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10-20-2009 10:07 PM  8 years agoPost 1
Brokenwing II

rrVeteran

Watertown, NY

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Ok I know this has been brought up before but I didn't want to go back through the posts. Are the more expensive lipos really better than say the Zippys or any of the other cheep ones? I know you usually "Get what you pay for" but some folks are saying cheaper is maybe as good.

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10-20-2009 10:14 PM  8 years agoPost 2
FlaG8r

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Florida

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Life is tough, it's tougher if you're stupid

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10-20-2009 10:14 PM  8 years agoPost 3
TJinGuy

rrProfessor

Socorro, NM - USA

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Zippy have a good track record in general. For the money they are pretty much impossible to beat. Are they the best? Maybe 1 of 2 specific models are the best but in general I think they are average.

- Chris

Team New Mexico
TJinTech

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10-20-2009 10:19 PM  8 years agoPost 4
FlaG8r

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Florida

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My .02....for the money the zippys simply cannot be beat. Especially if your running larger than 3S packs. The new Hyperion 4th generation packs that just came out claim VERY high cycle rates with little to no drop in performance. If this is the case they will be worth it. Except of course you crash, then your out $300+ dollars in the case of a 6S.

What size lipos are you going to need? Which heli?

Life is tough, it's tougher if you're stupid

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10-20-2009 10:28 PM  8 years agoPost 5
Brokenwing II

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Watertown, NY

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I just need for my Trex 450. Yeah, it seems the Zippys will be the way to go.

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10-20-2009 10:34 PM  8 years agoPost 6
FlaG8r

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Florida

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You can't beat a Turnigy, 2200mah, 30C, 3S for $19.79. Keep in mind, you'll have to pay about $28 in shipping if you want it quickly, about 4 business days. So either order a few packs, or wait 3 weeks for the standard shipping.

Life is tough, it's tougher if you're stupid

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10-20-2009 11:10 PM  8 years agoPost 7
Brokenwing II

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Watertown, NY

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Thanks. That seems the way to go. I don't mind waiting for standard shipping. I have 2 batteries now, just wanted a few more without spending an arm and a leg. Thanks again.

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10-21-2009 12:01 AM  8 years agoPost 8
FlaG8r

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Florida

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look around as they have various Mah and C ratings for 3S packs

Life is tough, it's tougher if you're stupid

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10-21-2009 11:45 AM  8 years agoPost 9
davehour

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Guayama, Puerto Rico 00785

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Where the Zyppy's are mostly bought from?

Thanks.

David

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10-21-2009 12:18 PM  8 years agoPost 10
FlaG8r

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Florida

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hobby city

Life is tough, it's tougher if you're stupid

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10-21-2009 03:05 PM  8 years agoPost 11
dfrazier

rrApprentice

Sulphur, La

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On my last order from Hobby City I chose EMS shipping for a few dollars more and I was surprised. My order left HK on a Saturday and I received it on Wednesday. 4 business days to get here. I also like it because they actually taped the box very well. When I used the cheap shipping method, the box came tied up in string.

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10-23-2009 06:15 AM  8 years agoPost 12
OICU812

rrMaster

Edson, Alberta, Canada

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Popcorn needed, open to debate :D

There are alot of debates, electric versus nitro. Now as Electric is becoming alot more main stream it seems their are more makers, more myths and assumptions of lipos being made. I wrote this to perhaps bring some light to some things I have discovered in the past few years being a hardcore electric guy. This post is not in advertisement, not in negativity towards your choice as a consumer. In reading various threads of lipo discussions across various boards I wanted to add some of my thoughts.

**NOTE** this post assumes YOU the user are obeying your 80% rule, and have some knowledge of lipo care, regardless of brand or size.
__________________________________________________ _______________________

Here is my personal opinion stance on this I do not consider myself an expert but rather an experienced electric user, popcorn ready cause it may be abit of a read . While I will poke the nerves of some please have an open mind as this I have found to be true in my journey.

(Prior to read), I have ZERO beef with Zippy, they are simply example of one of the cheaper mass makers, re-sellers of cheap lipos. In the right application I have a few myself, but going along here...

If you are a beginner: "MEANING" you are hovering, piddling about and not even into much fast forward flight. "NO" disrespect here intended either folks, we all started as beginners ok? , Allright moving along...

If you are a begginner. Sometimes budget is a first off concern as you been consumed by the "WOW" holy crap this hobby is addictive and my wife might kill me feeling. Heehee

Cheaper batteries always seem to catch the eye first, of course they do right?. Rightfully so in todays economy, however there is something I want to discuss in electrics, and in some ways this relates to the good old electric versus nitro debates..

"PRICE PER USABLE FLIGHT" << THIS IS IMPORTANT TO UNDERSTAND

What is a "useable flight"?? you may ask...

A Useable flight to me is where regardless of heli, cell count you get a consistent performance, meaning same or near same power for the duration of the flight, up to what is recommended of using 80% of the useable MAH "capacity" of the pack.

MANY times this is not considered and overlooked, many, many times.

Zippies, Rhinos and lipos such as this attract new users, people with $$ on the mind , and people who flat out believe they are expendable in sorts and that the same saying "I can buy 3 for the price of one Hyperion or TP45C" true yes, BUT you are not achieving the same "useable flights". Some have done this test and been down this road and learn this very fact.

When you are a begginer maybe a "useable flight" as described may not matter so much, fair enough. BUT as you progress you will notice that the not useable flights when a cheaper constructed and mis labelled 40C Zippy pack which is actually 26-30C pack at best starts to poop out on you. It simply is "not as fun". Those cycles to me are what I consider to be dead cycles, I don't fly them as you have to change your flight style to accomadate flight pack deterioration.

With the new TP45C and Hyperion packs having different chemistry you can achieve "useable" flights for 3-4 times the cycles, so this formula being considered the value "IS THERE" on such lipos. "useable flights" are easily seen on using eagle tree or Hyperion E meter devices, although drops can be slight in some cases of the Zippys etc, they are easily recorded and seen with such devices and as they do deteriorate. After their useable flights portion of the cycle life, they become pyhsically easy to see in flight and feel.

NOW!!... not to jump around but if you're crashing alot, "MAYBE" a cheapo pack is ok for you, maybe you don't make it to 50 cycles before you crash? I dunno, I am being open minded and agreeing with you if this is your case. Whatever works for you the user.

Keep in mind not all lipos are created alike fellas whether you believe it or not , also realize that there is not one central place these are all being created. The MYTH that all lipos are from the same place, heatshrunk with a vendor/manufacturers name is complete BS folks, I assure you of this very thing.

Several NON sponsored people have provided such testing on RCG to show the TP45C and Hyperion technology cycle life, take those proven cycles provided with concrete data and you will see the "price per flight" value of some of the higher end lipos, like the new TPs and Hyperions. Data of both the TP and Hyp are there with results in cases of over 300 flights with only loss in MAH capacity and not in useable flight.

Now this is where it gets interesting...

If you are an "advanced" pilot. By defintion you are starting or are pushing the heli to the labelled "C" continuous and Burst limits. You also or may be running a system which demands are that to the higher limits of a packs outputs, this next piece pertains to you folks..

Cheaper construction packs which have far less QC measure, no aging time prior to release, no guranteed cell matching practices will show their "price" difference here in a negative light.

6S example on a HV systems: AKA Logo 500, T-Rex 600, Outrage 550

If you buy Pack A "their best version" - "Zippy, Rhino, and a few such as these" at say 140USD shipped, lets say you buy 3, so $420. Each of those A packs gets 60 "useable" <<key word flights, so you got 180 flights between the 3 packs, thus a price of $2.33 per flight.

Now Pack B: "TP45C, Hyperion G3X" $228HP,-$280.oo USD (1) Pack
Proven by testing and account of idependant testors not affiliated to show "useable" cycles of over 160 cycles (+) you are getting Quality control, good connetors, cell matching, aging process prior to delivery to consumer, and most important "TRUE" C rating that is obvious in eagle tree or Hyperion E meter testing. Now a price per flight of at max value pack shown of new technology of $1.75 all of which are useable flights with a higher C rating and more performance as well. So conclude on that, not only cheaper, but more enjoyable, more powerfull flights, "if" this is a bonus factor for you?..maybe

That being said, are you really gaining or losing??, you decide, proof is in the pudding as the old saying goes.

Now on top of this do not forget you can not charge pack A cheaper pack at 5-6C, so your time may or may not be worth it, plus since you are getting the value you in fact need "less" packs.

Again not to ruffle feathers, I been being quite about this for awhile. But there are reasons that Hobby King will not send lipos to indendant non sponsored users that have knowledge and will show "TRUE" data of their lipos, reason is simple. They are not true to their labbeling point 1, point 2 longevity in "useable" cycles is not there for an experience user with a system matched to "THEIR" advertised abilities of their lipos and they count on the economies scare tactic of "IM CHEAP". Next...Warranty, crash replacements, customer support, knowledge base of course all of importance if you value your money based on dollar per object in view.

There is no disputing that lipos are expensive in general in comparisons to other parts of our every day lives, some or worth the bucks some are not. Point I suppose I am trying to make is when deciding don't discount the newest products, I do sincerely as a long time E user, believe we are entering past the hype zone and based on allot of elaborate, detailed testing we are in a new revolution of lipos with the newest chemistry and cell structure techniques.

In the end do what you like, but be open minded and take into consideration your situation. If you are dead set on cheaper is better, go that route it is your choice, this was not intended regardless of how you take it to convince you otherwise, it is just what I have experienced as some others have as well. If you are not crashing much anymore, or you can see the math consider your options, they're there and they are getting better ever single day.

While in mentioning brands, the goal of this NO MATTER what "YOU" pick is to shed light for people for their needs and to be open minded to "USEABLE" flights, and to see value in "price per useable flights". Be well

Shawn

...Once upon a time there were Nitros, flybars and frequency pins...

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10-23-2009 07:58 AM  8 years agoPost 13
misskimo

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Alaska 17 years, before mississippi for 31y

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Great writing Shawn. That's just what I was trying to type up last night. Chat later. No time. Shopping with the wife

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10-23-2009 08:38 AM  8 years agoPost 14
rcman

rrKey Veteran

Logan, Utah

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Shawn,

Very well said, I second his post!!

David Olsen

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10-23-2009 10:14 AM  8 years agoPost 15
OICU812

rrMaster

Edson, Alberta, Canada

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Well sometimes not the best writer, and not all will read it all and perhaps take some wrong but this at the moment is what I am seeing and the line and difference in lipos is becoming a wider gap as the electric game heats up is all.

...Once upon a time there were Nitros, flybars and frequency pins...

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10-23-2009 12:10 PM  8 years agoPost 16
Taipan

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Sydney, Australia

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Shawn, I take it you enjoyed English in school??

All too true mate. The other thing is I'm seeing more inflight & charging failures including poorly balanced/unmatched cells of the packet with the cheap packs than the $$$ ones.

I, for one will not risk my 700E's with cheap packs.

The other thing that irks me is people spend $$$ on e-helis yet skimp out on lipos! That is like buying 5% fuel for nitro helis. Lipos are one of the main parts that make e-helis perform well.

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10-23-2009 12:37 PM  8 years agoPost 17
davehour

rrElite Veteran

Guayama, Puerto Rico 00785

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Great writing.

I went from E-flite Lipos (probably considered an "average performer" ) to TP extremes V2 and TP packs, and wao, power difference is huge.

Because I'm new into electrics, I'll appreciate if you can mention what Lipo brands are in the same class, if not better, than the TP's.

Thank you very much.

David

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10-23-2009 01:06 PM  8 years agoPost 18
FlaG8r

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Florida

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OICU812, great post! That being said a few points to add;

-The new 4th gen. TP have yet to be field tested to see if indeed they hold up for 3-4X the cycles of another lipo. Only a small handful of flyers have them from IRCHA, factory pilots,etc.

-I have yet to see anyone post any FACTS that disprove that most lipos are manufactured at the same location. I realize some are made in the US.

-Lipo prices will indeed drop sooner than later for mainstream brands, they simply cannot compete when there packs are double or triple the price. Too much pressure.
I, for one will not risk my 700E's with cheap packs.
Why not? By saying risk, you are assuming they will fail in flight? Haven't heard of this yet.
The other thing that irks me is people spend $$$ on e-helis yet skimp out on lipos! That is like buying 5% fuel for nitro helis. Lipos are one of the main parts that make e-helis perform well.
Unfair comparison. Based on peoples reactions here on RR the difference in zippys and main brands are not at all that large.

Finally, a price comparison;
On a 700E machine you'll most likely be running 12S.

(2) Turnigy 6S 5000mah 30C packs in series - $180.00
(2) Thunder Power 6S 5000mah 30C packs in series- $600.00

OR you could run 10S and for a cool $490, you could run the Outrage 10s1p stick pack for $490.

The above price gap is incredible. If you want to spend 3X the amount of money for a name brand pack that you feel will perform better, go for it. If the name brand packs were only double or 1.5 times the price I would consider it, but to drop $1800 on a few packs is crazy.

Just a few weeks ago I let a factory Esprit Models pilot who flys at our club try out my Turnigys (2 6S 5000 in series) on his Compass Knight 600E flybarless. He flys with a name brand pack. After his flight he was very impressed, said he couldn't really tell any difference.

Life is tough, it's tougher if you're stupid

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10-23-2009 01:13 PM  8 years agoPost 19
T-Rex-Flyer

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Panama City, Fl

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I have not used Zippy's so this comment is not about them. I have use other budget lipo in my 450 only to have been let down in short order. When the price is too good to pass up, go for it, if you can buy three budget batteries for the price of a top shelf brand it may well be worth it.

If the wings are traveling faster than the fuselage, it's probably a helicopter.

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10-23-2009 01:52 PM  8 years agoPost 20
FlaG8r

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Florida

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I have use other budget lipo in my 450 only to have been let down in short order
what brand?

Life is tough, it's tougher if you're stupid

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