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T-REX 450 › Won't maintain altitude
08-12-2007 04:43 PM  10 years agoPost 1
T-Rex-Flyer

rrElite Veteran

Panama City, Fl

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My heli seem to always wants to clime or fall like a rock, it will hover at about 4 feet all day with just little inputs, but if I want to hover a lets say 15 or 20 feet it want to ether want to continue to clime a rocket or fall like a rock there seem to be no in between. I have let others fly it and all they can say is, it's weird...mine don't act like that. I'm just flying circuits and nose in hovering but have to battle the heli to maintain altitude. Just the smallest perception of a stick movement will cause a drastic rise or fall. Help Please my sanity may depend on it.

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08-13-2007 01:24 AM  10 years agoPost 2
T-Rex-Flyer

rrElite Veteran

Panama City, Fl

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Futaba 7chp
Normal
Pitch - 25 25 50 75 100
throttle 0 30 75 87.5 100

Idle-up 1
Pitch - 0 25 50 75 100
Throtle 100 90 80 90 100

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08-13-2007 02:54 AM  10 years agoPost 3
Gyronut

rrProfessor

Martinsville In.

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Whats wrong with his pitch curve in Idle 1.....????

Goes from 0 to 100 just like it should and his T Curve is a V so....???

Only thing I would suggest is to raise the cntr of your V curve up to like say 90 or maybe 95. So you end up with 100-95-100.

Rick

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08-13-2007 03:10 AM  10 years agoPost 4
zeese5

rrNovice

Macadonia

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Pitch - 25 25 50 75 100
throttle 0 30 75 87.5 100
Your normal pitch seems to me too much negative. My pitch is like 40,45,50,75,100

In my flying in normal mode, my heli will land if I put the throttle in the middle (0 pitch).

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08-13-2007 12:19 PM  10 years agoPost 5
TomRex

rrElite Veteran

West Palm Beach ​Join Date:​12-28-2005

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Do you have some fuel tubing on the throttle ratchet in your radio?

Zero on the pitch curve is negative

Ignorance is the absence of facts.Stupid is lacking the intellectual capacity to comprehend the fact

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08-13-2007 01:39 PM  10 years agoPost 6
The Daz

rrApprentice

Australia

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bump your headspeed up!

Feed it some nitro!, try not to get bitten..

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08-13-2007 02:57 PM  10 years agoPost 7
T-Rex-Flyer

rrElite Veteran

Panama City, Fl

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rcheli-freak21

My pitch range is -11 to +11
Well yeah you need to have negative pitch.
I got lot's of negative pitch.

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08-13-2007 03:21 PM  10 years agoPost 8
T-Rex-Flyer

rrElite Veteran

Panama City, Fl

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Hi Gyronut

Are you suggesting my idle-up should be
Throttle 100 95 95 95 100
If this is what you mean I can give it a try.

I forgot to mention I'm using a Aon 3500 motor with a 11 tooth pinon.
TP 2070 Batteries.

I thought the head may be the problem so I rebuilt it. Still have the same problem. The head is all align metal except the blade holders which are plastic.

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08-13-2007 03:27 PM  10 years agoPost 9
T-Rex-Flyer

rrElite Veteran

Panama City, Fl

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The Daz

My head speed is around 2200 in normal hover. For some reason no one wants to get close enough to take a reading in idle-up.

TomRex

No tubing on the throttle, This Heli radio doesnt ratchet on the on the throttle smooth as silk no sticking.

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08-14-2007 02:50 PM  10 years agoPost 10
CHEVPRO

rrApprentice

Mississauga,Ontario

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.

Run a linear pitch curve, and set the throttle to 100% across the board in idle up. I have the Aon3500 with a cc25 and am running the 11t pinion. The head turns at 2850rpm in a hover and stays where I put it.

The only bobs I get are when the wind is over 15-20 kph.

Todd

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08-14-2007 04:24 PM  10 years agoPost 11
pgoelz

rrVeteran

Rochester MI

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I'm no Trex expert yet but.......

There really shouldn't be any difference hovering at 4 feet vs 10 feet.... 4 feet is out of ground effect. Can you hear the head speed changing when you attempt to hover at >4 feet and work the collective? If so, the change in head speed is possibly magnifying your collective inputs.... delayed a bit. If you are not "tuned" to the delay, you can end up chasing the collective up and down. The head speed should be constant from hover to climb. If not, tweek the throttle curve until it is.

Also, 2200 RPM is a tad low. Especially if the head speed increases with added collective.

Servo arm geometry?

Do you have expo enabled? If so, try disabling it.

A long shot, but if you have funky blades that are not stable, coupled with a head with some slop, the pitch could change more/differently than you intend as you work the collective.

Paul

Paul Goelz
Rochester MI USA
http://www.pgoelz.com

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08-14-2007 05:23 PM  10 years agoPost 12
T-Rex-Flyer

rrElite Veteran

Panama City, Fl

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Hi CHEVPRO

I have the Aon3500 with a cc25 and am running the 11t pinion. The head turns at 2850rpm in a hover and stays where I put it.
With a Drag Co-Efficient of 100% (witch is impossible) that motor should only delver a head speed up to 2849rpm
Idle-up 1
Pitch - 0 25 50 75 100
Can't get much more linear pitch curve then that.
Also, 2200 RPM is a tad low
Yes I agree, but keep in mind I fly in idle-up 1 and is a much higher head speed, but have no way to measure it.

pgoelz

Once I've switch into Idle-up(a big jump), I don't hear any change in head speed after that.
No expo.
Little or no slop in the head, just rebuilt it thinking that maybe the problem.
A friend, who fly a heck of a lot better then I, had punch the throttle a few time and it pops up pretty quick with no boggin. But he has no Idea what's causing it to be so unstable in the collective.

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08-14-2007 05:40 PM  10 years agoPost 13
pgoelz

rrVeteran

Rochester MI

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Dang, I'm pretty much out of ideas! If the head speed is stable, the only thing I can think of is to note the stick position where it hovers and then examine the swash movement in that area once on the ground with the motor stopped. Make sure it is smooth and linear and no more/less movement than at any other point on the stick travel.

If everything else is 100% OK, it kinda has to be the blades?

Does it happen in normal mode (with slower head speed)?

Paul Goelz
Rochester MI USA
http://www.pgoelz.com

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08-14-2007 06:56 PM  10 years agoPost 14
T-Rex-Flyer

rrElite Veteran

Panama City, Fl

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pgoelz

Yea, me too. I have change the blades to the Align woods, it does is in normal mode as well.
examine the swash movement in that area once on the ground with the motor stopped. Make sure it is smooth and linear and no more/less movement than at any other point on the stick travel.
I looked at that but really can't tell.
going to bump up the throttle curve to 100 95 95 95 100
to see if that helps

Do you think there could be a problem with my TX.

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08-14-2007 07:14 PM  10 years agoPost 15
Zephan

rrApprentice

Lompoc, CA

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Sounds like you need to get an "optical tach" or borrow one to get your headspeed set right at zero pitch (on the ground) and at hover (about 3/4 stick). You need to set your throttle curve at the mid point and 3/4 point to get those two speeds the same at around 2800 to 3000rpm. You will probably find that the top throttle point will need to be 100% to maintain that head speed when you do a full pitch climbout. Then, of course, match the bottom pitch curve point and 1/4 point to the top and 3/4 point values for the negative side. I actually use the "governer mode" on my ESC and find that it works quite well even with a straight pitch curve that gives me +/-12 degrees.


Trex600N & Trex450SE... DAMN! Another radio glitch!

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08-14-2007 07:40 PM  10 years agoPost 16
T-Rex-Flyer

rrElite Veteran

Panama City, Fl

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Zephan

lol, yep I could sure use an optical tach (not cheap). I think you explained it as well as anyone has. I will be work have to get it all worked out.
Damn Hot, 103F in the shade, 98% humidly, air's dead, and can't breath.

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08-14-2007 08:12 PM  10 years agoPost 17
CHEVPRO

rrApprentice

Mississauga,Ontario

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For the record 2850rpm was read on the tach. No guessing. Manufacturer's specs are not always the most accurate and often represent an average for a given product.

Todd

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08-14-2007 08:20 PM  10 years agoPost 18
CHEVPRO

rrApprentice

Mississauga,Ontario

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This isn't an XL, is it? These have a bit of slop in the linkage compared to the SE.

If it was only happening in normal, I would say check your hovering pitch. I recently had an issue with mine hopping between norm and idle1,2. Didn't even know about the hovering pitch adjustment until then.

Todd

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08-14-2007 11:39 PM  10 years agoPost 19
T-Rex-Flyer

rrElite Veteran

Panama City, Fl

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CHEVPRO

Cool! much higher then expected then.
It's a SE head. open to all suggestion, pulling my hair out on this one. I did change my throttle in Idle-up but have not had a chance to test them yet.
had an issue with mine hopping between norm and idle1,2. Didn't even know about the hovering pitch adjustment until then.
Tell me more, Mine doesn't hop now but I'm afraid it mite now that I have change things.

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08-15-2007 03:17 PM  10 years agoPost 20
CHEVPRO

rrApprentice

Mississauga,Ontario

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As long as the pitch remains the same at center stick, it won't hop. I have the 7chp and never noticed the hover pitch was programmed in. It defaults to the adjustable knob and I must have turned it by mistake.

A low head speed will make the helicopter susceptable to even the slightest wind, that may be the problem.

One thing I did notice about this motor is the low amperage draw, compared to others. Most guys at the field are getting about 6 mins with other motors nad putting about 1700mah's back in the battery. Mine average about 1300mah's with the same flight time even at 100% throttle for the entire flight.

Todd

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T-REX 450 › Won't maintain altitude
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