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Helicopter
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Century Radikal E640 - Swift 16 NX
› Batteries for the Swift 620
08-11-2010 10:25 PM  7 years agoPost 21
dougbo

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Tri-cities, WA

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6S 4000-5300mAh, Headspeed will be 1700 - 1800, blades: 600mm Aerotech woodies & CF. I have some 620mm CF blades but they might be a bit much for the Swift 16 stretch.

Doug B.

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08-11-2010 11:24 PM  7 years agoPost 22
oldfart

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Vancouver, Canada

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That 6S pack should be fine with 600mm blades at those rotor speeds.

Phil

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08-12-2010 12:39 AM  7 years agoPost 23
dougbo

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Tri-cities, WA

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Good deal. Thanks.

Doug B.

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08-12-2010 03:52 AM  7 years agoPost 24
MAXHSHV

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,mn usa

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with stk grips and 600 blades make sure you keep your blade speed low.those grips were only spec'ed for 550 blades for up to 2100, 1800 with 600's should be fine but i wouldn't go any higher.
your setups sound good.that 650a motor will rock.

Century heli rep. To much power is never enough.

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08-12-2010 05:33 AM  7 years agoPost 25
dougbo

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Tri-cities, WA

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Thanks Max - I'll keep it under 1800. Down the road I'll upgrade the grips just to prevent any long term fatigue issues.

Yes, the 650A motor looks huge in the Swift 16 frame. I'll post some pictures after I get her in the air.

Doug B.

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08-12-2010 02:32 PM  7 years agoPost 26
rotormonkey

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Ottawa, ON - Canada

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Well, I've got it up in the air and flying now. I gotta say this heli flies like a dream. Sooooo light in the air. I'm gonna have fun with this little guy!

Just a couple questions to ask of you guys that have owned these.

1: I'm running 2x 4500mah 4s packs in series. After a 4 minute flight, I'd drained 4000mah out of one pack, and 2000 out of the other. On the packs I used for test hopping and initial setup, one was drained 1500mah, and the other about 100mah. Clearly there is an imbalance here somehow. I imagine this is due to the internal resistance of one pack being higher than the other? What would you guys do about this? Obviously I'm not going to just terf the packs. Will they even out over time. Or maybe I should just take the two packs that aren't really being discharged, and put those together and see what happens?

2: While flying, it's great. But it doesn't seem to like being on the ground. On spool up, it gets into just a bit of ground resonance as many helis do. On spool DOWN however it kinda does a bit of a chicken dance. If I auto down (which I usually do anyway) there's no problem once the HS is bled off. But I'd still like to know if there's a cure. I should mention that I'm flying the Century FBL head. I tried putting in the rubber dampers from the stock head, but they didn't seem to help much. I still haven't balanced the blades yet (we'll get to that over the weekend I think), but usually the RTs are close enough I don't bother. Maybe with the long landing gear and a slight imbalance in the blades it's creating a harmonic that's worse than usual? I've put on the stiffer v3 landing struts, and that did help quite a bit, but it's still not gone entirely. Any suggestions are welcome.

Thanks!
RM

If it can't hover, it ain't worth flying.

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08-12-2010 04:40 PM  7 years agoPost 27
HarveyR

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France - North

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For the first point, doesn't your balancer give you the resistance? If it does maybe you could start by checking your two packs are similar. I know that my 6S5O00mAH vary from about 8 to 36 (Ohms or mOhms, I don't remember) depending on the make and age.

For the second... I can only confirm, mine also has a terrible spool down dance problem (spool up is OK), which I solve by always landing with TH (auto). I have the tuff landing gear and 610mm RT blades with the standard flybar head. Once I actually broke a servo arm during a spool down dance (I aborted taking of because of a wasp, so I spooled down on the ground, so no auto, and the spool down was really violent).

I've often commented on this, but I'm sure they should make the lower frame come lower down in order to have lower profile landing skids. I'm sure it's the high legs that make it so vulnerable to spool down dancing. I also find it would look cooler with a higher frame and lower skids (they needn't change anything to the actual mechanics, it's just the lower frame that needs stretching and the canopy fixation reworked)

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08-12-2010 04:44 PM  7 years agoPost 28
HarveyR

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France - North

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Question : Do you use any fancy electronics to go with your FBL head? Because most people seem to use these "autopilot/stabilizing" devices to fly FBL?

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08-12-2010 08:39 PM  7 years agoPost 29
rotormonkey

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Ottawa, ON - Canada

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Well, I just have the Astro blinkey balancer. It's REALLY nothing fancy. Sure doesn't tell me anything about impedance. I have no such device to give me such numbers either. I suppose it might not be a bad idea to invest in something like that.

As for the landing gear, it keeps the batteries out of the dirt. Because of that big ol' landing gear you can strap whatever battery you want on to this thing, and make it work which is a BIG plus imo. I'd rather have the long struts and put up with having to auto than not have them. It's a unique design feature that I really like.

To answer your question about an FBL "autopilot", yeah, I have a vbar on it.

If it can't hover, it ain't worth flying.

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08-13-2010 05:06 AM  7 years agoPost 30
MAXHSHV

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,mn usa

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what brand of batteries are you useing?I haven't had such a large difference, 100 mah at the most.as for the chicken dance ,shorter landing gear does help the issue,but I found on my nx 550 the different motors makes a huge difference, with a 650a 800kv motor I had no such issue but with the scorpion it was signifigant,I have a shutdown routine I use on all my heli's(when I don't auto)where i hit throttle hold and apply lots of negitive pitch quickly and this stops the chicken dance.I acually started doing this becuase of flybarless heli's(seams every once in a while they will (for no apperent reason)a violent chicken dance on spool down)the tension on the grips can affect this also,especially if one is tighter then the other.I run my blades pretty tight ,for various reason's.

Century heli rep. To much power is never enough.

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08-13-2010 05:19 AM  7 years agoPost 31
rotormonkey

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Ottawa, ON - Canada

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It's those swanky new HK nano techs. As it turns out though, I think I must have just done something dumb. Got 'em mixed up or something because everything seems fine now. Just put a couple more cycles on 'em and now about 100mah difference. No big deal.

I probably charged one set, and mixed 'em up.

If it can't hover, it ain't worth flying.

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08-14-2010 01:30 AM  7 years agoPost 32
MAXHSHV

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,mn usa

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100 mah sounds normal,I usually find the strongest batt and put it on the postive side of the series setup, because it seams this is the battery that always uses more mah, if I'm useing a castle bec I will put it on the negitive side battery to try and balance out the battery draw.when i do this it usually comes out real close.

Century heli rep. To much power is never enough.

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08-14-2010 08:48 AM  7 years agoPost 33
HarveyR

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France - North

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What happens if you try to fly an FBL head without the stabalizing/autopilot module? Because I don't understand why on older helies it was possible to fly FBL with no additional electronics? What would actually happen? Has anyone tried?

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08-14-2010 01:11 PM  7 years agoPost 34
rotormonkey

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Ottawa, ON - Canada

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Yep, it certainly can be done. Honestly going without electronics is fine for scale flying. And you CAN do sport and 3d flying that way too, but the flight characteristics are crap. It'll pitch around on it's own in the wind, etc. Bit of a handful. The electronic stab system just calms it back down to the way it was with a flybar, but you still get the added benefit of more flight time, better power, etc.

If it can't hover, it ain't worth flying.

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08-26-2010 07:38 PM  7 years agoPost 35
Sidneyw

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Huntersville, NC

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After three years of reading the Swift 16 in 3 forums, I finally got two of them late last year thru early this year. Finished the 2nd one in FBL two weeks ago (no e-stab), I have had to give it a try.

Took video on 3rd flight but the hat cam was not pointing right so half of the time the heli was out of the frame, did some clipping and posted it last night. Fear of crashing, I know my piloting skill will never improve.

Setup using cheapo DS821, Clone Gyro, 3026-88kv, 10T, 5S 3300mah, if I crash it the pain level is low. BTW, I get 8 minutes without flybar and 7 with. Both consume 2400-2500 mah.

Watch at YouTube

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08-27-2010 09:51 AM  7 years agoPost 36
HarveyR

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France - North

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Hi, looks like it's flying nice and smooth, with no e-stab! I'd like to have one of those hat cams... where'd you get it from, and what quality can they do?

About your skills, you're flying is quite smooth and nice for standard flying, you could have a scale fuselage on it, it would go well with your flight. I much appreciate seeing a RC heli doing nice smooth circuits, that's how real helies fly, and originally, that's what RC is all about!

I'd really be curious to test FBL without e-stab to see clearly what the problem is (and what the e-stab (or stabbar for that matter) actually improve). I remember my MagicRanger flew the same with or without the flybar, so I just took it off to reduce crash costs and since then (10 years ago) I've always wondered what they were for... but in those days I didn't do as much high speed or 3D stuff.

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08-27-2010 06:19 PM  7 years agoPost 37
oldfart

rrProfessor

Vancouver, Canada

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Using heavy tipped blades, that have a chordwise CCG that keep the blade pitch forces properly concentrated around the feathering shaft, and extending the blade grip control arm to limit the pitch movement relative to the swashplate movement (to maximize the servos resolution) will make general flying without a flybar very easy.

Where a properly tweaked electronic stabilization system will help a lot (as will a flybar) is through maneuvers that result in changes in rotor speed and in winds and FFF & FBF, where the translational lift the rotor experiences from these relative winds, varies with the wind speeds and the forward or backward speeds of the heli.

In both FBL cases, the workload on the servo is increased drastically So you will find that your RX battery consumption increases a lot and the better the servo, the more precise the response (a must for 3D at high rotor head speeds).

Phil

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08-31-2010 08:02 PM  7 years agoPost 38
rotormonkey

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Ottawa, ON - Canada

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Well, I did promise an update. I've been flying my Swift for a little while now, and couldn't be happier. It still gets into ground resonance a bit on spool down if I don't auto, but that's not a big deal since I land just about every flight with an auto

Anyway, the infamous RCCanuck took some vid of me doing my thing when I visited him last week apparently and posted it up here already:

https://rc.runryder.com/helicopter/t604948p1/

If it can't hover, it ain't worth flying.

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08-31-2010 11:10 PM  7 years agoPost 39
oldfart

rrProfessor

Vancouver, Canada

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Rotormonkey,

Good for you, glad to hear you are having fun with it.

I use the stock flybar head, and I believe you are using an FBL system.

With the 620SE, I have not experiences any spool up or down resonances that you report. But looking at some of the threads on FBL forums, they seem to be more prone to this.

The initial versions of the Swift 16 was also susceptible to this, with their initial, very tall and spindly landing gear struts. Fortunately, with their subsequent version of the struts, they were resonant free.

Now, with the heavy duty type of rigid struts found on your 620SE and the new Swift NX, using the standard flybar head, you will find it non existant.

Of course with the many FBL "black box" systems, they may be something that will cause some dancing on spool up and down, as the gyro systems may "wag" in cyclic like a tail gyro can, as they try to combat each other when the heli cannot move, because its' skids are planted on the ground.

With a flybar system, it is the flybar that will move as the rotor speed increases on spool up, or decreases on spool down, when the heli cannot move as it is on the ground, and no longer free to move as it is in free air.

Phil

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09-02-2010 08:48 AM  7 years agoPost 40
HarveyR

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France - North

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Yep, really nice flying. I'd say it shows me my next step!

I confirm the spool down dance problem as I sometimes have a really severe instance of it (quarter turn on grass and once I even brocke a servo arm, I posted about this at the time). I have a 620SE with the tuff landig gear. I've tried all kinds of blade tightness, but no improvement.

Only solution I've found is to auto down each time, I never land normally, always auto (even if only from 50cm, more of an umergency land in this case than an auto).

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Helicopter
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Century Radikal E640 - Swift 16 NX
› Batteries for the Swift 620
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