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HelicopterAerial Photography and Video Docs  AceOne Owners UNITE!
04-08-2011 03:18 PM  6 years agoPost 61
blbills

rrKey Veteran

Provo, UT

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In any of the Auto modes, how fast can you climb? My rig climbs pretty slow, even with almost full up collective.
BUT, if I go to full up on the collective stick, it will jump up really fast for a split second, which I know puts strain on the gears. I have learned not to increase collective above the last tick mark on my tx.
Mine does the exact same thing.

Haven't gotten to a point in the tuning where I adjust the slow assent rate but I did notice that if I give it full collective it'll jump very aggressively. Not good when you're carrying $10K of camera on board.

Thought that it may be a tx calibration problem but I re-did that and am having the same results.

I sure wish that this thing wasn't as rushed to the market so that they could fine tune all of these bugs. At first I thought that I was the only one with these issues,(that's how Robert portrayed it whenever I talked to him) but I guess that's not the case.

Brian

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04-08-2011 03:36 PM  6 years agoPost 62
Vortex Aerial

rrVeteran

Riverside Ca

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Mine does the same thing. Perhaps it needs a vertical velocity control similar to the horizontal speed control. The XP 3.1 had similar issues.

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04-08-2011 04:34 PM  6 years agoPost 63
westwind2

rrNovice

hong kong

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It is not a bug, it is a safety feature.

The reason for us to let the heli to gain the full collect pitch at the upper end of the collective pitch stick is that, we want the heli to have the maximum climbing speed in emergency situations.

we have once experienced a case that heli was not able to lifting fast enough in auto mode and it crash into a building, after that, we add this feature

DJI team

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04-08-2011 04:38 PM  6 years agoPost 64
webdr

rrApprentice

Atlanta GA

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wow. I thought this was an issue specific to my heli and tuning. Glad its not

FYI, Ive tried 10 ways to tune it out: changing the tx calibration, pitch curves, etc to no avail.

Robert, I think this needs to be added to the squawk list if others are experiencing it. The biggest pain point is climbing while going fast forward. The climb is reduced so bad (in fast forward flight) that it takes half a football field to climb 50 feet.

I was approaching a house at 20mph (shooting a flyover video)and applied up collective to climb and fly over the roof. Well things got interesting as I began to apply up and it started climbing very slowly. I had to slam full back cyclic to stop short of hitting

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04-08-2011 04:49 PM  6 years agoPost 65
webdr

rrApprentice

Atlanta GA

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Westwind!
Glad you can join in on this thread
I hope you can provide valuable input and hear some of our issues (and praise) we have with the AceOne.

The main issue with the collective safety you built in is that its so slow right up to the top of the stick, then by increasing only one tick mark at the top, it violently climbs to the point where I would never do on purpose. Its so violent that I think it could strip a gear.

I think it needs more movement (i.e. faster climb) towards the top of the stick and remove the emergency function: it just isnt practical and seems to cause more issues than it fixes.
Matt

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04-08-2011 04:50 PM  6 years agoPost 66
westwind2

rrNovice

hong kong

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hi webdr,

Thank you so much for your feed back in this case, we may consider increase the max climbing rate to 3 to 4 meters/s, or even let it to be adjustable in the configuration software in our next upgrade. our concern is that the user must first make sure the helicopter have such lift power in loaded situation.

DJI team

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04-08-2011 04:50 PM  6 years agoPost 67
Colin Guinn

rrApprentice

Austin, TX USA

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I could be wrong, but it sounds to me like WestWind is saying that the ability to climb extremely quickly at the upper limit of the stick is the safety feature...not the inability to climb quickly at say 75% stick.

Sounds like they need a setting so that you can adjust the climb and descend rates like the forward and side flight speed settings. I think Vortex might have already mentioned this...

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04-08-2011 04:52 PM  6 years agoPost 68
Colin Guinn

rrApprentice

Austin, TX USA

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Posted at the same time...sorry WestWind...

Yes, user adjustable climb rate would be great...you can blanket it with disclaimers if need be. Thanks for you voice in this discussion! We all have high hopes for our expensive auto pilot systems and we want to do anything we can to help (i.e. feedback, testing, suggestions, videos, etc). Thank you again...

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04-08-2011 04:56 PM  6 years agoPost 69
webdr

rrApprentice

Atlanta GA

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agreed, yes we were all posting at the same time.
Like Colin said, thanks to Robert and you for being a voice in here.

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04-08-2011 05:19 PM  6 years agoPost 70
westwind2

rrNovice

hong kong

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thank you so much for your active support on DJI product, our technical engineers will spend more time to interact with users from now on. and we will release our next upgrade in about 10 days. which will include a bunch of new improvements including the new control parameters, FBL improvement, new control mode... we are confident that you will love it a lot. thank you again for all your support.

DJI team

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04-08-2011 05:20 PM  6 years agoPost 71
UAVProducts

rrApprentice

Mchigan, USA

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The nice thing is you will get great customer service with a DJI.

Little bugs like this and particular features are easily customized. DJI likes feedback and will cater to the customers need. Plus with the simple online firmware upgrades changes are just a click away. So much nicer than having to send back the main controller.

New firmware will be ready in a few days.

New manual and instructions are almost done.

Robert
N.A. Dist for DJI
N.A. Dist. for PhotoHigher
Formerly DJIUSA

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04-08-2011 05:21 PM  6 years agoPost 72
webdr

rrApprentice

Atlanta GA

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Jeez guys Im feeling all warm and fuzzy inside.

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04-08-2011 06:09 PM  6 years agoPost 73
Wayne Mann

rrVeteran

United States of​America

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Hi guys,

Thanks for joining the conversation Westwind2. I was sent an Ace One for testing a little over a month ago. I had the same full collective thing happen while climbing out over some trees and I almost made a mess in my pants. Like someone else said the big issue here is stripping a gear and having the helicopter crash in what would most likely be a bad place and time to have a crash. Not to mention the large amounts of money that is tied up in some of these helicopters including cameras and mounts. I would prefer to see that feature turned off in Auto and Attitude mode and maybe leave some retuned version of it in Manual mode. If you get in trouble and need more collective you can switch back to manual mode for the extra collective.

I have already sent Robert who passed along my requests for changes regarding the gimbol stabilization. Some changes were included in the last software update. The lastest things that I sent Robert about the camera mount side of the Ace One are; the pitch or tilt control on the camera mount needs to be changed so that it operates in heading hold like a tail rotor so that you can use the elevator stick (fore and aft cyclic stick) on the camera mount radio. That way when the camera operator gives a command to tilt the camera down and then lets go of the stick the camera mount will stay in that position instead of returning to neutral. The way it is set up now for use with a knob or slider it is talored for single operator use for taking still pictures. That is a critical change that needs to happen for professional video guys.

The next big thing is that the roll axis on the camera mount is way too slow to respond when the helicopter leans left or right in the wind or when you simply give a right or left cyclic command. The servo is so slow to respond in most cases it does virtually nothing. On the plus side the IMU on roll axis is very good over the course of a flight about keeping the horizon level, meaning I have not experience any drifting. My camera mount has a 6:1 reduction on roll axis with a Futaba S9255 servo and an external pot. I have tried 3 turn, 1 turn and the standard 1/2 turn Futaba pot on roll axis. The Futaba pot makes the servo respond much faster than the 3 turn pot, but unfortunately it is still way to slow. Those of you that have three axis gimbols need to test this so that you can chime in regarding the camera mount issues. As I told Robert who passed this information along to DJI; for professional video guys camera mount stabilization is 100 times more important than helicopter stabilization, unless we are talking about a flybarless model. I realize that very few here doing video have 25 plus years of competition experience like Wendell and myself so that ratio will vary depending on pilot skill. But, the point is that if you had a Cineflex V14 on the front of your model for a camera mount you would not need much in the way of helicopter stabilization to produce virtually perfect video with a 300mm lens.

The Ace One has been very impressive with a flybared rotor head. I have not been able to get the flybarless side of the Ace One to hold the helicopter in "Manual mode" anywhere near as well as the Futaba GY 750 does. Since updating the Ace One software a couple weeks ago or so I have not been able to get out and test the flybarless side due to the fact that here in NC it has just been stupid windy lately. The model that I have the Ace One on is my primary video machine so I have to be really carefull with testing.

Anyway get out there and do some camer mount testing and report back.

Wayne Mann

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04-09-2011 02:01 AM  6 years agoPost 74
Helix Hobbies

rrNovice

Dallas, TX

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I have been flying a flybarless head with the Ace for the last couple months. I could never get it to fly well, so I finally decided to change back to a flybar head and flew a little today.

All I can say is WOW! It was a night and day difference between the two. Very stable in manual mode and terrific in auto and never changed any settings.

I still need to fine tune but the winds are over 20mph for the next few days.

I'm sure DJI will get the flybarless parameters tuned, but in the meantime, I'm back to flybars.

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04-09-2011 03:29 AM  6 years agoPost 75
Eco8gator

rrElite Veteran

Palm Beach, FL

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Use a mini vbar for the fbl portion

C

Xera Motors
ProBar
Minicopter
Thunder Power

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04-09-2011 04:55 AM  6 years agoPost 76
Wayne Mann

rrVeteran

United States of​America

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webdr,

If you will increase your collective range in your radio by raising the top end pitch in the pitch curve menu the helicopter will climb faster for the same amount of collective input. If I use my normal high pitch settings the collective response is very slow in Attitude mode and Auto mode. I probably added 2 degrees or more through a series of tests and increases, but that fixed the problem. The issue then becomes when you go too high on the collective stick for more horizontal speed or to climb faster and the Ace One suddenly gives you full collective range you now have way too much collective available and you run the risk of stripping the main gear. That "safety" function needs to be removed or give the user the option to choose it.

Wayne Mann

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04-09-2011 03:31 PM  6 years agoPost 77
blbills

rrKey Veteran

Provo, UT

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

That "safety" function needs to be removed or give the user the option to choose it.
+10!

The other major thing that I've having a hard time with (aside from the collective jump, the drift in auto, and the overall twitchiness) is the fact that it flys like crap in manual mode FBL. This thing is a handful in manual mode. It's almost like not have any stabilization assistance and flying a naked FBL setup. Even with the gains cranked all the way up.

Most likely its due to me being spoiled for the last few years using vbars. I really don't want to have to put FB heads back on my helis; that should not have to be the solution for a product that advertises FBL operation. From my experience there are just too many advantages that FBL brings. I'd rather have a good flying heli (w/ vbar) than to have all of the safety features that the AceOne brings.

Just my 2 cents

Brian

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04-09-2011 03:38 PM  6 years agoPost 78
webdr

rrApprentice

Atlanta GA

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Im totally on the opposite end with flybarless; mine flies so well in manual its not funny. Its extremely smooth and predictable.

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04-09-2011 03:40 PM  6 years agoPost 79
UAVProducts

rrApprentice

Mchigan, USA

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I agree the FBL should work as advertised and I'm sure it will get better. I mean its not that bad right now, lots of customer are happy with the FBL on the Ace One. Its no 3D, but who cares, we just want to get up and into Attitude/Auto mode. But for AP/AV I see no advantage to a FBL head. Okay, ease of transport I will concede on and less parts on the head.

I will stay with my flybars for AP/AV and keep the FBL for testing and my hack 3D (if that).

I think if you look around, you will find the majority of the "pros" swear by the Fly Bar. Like I always say. Its the best mechanical dampener out there.

Either way, FBL will get better. DJI will not just sit back, they constantly are working for improvements. That's the #1 reason I work for them. I don't sell junk and I hate sales pitches.

Robert
N.A. Dist for DJI
N.A. Dist. for PhotoHigher
Formerly DJIUSA

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04-09-2011 03:57 PM  6 years agoPost 80
BarryB

rrApprentice

UK + Asia

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Webdr,

I'm just curious as to how you can explain how you managed to 'tune out' the sidweays drift on your Ace One given that it has since been accepted as a bug in the system ?.

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