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04-06-2011 05:11 PM  6 years agoPost 141
Justin Stuart (RIP)

rrMaster

Plano, Texas

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Am I correct that the tail boom is a lot larger diameter than the old Fury line?

Avant RC
Scorpion Power Systems
Thunder Power RC
Kontronik Drives

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04-06-2011 07:42 PM  6 years agoPost 142
Band1086

rrElite Veteran

Kennewick, Wa. USA

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Yes, should be the same as the F-6

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04-06-2011 10:40 PM  6 years agoPost 143
Wave

rrKey Veteran

Illinois

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Guys, I apologize for giving you my honest opinion in a "public" forum as you say. I guess if someone is not cheerleading then they are not welcome to add to the discussion.

I still think the simple design of the Whiplash puts it squarely in the same category as the Trex 700 ( you can try to convince yourselves otherwise all you want ), and now you have to compete DIRECTLY with the 700

I will no longer post in the RunRyder MA forums until I can think of something flattering to say to help boost your ego's.

Thank you and have a good day.

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04-06-2011 11:40 PM  6 years agoPost 144
misskimo

rrElite Veteran

Alaska 17 years,​before mississippi​for 31y

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Aw, cry me a river then! lets see! before Trex came out! I wonder what heli they used as a base line for . huh? there first 450 they copied a raptor, just reduced there size, No one said a word huh? No rappy lovers said a word. then came the 600! Huh! who did they use to copy! Hirobo and avant tail gear drive system, Logo gear size, Logo style oneway, and Rappy 30 converted side frames, Huh? no one complained about coping! Then out of the blue! JK hired on, an ex MA dude! well , look at the trex 500 canopy, looks like a MA fury which looked great, and just scaled up the 450 or down sized the rest on cad. Now , the new trex 600 thats coming out! MA head designed! Which is really a Shulter head that MA fine tuned! Fury Look canopy! Frames like the HFE and HFX frames that Rotorworkz did, and beafed it up, Now the 700 trex, just took the cads off the 600, added a lower battery storage, copied a few designed that was floating around like the Trez 700 converted to an Xtera that I have which has a slid in battery tray, and PUFF , no one said a word. Now, MA took what cad drawing they had. servos to the swash came from the MA Razor 600, the stack frames was made into a set of frames, WHAT other way is there, DUH!!!! Wave! you shouldnt post stupid crap if you dont know your helis from the past.

and by the way, single side frames was done by MA years ago

T

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04-07-2011 12:09 AM  6 years agoPost 145
TomC

rrKey Veteran

Gold Coast,​Queensland,​Australia

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Well said Tony, old mate!

I'm getting pretty tired of seeing post after post of bashers and then other bashers, bashing them. Better to stick with a discussion of the heli's features even though the info is a little fuzzy right now. Hopefully it will get back on track soon.

Like you and I have commented before (quite a few pages back now), one 'concern' is the limited gear ratios available with only 13,14,and 15t options. This really needs to be expanded to 10,11, and 12t in order to better cater to HV setups and also for guys who want to run lower headspeeds (maybe even a 800mm conversion at 1700???).

I estimate that with the 500kv motor recommended by BW, and a 13t pinion, he is probably gov's to ~2100 hs. So, for me, I'd want to target ~1950 HS and I think I would need a 12t to eff. do this. I think that 14-15t would probably only be useful for 10s setups.

I have discussed this with C. Lund already and I know that he and MA are looking into this.

Cheers,
TomC

Nqx,Mcpx-BL,300x,450x,500x,550x
Ion-x, 10s ,SS
TT X50E 10s, HC3-Sx

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04-07-2011 12:47 AM  6 years agoPost 146
misskimo

rrElite Veteran

Alaska 17 years,​before mississippi​for 31y

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Yeh! winter still here in Alaska where Im at! No flying, I can get on edge pretty easy I recon! flew once this year! so when someone post TOO ( TO)negative , with out knowing what! then I will gladly step in!
Yeh! I posted the same thing! it looks like they are trying to use those 3 pinions for nitro and electric! hurts electric more though!
I posted the same thing you said on page 4! I didnt know that the oneway was in the pinion,
Like my Xtera, 2 stage I have! the oneway is in the second bull gear, and if I remember what xera Man! David said, it was 4 times less torque in the one for my heli! also the oneway is a hirobo shuttle ZX oneway and it is holding up like a charm, No scare marks what so ever on it, so the oneway in the pinion is more or less??? Dont know,
But if Bobby is saying its good with a 500 KV with this ratio, must be 10S 5000 65C in there, or a Big ole ESC cranked down the Gov on 12S ( which is BAD) hard on the batteries and lots of unwanted torque that likes to eat oneways

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04-07-2011 01:26 AM  6 years agoPost 147
MinAirUSA

rrVeteran

Bavaria, Germany

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But if Bobby is saying its good with a 500 KV with this ratio, must be 10S 5000 65C in there, or a Big ole ESC cranked down the Gov on 12S ( which is BAD) hard on the batteries and lots of unwanted torque that likes to eat oneways
Actually, 12s 5000mah. He's using the CC ICE120 HV, and it's working great. Not exactly sure where the gov is set, but considering Bobby is also a Castle Creations pilot, he's not just guessing about the set up.

Miniature Aircraft

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04-07-2011 04:19 AM  6 years agoPost 148
Blades345

rrVeteran

FL

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There are always going to be similar features with helis out there, I just hate when people bitch out a company for copying another. MA has no reason to copy Align anyway, as I believe the quality of MA far exceeds Align. I am betting the MA will be a top notch 90 size.

When u don't feel like soaring through the air with a plane, beat it into submission w/ a heli!

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04-07-2011 06:57 AM  6 years agoPost 149
Ghia

rrApprentice

Abq, NM

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Am I right to say, and read somewhere,that Avant IS made in America but they took the American worker outta the picture and replaced him with very expensive robotic CNC machines that will compete with the chinese by not paying much in american labor either....No coffee breaks, unions, or sick dogs.... Smart really and I bet those 300,000$ (each) machines are half paid for already for Avant..I have seen these type of robotic machines VERY impressive.

Wonder why America is going down the crapper its guys like Wave..."world economy get with the program!" I'd be all for a world economy if it was a level field between rigged currencies and forced penny labor.

companies like MA (who are consolidating the sales end with the heli wholesaler guys and staying high quality) are putting up a good fight against the shoddy Aligns out there...

So for now I'll pull down my old school, high parts count, beautifully crafted xcell 40 that I can still get parts for i think, and do my part for a great company till I can find a job to swing a new MA heli.

Its hard for me a educated guy, to find ANY manufacturing machinist job left with out competing with CNC robots here at home or China rigged currency/forced labor abroad...

So do it big MA and "piss on" this world economy idea that has failed big in my book. You, Bergen, and the Audacity crew will get my hard earned dollars!

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04-07-2011 07:05 AM  6 years agoPost 150
misskimo

rrElite Veteran

Alaska 17 years,​before mississippi​for 31y

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Huh. Doing my math. The 9.53 , 500 kv motor, 12s would be about right. My guess he's turning a 2000 head speed at 78%.
12s 3800s. The weight should be at ( alittle more than 10 lbs to 10 1/2 lbs. 12s 5000 around 11.4
Not bad. Might have to get one. Ganna have any at ircha?

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04-07-2011 09:21 AM  6 years agoPost 151
TomC

rrKey Veteran

Gold Coast,​Queensland,​Australia

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Probably in the right ballpark Tony but I think with the newer high C cells his HS might be a bit higher. Pretty hard to say until we get it from the horse's mouth, lol!

Also, much as I love made in the USA (and I don't even live there, lol) I really do not like CC escs. I know that BW and CY are using them and that's great. Maybe they will help finally get these esc's fine-tuned, and reliable.

While I really like the direct drive cyclic servos/swash, I hope that this caters to both flybarred and fbl. Most fbl system seem to need a bit more servo resolution. On most fbl MA conversions this usually requires you to bring the servo arm distances in ~4mm (from say 19mm to 15mm).

With a direct drive system (like the old Razor) this is going to be pretty hard to do unless you have multiple servo mount points (one for fb, the other for fbl). Otherwise, your geometry is going to be a bit off imho.

While it's a lot to early to say for sure, given the current limited gear ratios (strike 1), no ability to adjust gear mesh since ratios are currently hard wired (strike 2). Whether or not there is a different direct servo drive mount for fb and fbl (potentially a strike 3).

Cheers,
TomC

Nqx,Mcpx-BL,300x,450x,500x,550x
Ion-x, 10s ,SS
TT X50E 10s, HC3-Sx

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04-07-2011 10:09 AM  6 years agoPost 152
Taipan

rrElite Veteran

Sydney, Australia

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I'm wondering if the servo arms need supports like they did on the Stratus? I.e. servo arm bolts replaced with specificially designed long bolts & a CF bearing brace slipped over.

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04-07-2011 05:27 PM  6 years agoPost 153
wannaheli

rrNovice

Fairfax, VA

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I wonder about that too. With direct to swash you think there may be more stress. I'm sure MA knows what they are doing. Supports like the Avro Blitz's would be cool.

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04-07-2011 05:56 PM  6 years agoPost 154
Band1086

rrElite Veteran

Kennewick, Wa. USA

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I just set up a Furion 6 FBL with a BeastX, and I can tell you direct servo to swash works great if it's designed correctly. But with the 700's it will require very good servos!

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04-07-2011 06:49 PM  6 years agoPost 155
3Dmuse

rrApprentice

Ontario, Canada

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If one pays $1000 for a kit, why would another $450 for good cyclic servos be a problem?

For sure, the thought of how many children in Africa the cost of a JR 8917HV would feed makes the grown-up man feel guilty and willing to cut corners when deciding on the equipment he will be using in his top dollars "toy". As a consequence, he settles down for Align servos and feels relieved that his money will feed some children in Asia. Africa? Asia? Both start with A.

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04-07-2011 07:41 PM  6 years agoPost 156
Band1086

rrElite Veteran

Kennewick, Wa. USA

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Since using Aligns on my 700's, I have changed my mind about them...they are great servos. I know a guy who flies his 700
hard, and crashes equally hard...and frequently. He uses Align servos and has never broken one! In fact I've never heard of anyone who has had a problem with their cyclic servos...

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04-07-2011 08:03 PM  6 years agoPost 157
3Dmuse

rrApprentice

Ontario, Canada

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The grown-up man needs the very best. What other factor is more indicative of quality and performance than price? You get what you pay for. Isn't this a recurrent theme that the grown-up man can read about on the online forums? How can a $799 heli be the equal of a $1000 heli? How can a $70 servo be the equal of a $150 servo? The grown-up man needs the very best.

Parables aside, I believe one needs common sense in this hobby as much as in anything else in life. I truly believe MA helis are amongst the best "toys" for big boys out there. I truly believe Align servos work well and few will feel the difference between them and JR servos. It is however this whole thread that reminds me that the grown-up man is just a child and, as such, he feels the need to posses the biggest, or the most expensive, or the never seen or owned by others, thing. At the flying field, on the online forums, in life, the grown-up man always feels the urge to show off. Why? Why not just enjoy the hobby and life for what they are without openly making a case for or against something that doesn't even exist yet?

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04-08-2011 07:31 AM  6 years agoPost 158
Ghia

rrApprentice

Abq, NM

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I agree but its not about having the biggest and best. I want excellence in everything I do and companies I support. I want them to cut my heli kits/parts that extra thousandths....I want their paid pilots to actually inform me then bore with smack down 3D all the time....I want support if I need to call or post.

I guess I have never bought based on price alone.

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04-08-2011 08:46 AM  6 years agoPost 159
yannick

rrVeteran

South Korea

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Personaly I love the simplicity (there must have been a lot of engineering to achieve that).

The only thing I regret is the fact that they did not put helical gear (maybe not too late to change that?). That would have made it smoother and quieter.

Is it me or this time the ground was higher than last time??

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04-08-2011 11:28 AM  6 years agoPost 160
menace

rrKey Veteran

Sydney, Australia

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When i look at the new MA machines, they dont really say "MA"...

Its like they losing the classic MA look

just my opinion and wanted to vent is all.

!boo!

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