens to notice it now. Couterclockwise rotors lean right in FF.

,

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01-29-2012 06:23 PM  6 years agoPost 11
PJRono

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Minnesota, Ya!

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The lean could also be an effect of his dampening, depending on how he has it set. Harder dampening will lean more. But most flybarless systems like dampening a little softer.

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01-29-2012 06:28 PM  6 years agoPost 12
PJRono

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Minnesota, Ya!

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As far as the small wag, how do you have your sensor mounted?

I use two pieces of thick foam, then a heavy metal plate, a thin piece of foam, then the sensor.

This is the same setup that Spartan sells for their gyros.

If you skip me I can't play!

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01-29-2012 11:47 PM  6 years agoPost 13
Scott1115

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Greenwich, CT

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Here are the V-stabi v5.2 Pro setup parameters
Sorry it took so long for me to hookup the heli and get the data.

Did you walk through the step by step tabs starting from the beginning when you set it up? yes

Did you start with a fresh program and set the transmitter to the V-bar centers and endpoints? yes

Did you make sure to level the swash/heli at that step? yes, and trimmed it at high and low end so at punch out it stays level.

The sensor is mounted with Futaba tape, metal plate, Futaba tape

Main Rotor:
Style = 74
Agility = 90
Gyro gain = 90

RC deadband = 2
Elevator precompensation = 8
Paddle simulation = 0
Expo = 0
Control loop elevator = 47
Control loop aileron = 48

Tail Rotor:
Yaw rate = 110
Gyro gain = 85 (The gain was at 70% and now its up to 85%, the wag is better, but not gone. I raised it higher, but did not seem to help any)

RC deadband = 5
Acceleration = 55
P gain = 60
I gain = 60
Control loop = 10 and 69

Governor = 70

While I know a small lean is normal, this one seems to lean considerably (still a small amount in degrees) more than the FB helicopter.

Compass 7HV, Trex 550E
RCRCC

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01-30-2012 02:47 AM  6 years agoPost 14
Santiago P

rrProfessor

South West, Ohio

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Bring the style down below 60 or even 50.

What RPM and blades you running?

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01-30-2012 03:08 AM  6 years agoPost 15
Scott1115

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Greenwich, CT

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Normal is n governed
idle 1 = 1850 head speed
idle 2 = 2050 head speed

same flying characteristics in both idle1 and idle 2

Compass 7HV, Trex 550E
RCRCC

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01-30-2012 03:24 AM  6 years agoPost 16
Rossi 19se

rrApprentice

   CA

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Try it with style at 45, paddle simulation at 40 with some expo.

Egoist

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01-30-2012 03:27 AM  6 years agoPost 17
Scott1115

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Greenwich, CT

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Please explain what style does and why down? I read the "professor" info about style, but the vbar description means nothing to me.

Beside the obvious, what does paddle simulations do in terms of feel?

Compass 7HV, Trex 550E
RCRCC

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01-30-2012 01:20 PM  6 years agoPost 18
TattooArtist

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Chestnut Ridge NY

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Scott try agility 100.I have mine on 105
try changing that first it worked for me.

Team Gaui/Empire Hobbies ,RcRcc,

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01-30-2012 01:44 PM  6 years agoPost 19
Scott1115

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Greenwich, CT

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Thanks Alex

Compass 7HV, Trex 550E
RCRCC

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01-30-2012 02:33 PM  6 years agoPost 20
PJRono

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Minnesota, Ya!

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I think I have my agility at 110.
I would still try a longer tail servo arm (at least one hole out more)Also try dropping your Cyclic Gain down to around 75.
If you are not using the HEAVY metal plate, I would strongly advise it. Using two thick foam pads under it and a thin one on top under the sensor.

If you skip me I can't play!

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HelicopterFlybarless Rotor Head SystemsV-Bar › Cant get it set up right
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