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HelicopterGasser Model RC HelicoptersOther › Operating temp comparison / cooling statistics:
10-19-2009 06:10 PM  8 years agoPost 161
C.A.P.

rrApprentice

custer park IL.

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CNCjunkie you should not be able to see the effect of heat soak with a eagle tree,the way you are supposed to use it, and you almost need a heat gun to see it and I said almost, I have said over and over Raja temp at 240 degrees and above are not good ' but I'm saying Carey temps at 240 degrees are good !! This is the basic of heat soak. Why will be answered latter.[

[pgkevet It is the reason behind. When an engine builder tell you warn up a cool down your engine, otherwise no one will do it. As I have stated before, if everything else is right with you engine start up and shout down will cause more wear on your engine then anything else.Wally

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10-19-2009 06:21 PM  8 years agoPost 162
rbort

rrProfessor

Franklin, MA - USA

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Temps

Let me just point out that a couple of months ago I found out from Cody that he sets his temp gun to 0.28 emmissivity as you told him to do Wally and that is how you set yours because you think it matches the aluminum better. Well let me tell you also that my temp gun is running like most people's at the standard 0.95 emmisivity setting, and with that is what I record all my temps at.

As an experiment I had Cody go and check the temp of his engine with his guage the night we spoke and with 0.28 setting it read 60 degrees F and with 0.95 his gun showed a temp of 73F which was much closer to the room temperature. That is actually a 22% difference upwards in temps, so when Cody or you say that his engine is actually running at 195F at IRCHA or wherever its really running at 238F at 0.95 setting.

So barring that fact that 0.28 might be more correct than 0.95 for aluminum, (I don't know), the point is what numbers you state you're running at will not be the same and in fact lower than the numbers that I get or other people might get as most people are not changing their emissivity levels.

Like I said before, my engine runs happy and lasts for a very long time, and whatever number my temp guage tells me its something I use as a baseline to compare to.

Your numbers are lower but that is misleading as they are done with a different setting on the temp guns. But that doesn't change the fact that your fan is better than the stock fan and I highly recommend it to anyone who wants it.

For the record I don't "warm up" my engine before takeoff and I don't idle warm it down after landing and I've never seen any ill effects from that. I do auto alot these days which certainly cools the engine to 200 or less by the time its on the ground, but if I don't auto I still don't cooldown anyways.

-=>Raja.

MA 1005 Hanson 280, 4153 flts
Spectra 27 3DMax, 3226 flts
Whiplash V1 Hanson 300, 1485 flts
Whiplash V2 Hanson 300, 248 flts

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10-19-2009 07:59 PM  8 years agoPost 163
CNCjunkie

rrVeteran

Kauai (The Garden Isle), Hawaii - USA

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CNCjunkie you should not be able to see the effect of heat soak with a eagle tree,the way you are supposed to use it, and you almost need a heat gun to see it and I said almost, I have said over and over Raja temp at 240 degrees and above are not good ' but I'm saying Carey temps at 240 degrees are good !! This is the basic of heat soak. Why will be answered latter.[
Hmmm. Well, I'm looking forward to the answer then.

On a separate note: It's been slow going with bad weather and long work hours, but I finally got 1 gal through the 27 and am now on the GV-1 and still keeping rpm to 11000 or below. It's running great and continues to run at 210-215F. I've done nothing to adjust my heat gun (PE-1 preset with a default emissivity setting of 95E) and am just using once in a while just to verify temps have not gone up.

Just another crappy day in Paradise....Aloha!

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10-20-2009 12:57 AM  8 years agoPost 164
xcellgasman101

rrElite Veteran

WOODWARD, OKLA....

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CNCjunkie,,, What is the (Sweet Spot) in RPM's for the 27?? The Hanson Pro Plus that I have been flying is around 12500, to 13500, I would think that 11000 is kinda of low is'nt?? What Head Speed is 11000 on the engine?? Sound like you have it tuned great.. Your temps look perfect.. XGM/VGM

John Crotts
www.soonerhelicamproductions.com

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10-20-2009 01:50 AM  8 years agoPost 165
Justin Stuart (RIP)

rrMaster

Plano, Texas

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I think he's just following Wally's rules for breaking it in. It is supposed to rev to 12,500.

Avant RC
Scorpion Power Systems
Thunder Power RC
Kontronik Drives

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10-20-2009 01:59 AM  8 years agoPost 166
CNCjunkie

rrVeteran

Kauai (The Garden Isle), Hawaii - USA

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Jrock is correct, I'm following Wally's break in instructions.

The head speed is ~1550 and surprisingly enough, it really scoots around at that speed with plenty of reserve power in case I get into trouble.

This is the tough part. I really want to open her up, but I have to hold myself back for now...

Just another crappy day in Paradise....Aloha!

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10-20-2009 02:15 AM  8 years agoPost 167
rbort

rrProfessor

Franklin, MA - USA

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That would explain your cooler temps

I'm putting a motor in too tonight in my 1005, got my stock 231 converted up to a Hanson 3D max ++, so I got a can of lawnboy ashless from HD to get the thing started on the first 2 gallons of gas. I hope to be breaking in it this coming weekend in Delaware if the weather behaves for the last funfly get together for the season up this way.

-=>Raja.

MA 1005 Hanson 280, 4153 flts
Spectra 27 3DMax, 3226 flts
Whiplash V1 Hanson 300, 1485 flts
Whiplash V2 Hanson 300, 248 flts

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10-20-2009 02:43 AM  8 years agoPost 168
CNCjunkie

rrVeteran

Kauai (The Garden Isle), Hawaii - USA

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Break in is a bit#h, but it has to be done.

The G just wants to go go go!

I'm hoping not to see temps go much higher, as the outside temp is generally in the upper 70's to mid 80's here. It usually feels hotter due to the humidity. Time will tell...

Just another crappy day in Paradise....Aloha!

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10-20-2009 04:57 AM  8 years agoPost 169
C.A.P.

rrApprentice

custer park IL.

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no my gun is 95 form factory

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10-20-2009 05:40 AM  8 years agoPost 170
xcellgasman101

rrElite Veteran

WOODWARD, OKLA....

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Jrock is correct, I'm following Wally's break in instructions.
Cool,, that makes sence..
I got a can of lawnboy ashless from HD to get the thing started on the first 2 gallons of gas.
Raja,, How come you are going to run two gallons of break-in oil?? is this something that Al asked you to do also?? I always use just one gallon of Lawn Boy Ashless, at 3 to 4oz. per gallon,, It works great for me,, Just wondering,, XGM/VGM
Break in is a bit#h, but it has to be done.
Isn't that the truth,, But just think how much flying your going to get done, in a short amount of time,,,

Hey Honey!! I'm off to the flying field to break in this new engine, see ya tomorrow!! That's how we roll in Woodward, Oklahoma XGM/VGM

John Crotts
www.soonerhelicamproductions.com

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10-20-2009 05:58 AM  8 years agoPost 171
rbort

rrProfessor

Franklin, MA - USA

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Break-in

Hey John:

Because the lawnboy ashless comes in an 8oz can and once you open it its easiest to mix the whole thing with 2 gallons of gas and use it up. Running the first 2 gallons with lawnboy won't hurt, and then it goes on the Amsoil at about 36 to 40:1 mixture.

I just came up from the basement, the motor is in the 1005 now. I also put in the tail driven gear / white delrin autohub in it so say hello to backwards inverted autos, 1005!

-=>Raja.

MA 1005 Hanson 280, 4153 flts
Spectra 27 3DMax, 3226 flts
Whiplash V1 Hanson 300, 1485 flts
Whiplash V2 Hanson 300, 248 flts

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10-20-2009 06:23 AM  8 years agoPost 172
CNCjunkie

rrVeteran

Kauai (The Garden Isle), Hawaii - USA

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Because the lawnboy ashless comes in an 8oz can and once you open it its easiest to mix the whole thing with 2 gallons of gas and use it up. Running the first 2 gallons with lawnboy won't hurt, and then it goes on the Amsoil at about 36 to 40:1 mixture.
Indeed... I'll be running 3 gals of non-synth mix before switching over. You can't be too careful.

Just another crappy day in Paradise....Aloha!

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10-20-2009 03:22 PM  8 years agoPost 173
xcellgasman101

rrElite Veteran

WOODWARD, OKLA....

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Here is a pic of a Eagle Tree system, chart, and it clearly shows heat soak, after idle, and killing the engine,, I got this out of someones gallery,, it's was on the 231 engine, in a Spectra G heli,, Just thought I would post this,, XGM/VGM
This is just over 7 minutes of flying,,

http://runryder.com/helicopter/gallery/41851/

John Crotts
www.soonerhelicamproductions.com

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10-20-2009 05:39 PM  8 years agoPost 174
AceBird

rrElite Veteran

Utica, NY USA

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Looks to be about 15 sec of temperature rise before it starts going down again. I believe it.

Ace
What could be more fun?

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10-20-2009 05:46 PM  8 years agoPost 175
rbort

rrProfessor

Franklin, MA - USA

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Exactly what I said to Carpman yesterday

If it does rise its only around 15 seconds or so as by the time I get to it as quickly as I do on video its already going down.

I also told him its so short lived its insignificant and nothing to be really concerned about.

-=>Raja.

MA 1005 Hanson 280, 4153 flts
Spectra 27 3DMax, 3226 flts
Whiplash V1 Hanson 300, 1485 flts
Whiplash V2 Hanson 300, 248 flts

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10-20-2009 05:53 PM  8 years agoPost 176
CNCjunkie

rrVeteran

Kauai (The Garden Isle), Hawaii - USA

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Nice! I won't quote myself here...

~17 posts up

Just another crappy day in Paradise....Aloha!

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10-20-2009 06:21 PM  8 years agoPost 177
xcellgasman101

rrElite Veteran

WOODWARD, OKLA....

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Nice! I won't quote myself here...

~17 posts up
Nice one there CNCjunkie
If it does rise its only around 15 seconds or so as by the time I get to it as quickly as I do on video its already going down.
But it DOES HAPPEN!!
I also told him its so short lived its insignificant and nothing to be really concerned about
This I will agree with, Except for not warming up and cooling down, as you have stated,,, I do it ever time, gas or nitro, I sent Al a old and I mean old 231 to be converted to a 260, Had 100's of gallons, yes gallons, about 5 years of flying, and he was very impressed with the condition it was in,, very little wear, and just a tad bluing on the connecting rod,, I think it is a MUST DO PROCESS for all engines,, XGM/VGM

John Crotts
www.soonerhelicamproductions.com

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10-20-2009 07:55 PM  8 years agoPost 178
Justin Stuart (RIP)

rrMaster

Plano, Texas

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Finally we have some good hard data too look at. Thank you xcellgasman101. Your contribution is very helpful and constructive.

Avant RC
Scorpion Power Systems
Thunder Power RC
Kontronik Drives

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10-20-2009 08:32 PM  8 years agoPost 179
GREYEAGLE

rrElite Veteran

Flat Land's

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Whoa !!! John Boy !!! -

That makes me want to start crunching numbers !!! I plan on flying through the winter " It snows here " and for a long time I wanted to play with mean temp's - looking for a sweet operating temp to use as a pre- heat & operating temp ---during the ice age period those graph's just gave me confirmation ! I could care little for the down hill data " I'm a cool down guy" but looky at the rest of the data.

Look's like Iv'e got a bit of work to due for a warm carbi and some type of snow shoes.

greyeagle

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10-20-2009 09:29 PM  8 years agoPost 180
AceBird

rrElite Veteran

Utica, NY USA

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If it does rise its only around 15 seconds
I think the duration would be longer if he didn't come down to 4500 RPM for a while before he actually shut it off.

Look at the sharp rise in temp going from 12500 to 4500 RPM. The fan was cooling the fins at 4500 but the temp still rose. I think we have a myth unbuster here finally showing what was happening before landing and reaching for a gun. Looks like theory holds true on this one.

Ace
What could be more fun?

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