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07-13-2008 12:43 PM  9 years agoPost 1
Rbush

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Just had a quick look at the Pantera on the UK importers site, J Perkins and found the main frames are £35! ($70)

http://www.jperkinsdistribution.co....ain=Helicopters

I see on Ebay US the same frames are $14 (£7), is this right ??

http://cgi.ebay.com/Audacity-Models...Q2em118Q2el1247

If it is, somebodys getting ripped off and it's not you guys in the US

I was going to buy one, but not if these prices are right. Come on Audacity Models, sort this out. How do you expect to sell any in the UK? The kits are £200 in the UK ($400), and in the US they are $250 (£125) !!!!!!!!!

Are you for real

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07-13-2008 05:44 PM  9 years agoPost 2
ProModeler

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Sanford, FL (Orlando area)

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Our UK partner deals with conditions in the UK, which are quite different than those in the USA. Thus, raising these issues publicly, in the USA, is in my opinion, rather counterproductive.


John Beech
AMA # 47381
IRCHA #745

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07-13-2008 05:54 PM  9 years agoPost 3
Rbush

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rather counterproductive
No it's not, it's an over priced heli here in the UK, and I have NOT raised it in the US, I've raised it on a 'World Wide Forum'!!

Sort your prices out and you may sell a few here in the UK. I wonder if the US distributors and J Perkins think the UK heli flyers are stupid??

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07-13-2008 06:23 PM  9 years agoPost 4
ExtremeAerosports

rrApprentice

Fishers, IN

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I hear you guys also pay about $11/gallon for gasoline there too...It ain't the producers fault, it is the Government's.

We pay $1.25 (.63£) for a 20 oz (591 mL) bottle of Mountian Dew...What do you pay?

Just cruious...

Jonathan Ott
Fishers, IN
TRex 700E DFC
Chaos 600
Lynx Heli Innovations Team Pilot

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07-13-2008 06:45 PM  9 years agoPost 5
Rbush

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I don't drink Mountain Due so I have no idea?

OK, I'm wrong, it's a bargain here in the UK, I'll be standing outside my local MS first thing Monday. I think I may just buy 3 because its such good value.

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07-13-2008 07:08 PM  9 years agoPost 6
Eury

rrProfessor

Dover NH

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The point that was being made is that Audacity doesn't control the prices in the UK. J Perkins gets the helis, then prices them however they want. So, complaining to Audacity does you no good, complain to the people who are setting the price.

Nick Crego

Citizen #0168

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07-13-2008 07:27 PM  9 years agoPost 7
Rbush

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If I were a manufacture of products and my distributors were over pricing my products to the point of harming sales, I would WANT to address the situation. At the end of the day, sales are being lost in the UK because of this MASSIVE over pricing issue!

I was all up for buying a Pantera, but I'm not touching it with a 10 foot pole now, so that's one sale down. Is this really a situation Audacity want to be in? I doubt it.

Raptor side frames £20 pr
Sceadu side frames £22 pr
Pantera side frames £35 pr

At the end of the day, I'm just a customer wanting to buy a model. I look at stuff and weigh up the situation, I make my decision and buy. I'll not be buying a Pantera because of the price of parts.

I rest my case!

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07-13-2008 07:53 PM  9 years agoPost 8
Fixit

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UK

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You could also complain about the food you eat and the clothes you buy and so on.
It’s just the rip off country we live in, just do what most others do and buy from the US or China and give the bad UK economy a helping hand

The slogan that says Buy British is a load of rubbish, when you do all the retailers and wholesalers do is buy a bigger yahct and home and take more holidays instead of reducing prises.

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07-13-2008 07:59 PM  9 years agoPost 9
Eury

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Dover NH

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Move to a different country. The UK gets screwed on prices, it's that simple. You act like everything else for sale in the UK is low priced, it isn't.

Nick Crego

Citizen #0168

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07-13-2008 08:34 PM  9 years agoPost 10
ProModeler

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Sanford, FL (Orlando area)

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Rbush,

Not touch a Pantera with a 10 foot pole? That's entirely your business and while I'm sorry you have taken this position, which in my opinion is akin to cutting off your nose to spite your face, allow me to present some facts in an attempt to educate you about your very own Kingdom.

First off, to compare prices of main frames displays an elementary lack of research on your part. No offense, but main frames for the Pantera hardly ever break, whilst for the Sceadu you'll break the radio tray if you look at them funny. Similarly, Raptor frames will typically be equipped with an optional carbon fiber base plate because the forward mounting point of the main landing gear display a proclivity to fracture (rather easily in fact). And since you've conveniently left out one of the more popular 50-class helis in the market, the TRex600, a set of those 3-piece carbon frames can shatter in a crash and cost quite a bit more than 100 bucks to replace!
Click this to see what dealers and customers have to say for basic survivability of a Pantera.

Irregardless, you are asking me to comment on the business practices of a distributor thouands of miles away from us, which brings me to my second point. I really don't know what you expect me to do about pricing in the UK. Simply put, in the UK there are completely different economic conditions versus those encountered in the USA. At its most basic level, for example, the Crown subjects citizens to a VAT of 17.5% (I believe), which we don't subject our citizens to (here in the USA). Then there are other duties, etc.

Furthermore, we operate quite a lean ship (businesswise with respect to overhead) and thus, to compare Genesis Hobby Distributor to J. Perkins is not just ludicrous but probably unfair to that long established UK distributor. Why? Because they have been in business quite a bit longer - and are probably smarter than us to boot! Add to that, perhaps the margins J. Perkins allow stockists in the UK is different as well, etc. Have you considered these basic issues?

Frankly, and I mean no offense, but since you live in the UK, it's distressing to see you displaying a rather appalling ignorance of the basic economic conditions of life in the Kingdom (on a world wide forum no less). Further to this, while you may be embarrassed by this presentation of elementary facts, I hasten to remind you of this . . . you "chose" to call me out in public! You could, quite frankly, have availed yourself of RunRyder's excellent PM facility to ask me these questions in private. Instead you elected to make a public display of yourself. Finally, not to put too fine a point on it, how else would you have me explain this rather obvious situation once you've raised it in public where I now must respond? Hence, you have only yourself to blame.

Finally - my advice. Instead of storming off in a huff about how you wouldn't touch a Pantera with a 10-foot pole, or arrogantly deriding the business practices of an established, well regarded, and quite venerable UK hobby distributor, perhaps you should gather your facts and approach J.Perkins to present your information. Also, for what it's worth, I'd advise you to mind your tone with them as well because Mr. Perkins and Son don't easily suffer fools either!

Regards,


John Beech
AMA # 47381
IRCHA #745

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07-13-2008 10:18 PM  9 years agoPost 11
Rbush

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Well that's that then.

Thank you for your charactor assassination Mr Beech(if that's who you are?)and some quite large assumptions about me, your quite the diplomat.

Have a nice day

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07-13-2008 10:44 PM  9 years agoPost 12
Moss

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GB

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Move to a different country. The UK gets screwed on prices, it's that simple. You act like everything else for sale in the UK is low priced, it isn't.
Nah, we get paid loads more than everyone else so why move, we also have free health care and education plus a pretty good standard of living, in order to pay for these benefits we pay more in the way of tax and duty though.

Its pretty short sighted to look at what someone else gets and jump up and down without really looking into all the reasons.

.... having said that, them frames have a ridiculous price difference.

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07-13-2008 11:22 PM  9 years agoPost 13
Eury

rrProfessor

Dover NH

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I'm very much aware, I lived in the UK for 4 years. Great country, I'd love to go back.

Nick Crego

Citizen #0168

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07-14-2008 01:42 AM  9 years agoPost 14
ProModeler

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Sanford, FL (Orlando area)

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Rbush,

I understand being angry with me, but how about some understanding? In your first post you say, "Are you for real "

In your second post you say, ". . . it's an over priced heli . . . I wonder if the US distributors and J Perkins think the UK heli flyers are stupid??"

In your third post you respond in a sarcastic manner to a customer of ours who is just trying to explain why there are price differences. He didn't deserve your disrespect.

In your fourth post you say, "I'm not touching it (Pantera) with a 10 foot pole now . . . I'll not be buying a Pantera because of the price of parts."

So now you're upset with me to boot for not being diplomatic? Let's review how things look from this side because if you walked in my shoes for a day, or two, I rather suspect you wouldn't be so quick to criticize.

In the first place we have no control over J. Perkins. Second, you wonder in writing if we're "for real". Third, you presume we believe UK customers are stupid. Fourth, you feel quite free to be sarcastic with our customers, i.e. folks who are taking of their time to try and show you why your comparison isn't fair, and fifth, you cap it off with saying you'll not only not touch a Pantera with a 10 foot pole but you won't buy because parts are overpriced. And all this "before" I ever can respond "and" you do this in a public forum (instead of via PM where you can, quite frankly, nearly get away with murder when talking to me.)

Did you seriously think I'd take this laying down? The fact is your analysis is somewhat superficial because you are not comparing apples to apples when you compare the price of frames. In addition, precisely because you live in the UK, I would really expect you to realize that VAT, differences in import duties, overhead, etc. are quite different for a UK distributor vs. us and this is reason enough for the disparity in pricing. Hence, in our viewpoint, you're not lilly white in action and to cry foul is not fair. Why not? Because you took us to the woodshed in public and instead we could have had this discourse in private! I.e. you initiated this.

If I may ask, why did you feel compelled to question us and our business practices in public? Furthermore, what did you hope to gain by approaching me this way? This is what I meant when I wrote you were being counterproductive. Surely you don't treat each other in the UK this way, do you? Anyway, over here we don't jump on folks in public and expect the other party to take it laying down.

Finally, you mention character assassination. In reviewing my words I realize I should have put my response away for a few hours as I responded in the heat of the moment, which is never wise. Consequently, I have edited my post in an attempt to be more diplomatic . . . and I apologize.


John Beech
AMA # 47381
IRCHA #745

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07-14-2008 01:54 AM  9 years agoPost 15
ProModeler

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Sanford, FL (Orlando area)

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Moss,

You are quite correct in realizing health care, a high standard of living, and other factors influence pricing differences between the UK and the USA.

Finally, with respect to J. Perkins decisions on pricing, I really cannot comment because that is their bailiwick.

Kindest regards,


John Beech
AMA # 47381
IRCHA #745

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07-14-2008 03:18 AM  9 years agoPost 16
MartyH

rrProfessor

USA

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The mainframe set from audacitymodels.com is $29.99 plus shipping. The $13.99 frameset on eBay is NOT being sold by Audacity Models. I dont know how you can hold them responsible for someone selling something on eBay. Besides, the $13.99 is a Buy It Now price. Why havent you already bought this? Your problem would be solved.

If it will help you any, see what the cost would be to buy a framset from the U.S. and have it shipped to you. If John won't sell you the piece, I'll buy it for you and ship it. I agree $70 US is ridiculous for a frameset. But, I also dont know why you havent already bought the one on eBay? Its cheaper than the U.K or U.S distributors.

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07-14-2008 08:28 AM  9 years agoPost 17
Rbush

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It looks like I'm in a minority on this pricing issue, so I'll shut up and wish you all the luck with the Audacity range of models.

Rob

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07-14-2008 08:32 AM  9 years agoPost 18
SniperKitten

rrNovice

Wiltshire, UK

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Not all Brits agree with all the sentiments posted above.

There are a whole host of reasons why things cost so much more in the UK than in the USA.

Not least is volume.

I just bought some stuff from USA on-line retailers and got very good deals on items that sell in bulk in the USA. Try, for example, examining the price of popular servos like Futaba S9252 and the new BLS 451. They sell well in the USA and the prices reflect it. Less common items are much closer to UK prices.

Another issue is taxation.

Yes we have free health care. Except that it is not free - we have to pay enormous amounts of a host of different taxes to pay for it. The USA has a healthcare system that can, for example, deliver much higher rates of survival for cancer patients than can the UK National Health Service. This, in my opinion, is because the NHS is grossly inefficient in the way it spends our money because it is interfered with at all levels by politicians who are determined to micromanage everything - right down to light bulbs and loo paper.

Another is the economy.

The UK economy is sliding down the walls into an enormous toilet. House prices, interests rates, oil prices, reduncies and companies folding all show how bad our economy is. Of course, it is nothing to do with G Broon Esq. who has been at the helm of our glittering financial system for 10 years until becoming the biggest disaster as a PM in living history (and beyond).

On a more prosaic level, look at the number of people who are selling up equipment (try BMFA classifieds) to get out of their hobby. Times are hard guys and they are going to get a lot worse.

I am saving cash to buy a Pantera from J Perkins and I plan to put my OS 61 WC into it, using a BBC from Mr Beech. I think it is a darned good helicopter for the price. I do not plan on crashing any of my model helicopters (it's part of that good old fashioned British reserve ladies and gentlemen ). So, I don't give a monkey's how much new frame sets cost.

Finally, I would ask our American cousins, who have recently celebrated the brightest decision their nation ever took, not to be dismayed by what might seem anti-American sentiments. The plain fact is that King George 111 was frighfully upset about the whole affair and some people still are!

I never met an American I did not like - but then most of them were Marines! Some of them still are but even more gave themselves up for their country.

SniperKitten dons 'battle bowler' and prepares to receive incoming fire!

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07-14-2008 09:48 AM  9 years agoPost 19
Rbush

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not to be dismayed by what might seem anti-American sentiments.
I hope your not suggesting I'm anti-American!

A new day, a new start

I'm not a world economics expert.

I have had a much closer look at the prices of the spares on the Perkins list, and I think I got a bit carried away with just one or two bits that 'seemed' expensive? I do think the frames and one or two other bits are a little high, but all the rest of the parts (the vast majority) look to be about what you would expect to pay.

So, here it is

I'm SORRY, I WAS WRONG !

I will give a lot of consideration to buying this model if something else I'm looking at does not come off.

What more can I say.

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07-14-2008 11:31 AM  9 years agoPost 20
MartyH

rrProfessor

USA

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RBush if you join the Pantera owners and pilots we will be here to help you with any questions along the way. WE cannot effect the pricing in the UK. If it doesnt work for you, vote with your wallet and buy something else.

We would all do well to let this thread die from here forward. There is nothing to be gained by commenting further.

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