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T-REX 450 › T-REX battery or motor prob? help.....(please)
07-13-2008 03:43 AM  9 years agoPost 1
929freak

rrNovice

Newtown Pa

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I have a rex all stock except for a couple aluminum upgrades.Here is my problem,after a about 1.5-2 minutes of flight time( I am a beginner so no 3d) I seem to lose power,and it seems like the tail won't hold.example,I fly a minute or two then put it down,when I go to lift off again it feels like it is gutless and sometimes it will spin on me like the tail lost its holding power.O.k. now for the weird part,it happens with all three of my batteries,as far as I know they have never been over discharged and they are balanced.so can anyone shed some light on this one?

p.s. no drag on geartrain
batteries not warm or puffed
motor around 140-165 degrees after flight
any other info needed to help just ask.

thanks in advance for the help

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07-13-2008 04:25 AM  9 years agoPost 2
baby uh1

rrVeteran

St. James, Mo.

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Might be your esc. It sounds like your losing a phase to the motor as your losing power and the motor is getting hot. Check the wiring between the motor and the esc also.
I had a problem with a heli, just like you describe and it was a bad esc.
Hope you just have a bad wire.

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07-13-2008 05:01 AM  9 years agoPost 3
929freak

rrNovice

Newtown Pa

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is losing tail control a sign of low voltage(assuming everything is setup correctly)I mean at first it holds fine,during hovering,hard climbouts etc...

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07-13-2008 02:10 PM  9 years agoPost 4
baby uh1

rrVeteran

St. James, Mo.

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It could be because the tail is driven by the main it could slow to the point of being inefective. Meanwhile the mains, since they have a large pitch range can still generate enough lift to take off.
I don't know if you have a spare esc or motor but swapping them out might be the only way to find out for sure.

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07-14-2008 03:45 PM  9 years agoPost 5
Skarn

rrVeteran

Pasadena, MD

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This happened to me as well. Then I saw on the ground the tail belt would occassionally ride to the left and bind in the tail casing. After many veteran flyers told me to remove my idler pulley, I did so and the probem went away. That was 7 months ago.

Skarn

It's better to burn out than to fade away...

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07-14-2008 04:04 PM  9 years agoPost 6
929freak

rrNovice

Newtown Pa

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Skarn can you be a little more specific?? I don't have the heli here
but want to check out what your saying when I get home. thanks!

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07-14-2008 04:39 PM  9 years agoPost 7
nmrs

rrApprentice

Austin, TX

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Skarn is talking about the bearing I have circled in yellow. Just remove it and see if it helps. If you do a search on "snubber pulley" or "idler pulley" you should find quite a few threads discussing the merits of this mod.

450 se v2

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07-14-2008 04:59 PM  9 years agoPost 8
SSN Pru

rrElite Veteran

Taxachusetts

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s losing tail control a sign of low voltage(assuming everything is setup correctly)I mean at first it holds fine,during hovering,hard climbouts etc...
that is because as you loose power and increase pitch to lift off, you also increase torque dramatically. Combine a HUGE torque increase with a low headspeed and a corresponding low tail rotor speed and you have a situation that is hopeless in terms of your tail holding!

And

It's not an IDLER PULLEY. It is a SNUBBER PULLEY.

It's purpose is to increase the wrap of the belt around the tail rotor pulley and thus increase it's ability to transfer power. In this application, it only F's up the whole system.

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07-16-2008 05:08 AM  9 years agoPost 9
929freak

rrNovice

Newtown Pa

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pssst Skarn,don't call it an idler pulley again..! I think he means business!! ha ha just joking umdpru... but seriously thanks for all the help soo far,I will keep updating my progress to possibly be-able to help someone else

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07-16-2008 05:13 AM  9 years agoPost 10
702nitro

rrKey Veteran

Las Vegas, NV

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Another benefit to removing the pulley is it reduces overall drag in the belt system.

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07-16-2008 01:12 PM  9 years agoPost 11
SSN Pru

rrElite Veteran

Taxachusetts

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SNUBBER DAMMIT!!!!!!

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07-16-2008 03:24 PM  9 years agoPost 12
Skarn

rrVeteran

Pasadena, MD

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SNUBBER DAMMIT!!!!!!
Hmmm this could be fun

Dictionary definition of idler pulley: a guide or tightening pulley for a belt or chain

Pictures of idler pulleys:
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2237...40c3c2d.jpg?v=0
http://www.daffysworld.info/pics/idler_pulley.jpg
http://www.kenlowe.com.au/_borders/Superc50.jpg
http://z.about.com/d/autorepair/1/0/R/F/91350183.gif

Oh and this one from viacopter.com where they recommend removing the IDLER PULLEY!!!!! http://vicacopter.com/idler_pulley01.jpg

But hey, if umdpru feels the need to call it something else....like snubber pulley.....go for it!

Skarn

It's better to burn out than to fade away...

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07-16-2008 04:33 PM  9 years agoPost 13
dashpilot

rrApprentice

Abu Dhabi, UAE

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make sure the belt is no TOO tight.. also...make sure nothing is binding in the head.. you should be able to move the head freely...

food for thought..

"what comes up must come down"....softly of course

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07-16-2008 05:52 PM  9 years agoPost 14
SSN Pru

rrElite Veteran

Taxachusetts

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An idler pulley is generally used to ensure that the proper tension is applied to a belt by actively pressing against the belt using a torsion spring, as in the case of a serpentine belt, or to change the direction of a belt as is also the case in serpentine belt usage in vehicles.

A snubber pulley is generally used to increase the contact arc of belts around drive pulleys to enhance the power transmission capabilities of belts.

In the context of helicopter tail rotor drive systems, the pulley we are discussing is not an idler pulley as it really doesn't maintain tension on the belt or change it's direction. It does, however, slightly increase the contact arc of the pulley on the tail rotor drive pulley. In most instances, it only serves to aggrevate the tracking of the belt on the t/r drive pulley. I've removed mine because the rotational axis of the pulley was not perfectly perpendicular which cause the belt to ride to one side of the t/r drive pulley.

If you are going to include some sources, at least include reputable ones.

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07-16-2008 05:54 PM  9 years agoPost 15
TRex888

rrVeteran

Monmouth, UK

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Sounds like BEC overloading. Servos drawing too much current will cause this without puffing your battery.

How may turns on the main blades can you get when you swing it by hand? Atleast 5 to 10 for a free running system. Mast collar too tight is a good place to check if you get less than 5.

Also pop the links off the swash and move the swash up and down by hand. The washout hub can get sticky from dirt, oil and even dust from worn ball links! Caused me two crashes this before I figured it out. Happened to a buddy also.

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07-16-2008 05:56 PM  9 years agoPost 16
SSN Pru

rrElite Veteran

Taxachusetts

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How may turns on the main blades can you get when you swing it by hand? Atleast 5 to 10 for a free running system.
That's a good point too.

I usually judge my rotor freewheel by spinning the boid up in Idleup1 which is close to 2900 rpm and then hitting throttle hold. My longest spool down time was about 22 seconds. When the drive system was less than optimal, I could see spool down times closer to or even under 15 seconds.

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07-16-2008 07:52 PM  9 years agoPost 17
Skarn

rrVeteran

Pasadena, MD

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If you are going to include some sources, at least include reputable ones
LOL, what isn't reputable about a dictionary or the sites I posted?

And honestly I was must messing with you bro, that's why I said this could be fun! I could care less, I'm only going by what the many veterans that I learned from call it.

Ok how about a compromise/hybrid:
- Snubildler pulley
- Snidler pulley
- Idlenubber pulley

Or my favorite so far: Snubbler pulley

Skarn

It's better to burn out than to fade away...

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07-16-2008 08:11 PM  9 years agoPost 18
SSN Pru

rrElite Veteran

Taxachusetts

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skarn,

sorry, i get worked up when i have too much coffee.

I like snidler pulley.

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07-16-2008 08:17 PM  9 years agoPost 19
Skarn

rrVeteran

Pasadena, MD

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sorry, i get worked up when i have too much coffee
LOL! That's my line! Ok honestly, how many cups have you had so far today? I'm at 3 and a diet soda...

Skarn

It's better to burn out than to fade away...

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07-17-2008 02:30 AM  9 years agoPost 20
baby uh1

rrVeteran

St. James, Mo.

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OK I've been following this discussion and it looks to me that if I remove the snubbler pulley thing on my bird then the beltler will rubbler on the top of the inside of my boommler.

That can"t be good!

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T-REX 450 › T-REX battery or motor prob? help.....(please)
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