RunRyder RC
 6  Topic Subscribe
WATCH
 1 page 3489 views
Helicopter
e-
Electric Battery-Charger-pSupply
› Hyperion charger, not charging to full capacity
09-06-2009 09:45 PM  8 years agoPost 1
MattC

rrNovice

Tamworth, UK

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Hello

I've recently upgraded my charger to a Hyperion eos0610inet charger but it won't charger my lipo to there full capacity.

I fly to between 70 - 80 % discharged using one of my battery monitors and my old robbe ulimate charger and seperate balancer used to put back near enough 1530mah in a 2180 mah lipo, similarly with my brothers bantam charger but the Hyperion is way out.

I flew yesterday flying to 70 ish percent plug it into the charger it read 25% charged all looked good so I started a balanced charge and it put back 1430mah 65% rather than 75%. Had about 5 cycles with this charger and had the same problem each time and my lipos are starting to lose there punch

any ideas, I have the tcs set to 100% but still doesn't charger properly

Battery monitor link
http://www.runryder.com/helicopter/t456473p1/

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
09-07-2009 03:29 AM  8 years agoPost 2
Parsifal

rrVeteran

Singapore

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

I had the same problem with mine, the TCS capacity despite being set to 100%, charges to anywhere between 70% to 90% occasionally.

i noticed that part of the time, it is because the time limit for charging is reached (this default changes depending on the charge rate) and the charger stops charging before max capacity is reached. The default settings are not very reliable from what i have noticed.

Try looking into that to see if it helps.

Pars.

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
09-07-2009 08:58 AM  8 years agoPost 3
MattC

rrNovice

Tamworth, UK

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

I'm charging my lipos at 1C and have the safety timer set to 120 minutes and the charger stops at around 45 minutes. I've also tried charging with the saftey timer switched off with the same results.
I'm setting the timer under the lipo memory, are there any other settings that can throw this charger out that I'm missing ?

I also charged a 2100mah lipo, indicated 28% charged when initially plugging it into the charger around what i was expecting - the charger put back 1100 mah, 52% if it's capacity rather than 72%!!

Not very impressed with this charger, seems like a good way of killing lipo's. Do all the hyperion chargers have the same problem as it looks like a software problem which could be common across the range ?

Cheers

Matt

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
09-07-2009 09:09 AM  8 years agoPost 4
what_the_helli

rrKey Veteran

cookeville, tn USA

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

there may be something wrong with yours, I would send it in and have it looked at. I got the Hyperion DUO when it first came out and now have the DUO III, neither of them have given me an issue like that. 2C is my normal charge rate but I doubt that has anything to do with it.

I put the fun in dysFUNctional :)
Team KBDD & Funding by TnPrintMasters.com

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
09-07-2009 09:16 AM  8 years agoPost 5
what_the_helli

rrKey Veteran

cookeville, tn USA

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

I just re-read your post. I don't ever check the TCS on mine so I guess I really can't say if the TCS works or not. My cells do end up full (4.2v) at the end of the charge though.

I will keep an eye on my TCS now

I put the fun in dysFUNctional :)
Team KBDD & Funding by TnPrintMasters.com

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
09-07-2009 09:23 AM  8 years agoPost 6
TankDirt

rrKey Veteran

Illinois

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

I had the same problem with some cheaper chargers (not hyperion), problem was the supply voltage.

Charging batteries off of my flight box would leave the lipos slightly less than charged (even though the charger said they were fully charged). But when I chrged them at home on the power supply it would fully charge the batteries.

Not sure if your problems related or not, My fix was to start bringing a spare car battery.

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
09-07-2009 09:47 AM  8 years agoPost 7
MattC

rrNovice

Tamworth, UK

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

At home I'm using a laptop power supply 16.5v @ 4.5 Amps and in the field I'm using a leisure battery connected to a split charger so it's always topped up. It doesn't seem to related to the supply as i get the same results of either supply

The initial indication of battery charge before starting the charger seems pretty accurate but it doesn't match up mAh put back into the battery, for instance -

Charger indicated 25% charged after flying.

Battery % consumed : 100% - 25% = 75%
Charger should put back : 75% * 2180mAh = 1635 mAh

The hyperion charger put back 1430 mAh
(1430mAh / 2180mAh) * 100 = 65%

I'll borrow my brothers bantam after work and double check but looks like i need to send this charger back

Cheers

Matt

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
09-07-2009 10:23 AM  8 years agoPost 8
what_the_helli

rrKey Veteran

cookeville, tn USA

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

have you checked the cell voltage when its done?

I put the fun in dysFUNctional :)
Team KBDD & Funding by TnPrintMasters.com

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
09-07-2009 10:35 AM  8 years agoPost 9
what_the_helli

rrKey Veteran

cookeville, tn USA

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

ok, here is what I have found.
The TCS is a rolling estimation. That is as the pack gets closer to full the TCS estimate becomes more and more accurate. So basically the starting point is a guess yet it knows at what voltage its going to stop so its TCS calculation gets better.

I put the fun in dysFUNctional :)
Team KBDD & Funding by TnPrintMasters.com

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
09-07-2009 11:08 AM  8 years agoPost 10
MattC

rrNovice

Tamworth, UK

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

My cell voltage is 4.20 volts on each cell but that is from the chargers display, I need to check this with a meter to make sure it's correct.

So TCS initial estimate may not be correct when the battery is first plugged in.

I have two indentical lipo's charged by the hyperion, I'll fly them both at lunchtime to the same point and charge them both later, one with the hyperion and the other with the bantam and compare the results

EDIT - Just noticed my battery resistance comes up as 0 m ohms

Cheers

Matt

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
09-07-2009 12:32 PM  8 years agoPost 11
stanc

rrKey Veteran

Conroe, TX

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Is it possible you have the charger set for Store Charge instead of Full Charge?

Stan
2- Logo 500
Ion X2
eAvro90

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
09-07-2009 01:07 PM  8 years agoPost 12
rupps5

rrApprentice

columbus ohio

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

I have noticed that my duo 3 will time out if it is charging a junk lipo. That is because the cells are out of balance so the charger lowers the amps near the end to let the low cells catch up. If I charge up a newer lipo that is still in good shape the charger just flys through the charge. I am using a 13.5v 250 watt converted power supply and charge 3 x 6s lipos at 2.5 amps each using the duo 3 and duo 1 (for power supply comparison).

Jeff

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
09-07-2009 10:32 PM  8 years agoPost 13
MattC

rrNovice

Tamworth, UK

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

The charger is doing a full charge and the lipo's are in good condition, 3S1P 2180mah 35C with around 25 cycles.

Ok after being used here are the cell voltages for the two lipo's read using a multimeter not under load or charge

Lipo 1 - 3.79V / 3.79V / 3.79V
Lipo 2 - 3.79V / 3.79V / 3.785V

Lipo 1 was charged using the bantam, it took 51m.41s and put in 1450 mAh, end voltage 12.61V
Lipo 2 was charged using the hyperion, it took 41m.46s and put in 1359 mAh, end voltage 12.597V

Cell voltages after charging using a multimeter
Lipo 1 - 4.18V / 4.18V / 4.18V
Lipo 2 - 4.18V / 4.18V / 4.18V

Seems like both charger have done the job they just disagree on the mAh put back !!

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
09-07-2009 10:54 PM  8 years agoPost 14
blbills

rrKey Veteran

Provo, UT

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

The TCS is a rolling estimation. That is as the pack gets closer to full the TCS estimate becomes more and more accurate.
That is a perfectly accurate statement.
So TCS initial estimate may not be correct when the battery is first plugged in.
From the hundreds of charges that I've put the Hyperion chargers through I've found that if you add about 10% to the initial TCS reading it is about accurate according to how many mah's you put back in.

Brian

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
09-07-2009 10:54 PM  8 years agoPost 15
what_the_helli

rrKey Veteran

cookeville, tn USA

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

looks like all is well and we got to learn that the TCS is a poor guess at battery capacity when its low.

I put the fun in dysFUNctional :)
Team KBDD & Funding by TnPrintMasters.com

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
09-08-2009 12:37 AM  8 years agoPost 16
TJinGuy

rrProfessor

Socorro, NM - USA

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

2 things ...

1) Capacity estimates are just that, estimates. There is no way to accurately determine the capacity of a battery by simply plugging it in. These numbers are for general info only and DO NOT represent anything factual.

2) When balance charging a battery, some mAh is lost in the process of balancing. Each model of charger balances in a slightly different way and thus no 2 mAh totals will be exactly the same. In fact sometimes they can be WAY different, like 20% different. This also changes depending on how fast you charge, the faster, the less mAh.

- Chris

Team New Mexico
TJinTech

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
09-08-2009 08:52 AM  8 years agoPost 17
MattC

rrNovice

Tamworth, UK

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

I thought the other charger was a bantam but it was actually a 'icharger 106b+' but it seems lot a good charger with a lot of functionality.

Seems like both chargers have done the job but I've not convinced the charged mAh meter is that accurate but I'll keep an eye on it over a few cycles

The other thing I've noticed from my old charger a Robbe Ultimate & balancer, the lipo cells used to sit at 4.2 volts after charging rather than dropping to 4.18V but this is a newer charger and maybe this is better for the lipo ?

The hyperion charger seemed to ramp up to full current very quickly compared to the other charger hence the shorter charging time but i wouldn't think this would affect the mAh put back into the battery as mAh is the accumulation of amps over time, as the hyperion got to 1C charging current faster it can put back the same mAh in a shorter time unless the balancer was a little more active on the one charger.

Cheers

Matt

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
09-08-2009 02:51 PM  8 years agoPost 18
TJinGuy

rrProfessor

Socorro, NM - USA

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Many older chargers took a LONG time finishing the charge. The reason they did this was to get as close to 4.2V as they could. See when you place a load on a battery, the voltage changes. So the charger has to back the load way down as close to 0A to get the voltage to 4.2V or once it takes away the load the voltage will drop. Fast forward a few years and people are tired of waiting 30min for the last 100mAh to be put in, so the chargers now stop much earlier and as a result the voltage is usually around 4.18-4.19V per cell. The battery is still very close to full charge, so it is not a bad thing.

Again many factors determine how much mAh the balancer takes out of the packs while you charge (this adds to the total mah put in) including charge rate, balancer discharge capability, how anal the balancer is, how much time at the end of the charge the charger takes to top things off, etc. On top of that each battery will require slightly different balancing because no 2 are the same.

- Chris

Team New Mexico
TJinTech

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
WATCH
 1 page 3489 views
Helicopter
e-
Electric Battery-Charger-pSupply
› Hyperion charger, not charging to full capacity
 Print TOPIC  Make Suggestion 

 6  Topic Subscribe

Friday, December 15 - 10:20 am - Copyright © 2000-2017 RunRyder   EMAILEnable Cookies

Login Here
 New Subscriptions 
 Buddies Online