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HelicopterScale Model RC Helicopters › super scale comp rules?
02-20-2011 06:36 PM  6 years agoPost 1
andyscud

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england

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i am seeking clarification on the way points are awarded in compititions.
if i go flybarless would i be penalised for using a aid such as helicommand?

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02-20-2011 08:55 PM  6 years agoPost 2
PETER ROB

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Devon UK

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penalised for using a aid such as helicommand

Why should you be penalised, no body seems to be able to fly without them nowadays, so don't worry about it
Peter R

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02-20-2011 09:33 PM  6 years agoPost 3
payne1967

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uk

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peter
some of us can
i've flown 2 blade fbl and 3 blade without electronic aids (apart from the tail gyro)
but it is a lot easier to fly with electronics

and as you say most of the multi blade head scale machines use electronic aids on the head

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02-20-2011 10:55 PM  6 years agoPost 4
darrens

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United Kingdom

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Why should you be penalised, no body seems to be able to fly without them nowadays, so don't worry about it
Not this old chestnut again.....please!!!!!!

He who dies with the most toys is the winner!

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02-21-2011 02:29 AM  6 years agoPost 5
Dr.Tim

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Mojave Desert

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I have competed without stablization on all my flybarless helicopters for years .. I do not believe there is anything in place right now that says you can not use them .. So go ahead and use one, Afterall it's about enjoying Scale Helicopters. I do think that it's a matter of time before they do away with the flybarless bonus points.

From Simple minds come simple ideas! Approach Engineering

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02-21-2011 08:39 AM  6 years agoPost 6
PETER ROB

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Devon UK

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a matter of time before they do away with the​flybarless bonus points.

Dr Tim, In the uk, The points for flybarless and muti head systems, Were a bonus, because anyone who flew these set up's, knew, it was more technically demanding
If the "bonus points are to be done away with", then you will penalise those piots who still like the challenge of the muli blade head
Better to, not add the bonus points to those pilots who have to use head stabilisation

At the weekend I saw one of the latest aids, priced at £2300.00, with full GPS capabilities, and the return home option, when the transmitter is awitched off, it will end up hovering in a one metre cube of air space, at a height defined by the pilot
With these advances, in technology, how long will it be before it is possible to pre-program a six minute flight shedule containing all the full size manouvers?
Peter R

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02-21-2011 09:14 AM  6 years agoPost 7
darrens

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United Kingdom

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Better to, not add the bonus points to those pilots who have to use head stabilisation
To do that would be to assume that a multi blade with stabilisation is as stable as a machine with a flybar and that's not the case the majority of the time.
With these advances, in technology, how long will it be before it is possible to pre-program a six minute flight shedule containing all the full size manouvers?
I agree, this will clearly be possible in the very near future and the rules will obviously need to disallow it. That said, someone will always cheat and try to hide what they have, but that's life. If they cheat to win then they know they have achieved nothing and frankly if someone needs a little shinny cup so much to feel good about themselves, then they are welcome to it.

He who dies with the most toys is the winner!

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02-21-2011 01:38 PM  6 years agoPost 8
PETER ROB

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Devon UK

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knew, it was more technically demanding

Darren, I did not assume anything, I said it was " more technically demanding"
That implies, there are a lot more things to consider, other than a box of electronics
servo torque,servo throw, ball positions, pitch curves, throttle curves, pitch control, and that's just for a start
I have seen too many pilots moving into scale, buying a fuselage, putting the two together, then flying 3D manouvers, get fed up with that and then start to fly scale manouvers without changing any of the setting they had for their pod and boom, next a multi blade head, with of course, a set of electronics, does it fly scale like???

An anacdote to your hidden electronics comment
Peter Wales at an early Kevil fun fly, put up a turbine with multiblade, it flew like it was on rails, everybody was impressed with the flight,after the flight, one of my group asked Peter, who was sitting next to Len Mount, have you got head stabilisation, after a short pause and looking at Len, they both replied in unison,"Yes but it is not switched on"
(can not remember whether it was his Vario135, or Hirobo Lama)
Peter R

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02-21-2011 02:11 PM  6 years agoPost 9
darrens

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United Kingdom

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Hi Peter, I do agree that a stab unit on one machine may make it like a flybar....sort of, but on another machine may certainly not. This is an impossible topic to get right or police, so we just have to leave the comp directors to make the rules and then run with it.

He who dies with the most toys is the winner!

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02-21-2011 02:30 PM  6 years agoPost 10
Pistol Pete

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Seffner, FL

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,"Yes but it is not switched on"

I said that once to a police officer about my radar detector while passing through the state of Virginia. Still got me a ticket.

~~Enjoying the hobby one flight at a time~~

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02-21-2011 04:38 PM  6 years agoPost 11
Dr.Tim

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Mojave Desert

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It's a Tough Subject guys ... This is something we will have to address when it comes time .. Right Now? Well, I don't think it's quite time yet but I do think it's coming ... Sooner than later.

From Simple minds come simple ideas! Approach Engineering

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02-22-2011 04:21 AM  6 years agoPost 12
PETER ROB

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Devon UK

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This is something we will have to address​when it comes time .

Dr Tim, It is already here in the UK, the BMFA, our controling body, has allowed helicopters with flybarless heads,and electronics, to be used in the 'A' & 'B' test
Darren, you will need to change the statment at the bottom of your post, to,
He with the most money wins
Peter R

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02-22-2011 09:09 AM  6 years agoPost 13
darrens

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United Kingdom

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Darren, you will need to change the statment at the bottom of your post, to,
He with the most money wins
Peter R
Peter, That wouldn't work...........as I know some quite wealthy retired people who still don't win anything even with all that time and money on their hands

He who dies with the most toys is the winner!

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02-22-2011 09:33 AM  6 years agoPost 14
NickC

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Leicestershire UK

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Absolute classic PMSL

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02-22-2011 10:01 PM  6 years agoPost 15
Sidneyw

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Huntersville, NC

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I always thought the competition is based on workmanship and trueness to full size 1:1 while flight characteristic from pilot competency is secondary. A master builder might no longer be able to fly as good as in his earlier years should not be turned away from receiving the recognition. If stabilization system or even autopilot flight system can represent the grace of the work in the air, so be it IMHO.

If anything is needed, it is to consider total cost involved. A scratch build cost less with man-hour and passion; a turbine may sound good but out of reach for many who happen to be not so wealthy but rich in building now how. Depending on size, >$10,000, in between and <$5000 is a start.

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03-17-2011 07:19 PM  6 years agoPost 16
Sidneyw

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Huntersville, NC

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How about the use of this system? As I came across the DJI GPS system ad at home page here, I searched youtube and found this ..... FBL is now available. This will change the outcome, won't it?

Watch at YouTube

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03-17-2011 09:00 PM  6 years agoPost 17
andyscud

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england

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this video is exactly what scares me!

are comp directors looking to recognise pilot skill, or the best computer flight wins!!

this needs addressing now with clear guidelines for people competing and spectating.

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03-17-2011 09:49 PM  6 years agoPost 18
Peter Wales

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Orlando Fl

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I could only watch a few seconds of that video due to the horrible noise coming out of my speakers.

If what you are complaining of, ie autonomous flight, is to be prohibited, how do you police it?

Given a big enough helicopter with enough sealed compartments, it is possible to hide anything anywhere if you REALLY want to CHEAT! The judges cannot touch the model so they have little chance of finding it

Peter Wales
http://scalehelicopters.org

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03-17-2011 10:04 PM  6 years agoPost 19
Sidneyw

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Huntersville, NC

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If I invested $20k or more, I WILL get on of these. Unless, the rules will give bonus points to over 70 years old competitors .... a 25 years old against a 70 years old in reflex and eye sight competition is not quite right, is it?

No harm done when everyone is using it.

After all it is not a poor man's hobby when you are at this stage.

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03-18-2011 03:50 AM  6 years agoPost 20
reaper31

rrVeteran

Littleton, CO, usa

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this is the kind of attitude that destroyed contests like top gun and scale masters for the airplane guys...the idea that its not a poor mans hobby and "if i spend 20K i should be allowed to let a computer fly my plane/heli..." that’s not what the hobby is about. if you take the time to know your heli and learn to fly it you will not need GPS. i am 25, i have been flying for about 3 years...it will be a long time before i have the experience and finesse you "more experienced" guys have (that’s how it evens out).

Robbert De Bock

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