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HelicopterMain Discussion › Port/Starboard vs Left/Right
12-02-2007 06:06 PM  9 years agoPost 1
Frank Bostwick

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Cincinnati Ohio

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Am I the only one who finds thinking in terms of Port and Starboard instead of left and Right, really helps keep track of orientation? Because I find it makes all the differance for me.

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12-02-2007 06:12 PM  9 years agoPost 2
chuckhager

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Clovis, CA

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For me, terminology doesn't mean a thing. It's all about building muscle memory to react to a certain event or movement in a given orientation. But maybe that's just me.

Are you saying that you actually "think" port & starboard as you fly?

Chuck Hager

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12-02-2007 06:21 PM  9 years agoPost 3
legoman67

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Nanoose Bay B.C, Canada

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heh, i always go between the 2... i work at a marina as a part time job on the weekends...

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12-02-2007 06:24 PM  9 years agoPost 4
Zaneman007

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Texas - USA

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I am with you on the port and starboard, but then I was in the Navy for six years.

Old Guys Rule!

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12-02-2007 06:40 PM  9 years agoPost 5
Frank Bostwick

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Cincinnati Ohio

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Ive been around boats my whole life so I guess its just 2nd nature but I never really found it useful till I started RCin'. For me it creates a disconect from my Left and right hands. Right and left hands always stay the same and its hard to overcome that. In the very least it requires more brain processing to translate the correct movement. Port and Starboard also Always stays the same. So when I need to move the ship to Port, no matter what orientation, it needs to be moved to the port. Where as, nose in hovering for instance, when the ship looks like I need to raise the right tips, I really need to raise the left tips. Not so when thinking in terms of port and starboard. Works for me anyway.

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12-02-2007 06:46 PM  9 years agoPost 6
chuckhager

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Clovis, CA

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I'm very supprised that so many of you actually "think" left/right or port/starboard when flying. I must be one of the few, (or maybe the only one), who learned to fly by action/reaction.

Chuck Hager

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12-02-2007 06:56 PM  9 years agoPost 7
Zaneman007

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Texas - USA

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When I fly, I always think about where the starboard side of the heli is. Thus moving the stick to the right will cause it to go starboard, regardless. I do admit that the more I fly, the more I simply react, but when I'm in a jam, a trick gone bad... I'm back to where is the starboard side. And I then know what stick movements will make it go where.

And for the elevator, I keep my eye on the bottom of the nose. When I push the stick forward the nose goes toward the tail.

Thus, I don't find myself learning orientations as much as learning which way the stick movement will move the heli, regardles of orientation.

Not that I have it all down, but that my story and I'm sticking to it.

Did that make any sense at all?

Old Guys Rule!

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12-02-2007 06:59 PM  9 years agoPost 8
legoman67

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Nanoose Bay B.C, Canada

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i dont think if it when flying, it when just everyday talking i do, i also seem to call the hoods of cars teh bow too...

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12-02-2007 07:02 PM  9 years agoPost 9
Frank Bostwick

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Cincinnati Ohio

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Im not good enough yet so Im guessing, right/left,Port/starbord thinking must go away AFTER mussle memory is learned. Im just saying that thinking Port/starboard may get me there faster or less expensively. Im sure you cant get too good if you cant get to a point that orientation becomes natural or something you dont have to "Think" about.

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12-02-2007 07:04 PM  9 years agoPost 10
trilerian

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Niles, MI USA

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When I was learning the basics I thought port and starboard, because it was a constant. However once I started flying inverted that went out the window and I no longer think anything, I just move the sticks. instincts will always react faster than thinking about it. I still think while flying, but instead of thinking about what I am doing currently I think about what I am going to do next.

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12-02-2007 07:13 PM  9 years agoPost 11
chuckhager

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Clovis, CA

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OK. I understand now.

But thinking back to when I started flying, I don't recall if I ever thought of it that way. I can only recall thinking action/reaction.

But anything that will help you in learning orientation is a good thing. Wether it be action/reaction, left/right, port/starboard or thisside/thatside. But the only way my brain can fly these things is via action/reaction.

Chuck Hager

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12-02-2007 07:42 PM  9 years agoPost 12
dialarotor

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Traverse City, Michigan

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Retired Master mariner with 34 years at sea, I think port and stbd until I get in an airplane and it is still left and right. I guess that is from talking to ATC with base, downwind and getting the correct runway, Left, Right, Center. It's funny, how the mind makes the shift from water to ground/air without thinking about it.

RapRexSynLog Pilot

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12-02-2007 07:43 PM  9 years agoPost 13
SuperSixTwo

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Virginia City, NV ---USA

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I tried painting a canopy red/green. Red was great but the green i choose (hunter green) kinda disappeared in a light cloud cover. I put a red dot on the tx so when nose in it was easier to "think" which was which.

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12-02-2007 08:12 PM  9 years agoPost 14
BC Don

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Calgary, AB Canada

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Yup, if you have to "translate" into english (or whatever) before doing a movement you better be flying high to wait. What I mean by this is if you have to "oh look the helicopter is drifting towards its left, that means I have to give a right stick input" and then give the stick input you've taken too long. You should be able to react without thinking about it.

This analogy is really the same as learning a second language. If you have to constantly "think" in your primary language and convert from and to it, you are very slow in the secondary language and not fluent.

Same is true of the Heli (or plank). It moves one way and you react automatically. Now the interesting part gets to be when you do that and the Heli moves the wrong way because your orientation is screwed up (such as it is a ways away and you think it is tail in but it really is nose in). Are your reactions fast enough to recover the heli into level flight?

An example of this I had was with one of my planks where I had the airlerons reversed. Took off, the plane started to role to the left so I gave right stick, rolled more to the left (and started to dive), I kept giving it more "right" (which was actually left) till it augered in. Happened pretty darn fast. I think the only way to get to a position where you can compensate for this is to fly it reversed deliberately a few times.

The other thing this leads to is that if you haven't practised something you are unlikely to be able to do it "by thought". For example, you have to get used to all hovering attitudes to the point where you just react, if you have to think and react you're behind the Heli too far.

Got Money? Send it to me, I'm a Heli Addict.

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12-02-2007 09:49 PM  9 years agoPost 15
GimbalFan (RIP)

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Big Coppitt Key, FL

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right/left,Port/starbord thinking must go away AFTER mussle memory is learned.
If you have to constantly "think" in your primary language and convert from and to it, you are very slow in the secondary language and not fluent.
Yup. And the language analogy is good too. It's when you have the fewest possible 'calculations/conversions' going on between your intention and what your bird actually does that flying becomes fluid and smooth and effortless.

Think it -- and it happens without any more thought than the intention.

op-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-t

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12-02-2007 09:54 PM  9 years agoPost 16
AirWolfRC

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42½ N, 83½ W

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Port and starboard are nautical terms, not for aircraft.

In aircraft, like in a car, left and right are relative to sitting in the pilot/driver seat.

So, where did port and starboard come from ?

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12-02-2007 09:57 PM  9 years agoPost 17
GimbalFan (RIP)

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Big Coppitt Key, FL

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Port and starboard are nautical terms, not for aircraft.
There's actually a long tradition of these terms also being applied to aircraft, an 'airship' being just another kind of 'ship'...

op-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-t

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12-02-2007 10:03 PM  9 years agoPost 18
rogeroverout

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DFW area, TX

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Port and starboard are nautical terms, not for aircraft.

In aircraft, like in a car, left and right are relative to sitting in the pilot/driver seat.
Really? A google search on "port starboard aircraft" seems to disagree. Among many other references, there are three patents for various aircraft devices that use P and S in their descriptions. Ed's aircraft walkaround descriptions use these terms... and so on.

Seems these terms are still very much alive when applied to aircraft.

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12-02-2007 10:07 PM  9 years agoPost 19
GimbalFan (RIP)

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Big Coppitt Key, FL

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Roger -- Over, Out.

op-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-thwop-t

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12-02-2007 10:07 PM  9 years agoPost 20
AirWolfRC

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42½ N, 83½ W

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Well . . . Flying for the past 36 years . . . as a rated commercial and multi-engine pilot . . . I have yet to use port or starboard when talking to FBOs, tower or ATC.

You might want to check with a real pilot . . . and I don't mean a harbor pilot.

But if you want to disagree . . . . .

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HelicopterMain Discussion › Port/Starboard vs Left/Right
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