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T-REX 450 › Belt Ripping
07-09-2008 05:17 AM  9 years agoPost 41
Waco

rrApprentice

Bernalillo, New Mexico USA

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What 450 torque tube??? Lets talk about that for a while cuz I am get sick of the ripping belt piss off.

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07-09-2008 02:00 PM  9 years agoPost 42
Skarn

rrVeteran

Pasadena, MD

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If you listen to the many veterans that have been through this and remove the pulley.....your belt issues will go away.........

It's better to burn out....than to fade away........

I'd be willing to bet that when the V3 comes out, the idler pulley will be either completely redesigned or gone.

Skarn

It's better to burn out than to fade away...

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07-09-2008 03:43 PM  9 years agoPost 43
KarbonBird

rrKey Veteran

Australia

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Karbon Bird

I have two of the upgraded{flanged}that I will sell you
Thanks Jerry but I have already ordered so won't need any more.

KB

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07-26-2008 11:30 PM  9 years agoPost 44
Heli-on

rrVeteran

Southern Cali, CA - USA

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How did you make it out with the MX400 pulley? I run these in both my 450's and haven't had any belt issues at all.

One of my belts has at least 200 flights and looks great. This is my scale setup, which I think is important to note. Never any real hard throttle pumping going on there or I think the teeth would be showing more signs of wear.

-Gregg B.

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07-27-2008 11:38 AM  9 years agoPost 45
Bretuk

rrNovice

S.Wales UK

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REMOVE IT, no need for it.

TREX 450 SE V2, TREX150,DX7, Phoenix

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07-27-2008 03:23 PM  9 years agoPost 46
Jerry K

rrKey Veteran

Houston Area

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Oh my-o-my they must have put it on there for a reason!!! ha-ha-ha

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07-27-2008 04:37 PM  9 years agoPost 47
wwrty

rrNovice

UK

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They put it on 450 to copy the raptor. All our clubs members removed it. No problems what so ever and they have not taken the advice from one guy on here who swears by them

Thunder Tiger MD530, Trex700

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07-27-2008 04:38 PM  9 years agoPost 48
rexxigpilot

rrProfessor

Florida

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Here's an analogy.

Someone gets too fat for their clothes. Bottons keep popping, zippers break. Solution, remove clothes.

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07-27-2008 06:30 PM  9 years agoPost 49
Mavrik1

rrApprentice

USA

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There is a 90° twist in the belt so there is a slight lift on one side (right). The idler pulley sets the belt square on the drive pulley. The reason removing the idler pulley "works", the pulley can 'walk' back to the other side. This doesn't solve the alignment issue that makes it 'walk' to the left in the first place. Removing the idler pulley also decreases drive pulley contact. One has to remember, when this belt is moving under loads it's not staying nice and flush like when you look at it static.

As for increased flight time removing the idler pulley, changing the idler pulley bearing would possibly increase the flight time as well. I would imagine few people lube this bearing.

Personally, I have the idler pulley on and have never had a problem with side fraying on the belt, aprox 100 flights. I did recently (after aprox 100 flights) rip most of the belt teeth off. But I fly mostly 3D and in mid teens winds.

The bottom line is having fun.

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07-27-2008 07:20 PM  9 years agoPost 50
twitch

rrKey Veteran

Las Vegas

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I had a problem with ripping belts on a new V2. What I found is the boom is very tight in the tail case and wouldnt fit all the way in. So in flight the belt would loosen just enough to catch the side of the tail gear and shread it. After fixing this no more problems. I still run the idler pully with no problems.

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11-30-2008 03:55 AM  8 years agoPost 51
StanH

rrNovice

Minden Louisiana

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I've been reading every ones posts and I'm sure that the idler has a purpose. And I can see that one idler changes the center line of the belt going thru the boom. There for to fix this problem it probably should have one more idler on the opposite side to put the belt back on center or just remove the one that is there. If taking the idler off fixes the problem, great.Even if its an easy fix. I'm going to try it and if it don't work I'll put it back on. I was told by an employee at one of our favorite parts distributors to tweak the boom.I wont do that again.

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11-30-2008 07:46 PM  8 years agoPost 52
rexxigpilot

rrProfessor

Florida

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Stan,

I think what the employee meant by telling you to tweak the boom was to align the boom, and you should. There is no need to remove the idler/snubber pulley on a T-rex. It is there for a reason. The belt breaking issue on the T-rex is due to the belt tension being too tight - nothing more and nothing less than that.

The manual recommends that you tighten the belt to where if you press on the belt with light pressure it is 3/4 the way to the opposite edge of the tail drive pulley (actually the manual states, "main gear". This will cause the belt to fail often!

When I built my first T-rex 450XL in 2005, I went by the manual recommended belt tension. I was breaking the belt every 10-20 flights. After loosening up the tension to where I can just touch the other side of the belt with very light pressure, I have not broken a belt in over 2 years and 100's of flights.

If you remove the idler/snubber pulley, you will not get adequate contact with the tail drive pulley using the loose, and I might add more efficient, belt tension. That is the main purpose of the pulley. Proper alignment is the other purpose.

Removing the pulley can cause too much load on the few belt teeth that do make contact with the pulley and consequently cause the belt teeth to strip easily.

I'm sure you will have many on this forum who have removed the pulley without any obvious problem and will disagee with me. But, I doubt any of them are engineers who understand machine design.

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11-30-2008 08:06 PM  8 years agoPost 53
StanH

rrNovice

Minden Louisiana

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Thanks I will look into that. The person did say bend it a little.

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12-01-2008 12:11 AM  8 years agoPost 54
gary jp4

rrApprentice

Nashville, TN, USA

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You don't need it. Take it off.

Belts break for some folks with the idler pulley on when they are tight and also when they are very loose. The belt can ride up the flange of the pulley and stretch, hit the tail gearbox housing, frey, and snap.

T-Rex 450 SE V1, 430L 13t, Align 35A ESC, 325 Pro, K&B, JR 6102DX6, GY401, 9650, HS-65MG'S.

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12-01-2008 12:12 AM  8 years agoPost 55
gary jp4

rrApprentice

Nashville, TN, USA

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With the idler pulley off and lubricating the belt with silicone the belt doesn't ride up the pulley and cause all those problems.

T-Rex 450 SE V1, 430L 13t, Align 35A ESC, 325 Pro, K&B, JR 6102DX6, GY401, 9650, HS-65MG'S.

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12-01-2008 12:12 AM  8 years agoPost 56
gary jp4

rrApprentice

Nashville, TN, USA

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Without the idler pulley on and with lubrication I can run the belt tight or loose with no fraying, breaking, or slipping. I prefer to run it loose.

Have you read the reports of those that have taken it off. The list is long and distinguished.

T-Rex 450 SE V1, 430L 13t, Align 35A ESC, 325 Pro, K&B, JR 6102DX6, GY401, 9650, HS-65MG'S.

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12-01-2008 12:16 AM  8 years agoPost 57
gary jp4

rrApprentice

Nashville, TN, USA

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If you remove the idler/snubber pulley, you will not get adequate contact with the tail drive pulley using the loose, and I might add more efficient, belt tension. That is the main purpose of the pulley. Proper alignment is the other purpose.
That is not true. With the snubber off, the belt loose, and even with lubrication on the belt it doesn't slip. Even with insane piro rates and sudden reversals.

T-Rex 450 SE V1, 430L 13t, Align 35A ESC, 325 Pro, K&B, JR 6102DX6, GY401, 9650, HS-65MG'S.

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12-01-2008 12:22 AM  8 years agoPost 58
gary jp4

rrApprentice

Nashville, TN, USA

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I'm sure you will have many on this forum who have removed the pulley without any obvious problem and will disagee with me.
I have and I do.
But, I doubt any of them are engineers who understand machine design.
Understanding why something is in a design or how it works doesn't make it necessary or even desirable.

If engineers were always right the first time there would be no need for designs to evolve. Also, bridges wouldn't colapse.

T-Rex 450 SE V1, 430L 13t, Align 35A ESC, 325 Pro, K&B, JR 6102DX6, GY401, 9650, HS-65MG'S.

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12-01-2008 12:23 AM  8 years agoPost 59
Heli 770

rrProfessor

USA.

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I don't use the idler on my 450s and my Quick UK tail cases don't have one on it at all on my Raptors.

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12-01-2008 02:30 PM  8 years agoPost 60
Skarn

rrVeteran

Pasadena, MD

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rexxingpilot,

No, there is no valid reason for the idler on the trex 450. Apparently, even Align reps have told people to remove them. It has been proven to NOT cause any problems by removing it....not one. But it has been a known issue for very many to keep it on.

Check out the sticky over at helifreak in the 450 section for more details.

Those of us that took the advice of the many vets that told us to remove it, run our belts very loose and have never had a problem.

Oh and I am an engineer

Skarn

It's better to burn out than to fade away...

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