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Electric General Discussion
› Motor warm and battery hot
10-23-2009 07:27 AM  8 years agoPost 1
SeismicCWave

rrVeteran

Hilo, Hawaii

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Hi ladies and gentlemen,

I know there is a theory behind this. I have read some place but I forgot the theory. I can use some help.

I have warm motor but hot battery pack. What does that mean? Motor too big and battery too small? Pinion too big? Motor kV too high?

TIA

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10-23-2009 10:46 AM  8 years agoPost 2
OICU812

rrMaster

Edson, Alberta, Canada

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Several things can come into play here.

First off alot depends if you have matched the appropriate motor to your specific application?

Secondly if you feel you have indeed done this, you have to consider if you are running the right pinion as you mention, reason being if your ESC is backed off to much it becomes a restriction creating un usable heat and energy loss to the system. I suggest looking into using such tools as Mr. mels Headspeed calculator and referring to what your esc is and your throttle % at hand. Depending on such you need to be in an acceptable range for the esc to be effective in having governor room, but yet "open" enough to release and be efficient as well and to not create heat.

If your gearing is overall a high leverage you could be pulling far to many amps from the pack and creating such heat to the pack, heat kills packs for certain and in a hurry as well.

Having to much un useable headspeed is beating air into submission and achieves nothing but what you say.

A short review of your setup would help in determining a better answer to your question if you could supply that sir.

...Once upon a time there were Nitros, flybars and frequency pins...

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10-24-2009 03:02 AM  8 years agoPost 3
bexusflexus

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Tulsa, OK

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I agree with everything OICU812 said. If you are talking about your Trex600 and are not using 35C batteries or above I can tell you that they will run very hot. I tried a TP 6S 5000mah 25C battery for a bit and it could not maintain stable voltage for this setup. It had to work way too hard. The Hyperion 6s 5000mah 35C performs admirably though. Max amps for the 25C batt was only about 80a. The 35C batt was able to throw out 103amps. Pretty huge difference.

EDIT:
Voltage drop on Hyperion was linear, TP voltage was very erratic.

even not doing anything would have been better than nothing...

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10-24-2009 03:22 AM  8 years agoPost 4
SeismicCWave

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Hilo, Hawaii

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Thank you gentlemen. I was referring to my eRaptor 620. I am running a Neu 1521/1.5Y with 1050 kV. I am using the 111T main gear and as small a pinion as I can find. Right now 9T the battery get too hot. 8T is fine. Battery is hot but not very hot.

I was wonder if I should get a lower kV motor or different batteries. Maybe I will go and try some Hyperion batteries.

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10-24-2009 03:36 AM  8 years agoPost 5
OICU812

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Edson, Alberta, Canada

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That's what I had at the time in my E rappy, you are high on the KV for sure sir.

...Once upon a time there were Nitros, flybars and frequency pins...

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10-24-2009 03:40 AM  8 years agoPost 6
SeismicCWave

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Hilo, Hawaii

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Thanks, I think I am high on the kV. I will look into another motor.

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10-26-2009 04:38 PM  8 years agoPost 7
concept1

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Youngstown, OH

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I was running a 800kv motor and a 10t pinion in my E620 on 10s lipo, now I run a 630kv on 15s A123 (54v). so I would look into a new motor for your 620!

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10-26-2009 11:25 PM  8 years agoPost 8
Band1086

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Kennewick, Wa. USA

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If you figure 3.9V/ cell (dynamic load) on 6S, that would give you 23.4V X 1050kv = 24,570rpm...111t main, 9t pinion is 12.33 gearing.
24,570 divided by 12.33 = approx. 1993 head speed. Sounds pretty good to me. What head speed are you shooting for? What batteries are you using? What speed control? Neu motors have a reputation for running cooler than outrunners, from what I understand. But batts, what were you using???

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10-26-2009 11:36 PM  8 years agoPost 9
SeismicCWave

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Hilo, Hawaii

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>>I was running a 800kv motor and a 10t pinion in my E620 on 10s lipo, now I run a 630kv on 15s A123 (54v). so I would look into a new motor for your 620!<<

I don't know. I still like that Neu motor and it is still doing pretty well. 800 kV motor on 10S is no different than 1050 kV on 6S. Just because some people like high voltage low capacity I prefer low voltage high capacity.

My motor is just warm to touch so I think the motor is very efficient. The pack is the one that I should change.

>>1993 head speed. Sounds pretty good to me. What head speed are you shooting for? <<

Sounds good to me too. I am not shooting for any head speed except to fly comfortably with a camera. Too low head speed and it wobble. A little higher head speed is ok since the heli is well balanced.

>>What batteries are you using? <<

Both Thunder Power Packs and True RC packs.

>>What speed control?<<

Castle Phoenix 60.

>>Neu motors have a reputation for running cooler than outrunners, from what I understand.<<

This 1521 is very efficient. It is just pulling too much from the pack.

FWIW, I tried a 900 kV outrunner and no luck. I am not getting the power and head speed with 6S.

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10-26-2009 11:45 PM  8 years agoPost 10
Band1086

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Kennewick, Wa. USA

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FWIW, I tried a 900 kV outrunner and no luck. I am not getting the power and head speed with 6S
Which TP'S, V-2, earlier?
What size blades?
What pitch?
What is your flying weight?

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10-27-2009 12:31 AM  8 years agoPost 11
SeismicCWave

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Hilo, Hawaii

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>>Which TP'S, V-2, earlier?<<

Goodness, I have not pay much attention. They are at least V2 or later. (edit, I just checked. They are TP Extreme series 2007)

>>What size blades?<<

620 mm

>>What pitch?<<

Typical 6 degree hover.

>>What is your flying weight?<<

Don't have a clue. I don't really weigh my helicopters anymore. Since there really is not that much difference between one helicopters to the other. I change equipment between all the helicopters in my fleet and I cannot keep up with weighing each one every time I change something.

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10-27-2009 12:51 AM  8 years agoPost 12
Band1086

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Kennewick, Wa. USA

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Than I take it the camara doesn't add much weight? The old V-2
batteries had alot of IR so did the EVO25's that we had. They just wouldn't release their power very easily, so in doing so they heat up.
I'm testing a set of new Thunder Power 45C 5000 6S, and they have VERY low IR, such that even under extreme loads they come in about 100-105 degrees...very cool! They feel luke warm even when I push them extremely hard. I think that is your whole problem...batteries.

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10-27-2009 03:08 AM  8 years agoPost 13
SeismicCWave

rrVeteran

Hilo, Hawaii

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>>Than I take it the camara doesn't add much weight?<<

Yup, the camera plus mount is probably no more than 3 pounds. So hardly anything for the e620.

I think the bottom line is my batteries just have more IR than I like. My Trex 600 is probably not pulling as much current. Most likely it is because I am spinning longer blades with a lower kV motor that is just as efficient.

My True RC packs come back hotter and I bet that's because it has even higher IR than the TP packs.

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10-27-2009 03:12 AM  8 years agoPost 14
Band1086

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Kennewick, Wa. USA

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Three pounds is a lot of extra weight for a 50 size heli. But I still think 45C's would solve your problem.

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11-28-2009 05:33 PM  8 years agoPost 15
Band1086

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Kennewick, Wa. USA

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800 kV motor on 10S is no different than 1050 kV on 6S.
By the way, if you figure 3.8V/cell dynamic load, than 800x37v=29,600rpm...and 1050x22.6v=23,730rpm. Motor KV/batt voltage are VERY important when determining HS target and gearing needed.

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