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HelicopterOff Topics News & Politics › Will Obama hand over United States sovereignty...???...yeah I think he will; SNAFU!!!
10-21-2009 03:36 AM  8 years agoPost 1
albatross

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Texas, Houston area

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10-21-2009 07:11 AM  8 years agoPost 2
InvertedDude

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USA

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10-21-2009 07:44 AM  8 years agoPost 3
pseudonym

rrApprentice

Edmonton, Alberta

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I have a question.. how can Americans like yourselves, belive this crap? I mean.. the vast vast vast majority of those with IQs over 5 outside of the US know that this stuff is bull.. Don't you think that the rest of the world would notice if someone was proposing a one-world-government?

How come Americans are the only people on the planet that are gulible enough to belive that Obama is going to "Hand you over"... hand you over to WHO???? Not to mention, who would WANT your debt ridden asses?? Honestly.. you have to be smoking some really good stuff! Can I have some?

In case you haven't noticed, since Bush Jr. came in, Americans aren't popular anywhere in the world. There is no secret agenda.. at least not the one you propose. Unless it means obey the treaties and laws that the US itself helped write... (Such as the UN Declaration on Torture, The Declaration of rights of child soldiers, etc etc etc). If anyone should complain, it is the world about being handed over to YOU. Oh, and in case you don't know (and you don' t seem to) those treaties are considered as part of the consitution. Considering that Bush Jr. ignored pretty much ALL of them.. I think you need to reconsider who "Doesn't belive in the constitution" and who does. The rule of law includes laws that you may disagree with. Those are laws you change through congress, not just ignore because they are inconvient.

You guys really really need to stop drinking the kool-aid.

unspelling the world one misprint at a time.

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10-21-2009 07:58 AM  8 years agoPost 4
Henry

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Maryland

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I have a question.. how can Americans like yourselves, belive this crap? I mean.. the vast vast vast majority of those with IQs over 5 outside of the US know that this stuff is bull.. Don't you think that the rest of the world would notice if someone was proposing a one-world-government?

How come Americans are the only people on the planet that are gulible enough to belive that Obama is going to "Hand you over"... hand you over to WHO???? Not to mention, who would WANT your debt ridden asses?? Honestly.. you have to be smoking some really good stuff! Can I have some?

In case you haven't noticed, since Bush Jr. came in, Americans aren't popular anywhere in the world. There is no secret agenda.. at least not the one you propose. Unless it means obey the treaties and laws that the US itself helped write... (Such as the UN Declaration on Torture, The Declaration of rights of child soldiers, etc etc etc). If anyone should complain, it is the world about being handed over to YOU. Oh, and in case you don't know (and you don' t seem to) those treaties are considered as part of the consitution. Considering that Bush Jr. ignored pretty much ALL of them.. I think you need to reconsider who "Doesn't belive in the constitution" and who does. The rule of law includes laws that you may disagree with. Those are laws you change through congress, not just ignore because they are inconvient.

You guys really really need to stop drinking the kool-aid.
?

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10-21-2009 08:01 AM  8 years agoPost 5
pseudonym

rrApprentice

Edmonton, Alberta

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so Henry? Gonna answer my question or just throw up a straw man like these other fools?

unspelling the world one misprint at a time.

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10-21-2009 08:12 AM  8 years agoPost 6
InvertedDude

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USA

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10-21-2009 08:25 AM  8 years agoPost 7
Henry

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Maryland

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so Henry? Gonna answer my question or just throw up a straw man like these other fools?
I believe my point is clear.

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10-21-2009 08:36 AM  8 years agoPost 8
pseudonym

rrApprentice

Edmonton, Alberta

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again.. how is it that ONLY Amerians know about these things. There are tonnes of crazies out there. No-one takes them seriously because they are CRAZY! LOL. Really, in places other than the US, crazy is ussually a reason to ignore someone!

I don't think you understand. The rest of the world has had to LEARN to pay attention to the American crazies. It was assumed that they were treated like they are in the rest of the "west", ignored and ridiculed. But then you elected Bush, to the absolute horror of the rest of the world. So now we look to the US and we try and point out that your crazies, are really really crazy!

Look, as I said, there are lots of wackjobs. There are the Flat earthers (yes, they really do exist), or those who belive we are living in the "End times" and think that they will be bodily carried to heaven. How about the Myan calendar people? Should I be selling my stuff before 2012???

As for a "One world currency".. that is so unbeliveably crazy it isn't funny. Hell, it is probibly a good idea, but the fact is if you think Americans like the greenback, try how the British like the UK Pound!!! They live in the EU which uses Euros but STILL refuse to change currency. You have to face reality. The US is like a really big wet friendly dog in a very small crowded room. Imposible to ignore, but everyone would rather not be in the same room with them.

At least you understand how very very very bad of a position the US is in. But lets face it, the world will just let the US fail. No-one is comming, no one cares. Right now the US is important because, basicly, you are the worlds "Customer". But now you are broke and can't buy anything. So the world finds other Customers. It is already started and will only get worse.

The US needs to stop spending billions on wars, start creating real, lasting jobs, seriously reign in the banks and start working on creating a positive trade balance. If you can't do those things, America WILL become a failed state.

To Henry: Ahhh.. straw man it is. Please read the Logical Falicies and try your post again. Thank you.

unspelling the world one misprint at a time.

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10-21-2009 08:47 AM  8 years agoPost 9
InvertedDude

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USA

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10-21-2009 09:22 AM  8 years agoPost 10
pseudonym

rrApprentice

Edmonton, Alberta

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Oh thank god! A debate! W00t! There is joy in Mudville again! =) (really.. I am being serious, I was beginning to think that logical debate was a lost art).

Anyhow, I actually don't agree with you that the US is a failed state, yet. I think that there is oppertunity to fix the system, but the idea of being a "superpower" or the world's leader is going to have to go by the way-side. The US has to become a member of the world community and that means embrasing the values that the world has decided are ideals to work towards. Much like how the world has adopted the ideal of "America".

Public health care would be a very good start. The reality is that you pay WAY more in Health Insurance and get way less than anyone in the west. Why would you not want a system that will do away with your high premiums and save you a tonne of cash as well? I read stories that are just.. shocking is far to mild of a word. The idea that you could be refused nessisary medical care by any doctor, hospital or clinic of your choice is so alien.. I can't even discribe the level of uncomprehension that I feel when I read what even those who are insured go through to get medical care.. a LIST of approved doctors??? Like HUH?! I can't belive that your insurance company makes decisions on your care.. shouldn't that be up to your doctor? Public insurance just pays the bill, the doctor decides what is best and if I don't like what he decides, I can just switch doctors!

I am sorry if you think my tone is disrespectful. "America" is a concept that is held up as a shining ideal to the rest of the world. The US on the other hand seems to have forgotten what it means. I actually don't blame most Americans as I see it as a systematic and purposeful lack of Education and understanding of history and the US's place in it.

I was all excited to have a debate, but it is kinda hard to debate someone who actually agrees with you. So if you can see what is going on, why do so many republicans seem to be willfully ignorant of it? The four or five die hard republicans here on RunRyder are a good example. They try and shut down ANY debate by throwing up straw men or simply by disruption. I would happily debate any topic, I try to do my homework but when I try to start a debate, I might as well be tilting at windmills.

Anyhow, thanks for showing that there are some on the right who haven't completly lost the ablity to debate. As for the defence of Canada.. Dude, if anyone even TOUCHED Canada it would start World War III. We have so many Alies and treaties and have SO much political capital in the world that a millitary attack on Canada would be more than just unwise. As for terrorism.. the measures that the US has taken has not made you even a little safer, and homeland security admits this. There is no way to actually prevent terrorism and to quote a great great American "Sell not virtue to purchase wealth, nor Liberty to purchase power." - B. Franklin. The best way to keep safe is to be a valuable and VALUED member of the world community. That doesn't mean flexing your pecks and demanding that the world do as you say (Which seems to be US policy). The US relies on Canadian political capital, Bush learned that the hard way. We need you for trade, not defence.

unspelling the world one misprint at a time.

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10-21-2009 09:57 AM  8 years agoPost 11
InvertedDude

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USA

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10-21-2009 10:27 AM  8 years agoPost 12
Mike0251

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Hills of the Blue Ridge VA

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"Public health care would be a very good start"
My insurance pays my and the wifes bills. My insurance is affordable and reasonable for what I get in return. My wife had elective surgery a year ago and from the time we left our doctors office after speaking about the entire procedure to the time she was home in our bed out of the hospital was less than 30 days. Total cost was $24K, my out of pocket was $600. What do you get? Crap. She recovered and is much better. You can keep your Canadian health care and its system, just as I want to keep what I have without our government sticking their GD nose in any of it.
Oh but the uninsured, oh but the ones that can't afford it, oh the poor illegals, oh, oh, oh. There was a time when the response would have been get a job. There was a time when more employers offered health care benifits, there was a time when there was more employers in general. You can thank our current administration for they way they chose to spend all of our hard earned tax dollars on bailouts for the failed banking industry and other union held industries, only to watch those same people get rich from it, instead of investing in the people and the economy that once made our nation great. If you look closely and pay attention, the current administration is attempting to extract EVERY nickel and dime from EVERY source that they can get their GD greedy hands on. And its not about reforming healthcare, its about skimming the profits out of the system instead of those profits going to the healthcare industry.
Our system is broke and CORRUPT beyond all imagination, and that ain't no healthy imagination either. Stay tuned its gonna get worse.

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10-21-2009 11:09 AM  8 years agoPost 13
pseudonym

rrApprentice

Edmonton, Alberta

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As I am sure you are aware, but conviently ignore, it wasn't THIS administration that did the bail-out. It was the previous Bush administration. Obama's failure in this regard is his lack of comprehensive legislation to reign in the shadow markets for which there is no regulatory oversight (Dirvitives markets for instance).

Lets not forget that this was all started by Regan when he took the brakes off the American banking system and started all the deregulation that allowed the melt-down to occur in the first place.

As for insurance.. I have heard too many horror stories to make one good story any better. I had kidney failure, you know how much that cost me?? NOTHING! I went to the best hospitals and was treated by the best specialists. As for more experimental care, trust me, you are far behind. When I was 6 I recived one of the first, and now the oldest, interocular lens transplant opperations ever done. And yes, Dr. Gimble did it personally. So I fail to see how the care I have been given is, as you put it, crap. More than that, if an opperation is unavalible where I live, our public insurer has to fly me to a place where it IS avalible. Yes, waiting times for ELECTIVE surgery can be long, but for nessisary medical care it is immediate and based on NEED, not your standing with your insurance company. More over, my monthly insurance payments are... ZERO! I don't have any as it is covered by Health Care. Imagine what you would do with all that extra money that you aren't paying for insurance! You also can't be denied coverage for ANY reason. There is no list of approved doctors, so I am not prevented form seeing a Doctor of my choice by an insurance company. I have far more freedom of choice in health care than you could even imagine, I know, cause I can't imagine living with the restrictions that are placed on you. Incomprehension would be a more accurate term. Lets also not forget, that those who do not seek preventative treatment and early diagnosis end up costing the government orders of magnitude more once they are brought in to the emergency room with a critical problem. It costs far less to treat a cronic or serious issue early than to leave it until it is too late.

As for a money grab.. you are damn right! More over, you know the reasons! You are broke! I just can't belive that a thinking, intellegent person would buy into the idea that somehow this is Obama's fault. Iraq cost and costs billions of dollars a day. Afganistan isn't a cheap war either. Like the bailout, that was started by the previous administration. An administration that would have liked nothing better than to start a THRID war with Iran! How, exactly, would you have paid for THAT?

The reality is that our public system, which insures everyone, costs less per capita than yours. We have a much lower infant mortality rate and we live longer and stay healthier. I am sure you are going to pull out the idiotic assertation that if you took out car acidents and gun fatalities the US would top the list. That is only true if you leave IN those causes of death for other countries and only remove them for the US. Remove those causes from all countries and the US falls way way down at the bottom in every catigory of health care that can be measured.

You also seem to have forgotten that the insurance industry, last week, testified that if the regulatory situation doesn't change, the plan to raise rates by %111 in the near term! So not only do you live shorter more costly lives, but the cost will increase dramaticly as time goes on.

Again, if the US wants to survive in anything like a form that you would recognize as a first world country, just like the British Empire you will have to take a step down and join the world community. Your choices are shape up, or become a third world country. Once the flow of foreign capital drys up beyond the point that it offsets your trade deficit, the end point becomes inevitable and no amount of ideological chest pounding will stop it.

unspelling the world one misprint at a time.

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10-21-2009 01:45 PM  8 years agoPost 14
hockeysew

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Co-USA

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If in fact he signs away our sovereignty as a nation is it not an act of treason???

Liberals are like a "Slinky", useless but entertaining when pushed down stairs....

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10-21-2009 03:09 PM  8 years agoPost 15
1stPlace

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Ohio USA

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As I am sure you are aware, but conviently ignore, it wasn't THIS administration that did the bail-out.
Show a little more ignorance the next type you stoke your keyboard.

Obama's $787 billion bailout has been a miserable failure.
Lets not forget that this was all started by Regan when he took the brakes off the American banking system and started all the deregulation that allowed the melt-down to occur in the first place.
More partisan incompetent ignorant ranting...

Diejenigen, die nicht lernen aus den Fehlern der Vergangenheit bestimmt sind, zu wiederholen.

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10-21-2009 03:16 PM  8 years agoPost 16
hootowl

rrProfessor

Garnet Valley, Pa.

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I hope Canada starts taking on responsibilities on the level that the US has over modern times. The US may not be liked by many but if we stop giving our economy away and stop buying foreign goods they will like us even less.

Wolves don't lose sleep over the opinions of sheep

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10-21-2009 03:26 PM  8 years agoPost 17
1stPlace

rrApprentice

Ohio USA

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The US may not be liked by many but if we stop giving our economy away and stop buying foreign goods they will like us even less.
Frankly, I don't give a crap what people like pseudonym or any other socialist in the world thinks of us. Don't like us? Then leave us alone! Don't do business with us. Don't talk to us. Don't look at us. Just go away.
I WANT THE AMERICAN WAY OF LIFE BACK.......
Agreed 100%

Diejenigen, die nicht lernen aus den Fehlern der Vergangenheit bestimmt sind, zu wiederholen.

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10-21-2009 07:22 PM  8 years agoPost 18
pseudonym

rrApprentice

Edmonton, Alberta

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If in fact he signs away our sovereignty as a nation is it not an act of treason???
No, it is not as he is A) the elected leader (by a WIDE margin) and B) is pushing his agenda through Congress and the Senate. Unless the courts rule that the law in uncontitutional it is a vaild law. Even if the courts rule it to be uncontituational it doesn't even start to become "Treason", as you say, because laws are judged to be so all the time. That is the job of the Supreme Court!

Now for treason one just has to look at Mr. Glen Beck and his co-horts at FOX and Friends. What they are doing is called Sedition under the 1940 Alien Registration Act or Smith Act and is equivilant to treason.

In fact, the BUSH justice department completely agrees with me. In 2005 they tried to charge Laura Berg with sedition for simply writing a letter saying that the countries leaders were criminally negligent! The bar is set at the same level for both administrations, what is sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander.
Show a little more ignorance the next type you stoke your keyboard.
Wow... are you a moron. That was the second HALF of the bail-out that was designed by.. you guessed it, BUSH! LOLOLOL. What, didn't bother to watch the news before the election or something?
I hope Canada starts taking on responsibilities on the level that the US has over modern times. The US may not be liked by many but if we stop giving our economy away and stop buying foreign goods they will like us even less.

I WANT THE AMERICAN WAY OF LIFE BACK.......
What responcibilities are you speaking of? The US has extended its force to protect its economic position. There is no "responcibility" being taken. In fact, the US has only ever interviened in cases where doing so was nessisary for AMERICAN power. Over the past 50 years, I don't see how the US has done anything but make the world a much more dangerous place.

As for wanting your way of life back.. in what concrete way has your life changed from "The American Way" since the election? You may have lost your job, but the American Way would just say you obviously didn't do a good enough job or you would still have it. As for leaving you alone, that is exactly what the world is doing, and exactly why the US is currently on the road to third world status. The world has already come to the conclusion that the US is done for, and if you haven't noticed, the resession is over and things are getting better everywhere BUT the US. The US needs the world far more than we need you.

Yes I am a socialist, in the modern sense. I know and understand where I sit on the spectrum. I don't think you know what a socialist IS however, and I KNOW you don't know where you fall. Unfortunatly you are the text book definition of a Fascist. That is what those on the fanatic right are called. Not exactly surprising as Prescott Bush (Bush 41s father) was known as Hitler's Banker. Socialism is a centerist position. The fanatic left is communism.

Try educating yourselves rather than just regurgitate the bull comming for the Op-Ed department that is, by their own admission, FOX.

unspelling the world one misprint at a time.

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10-21-2009 07:35 PM  8 years agoPost 19
albatross

rrApprentice

Texas, Houston area

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Lord Monckton speaking to all the Sheeple...the Wolves are ready for the next "emergency"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PMe5dOgbu40

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10-21-2009 07:36 PM  8 years agoPost 20
STR8HUCKIN

rrApprentice

lodi ca

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More over, my monthly insurance payments are... ZERO! I don't have any as it is covered by Health Care. Imagine what you would do with all that extra money that you aren't paying for insurance! You also can't be denied coverage for ANY reason.
So you don't pay taxes in Canada?

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