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Other › TREX 600 TAIL WAG- Please Read- PROBLEM SOLVED !!!!
01-24-2007 01:58 PM  10 years agoPost 21
ArtK

rrVeteran

Temecula, Ca

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Have not tried that.

I am going to try what wolfcbr2003 suggested. The thrust bearings look fine and they have grease on them. I talked to him last night and apparantly he has built seval TREX 600's with this same problem. He runs 95mm blades on his without any issues.

Just to note I did put the 450 main grip bearings in the original tail and I think this is also a great fix. The bearings are a bit thicker so they are probably less likely to fail.

I will let everyone know how wolfcbr2003's idea works out after this weekend.

Thanks,

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01-24-2007 02:06 PM  10 years agoPost 22
robl45

rrKey Veteran

Deerfield Beach, FL

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it seems you want to reinvent the wheel, plenty of people are flying with this tail. They did as mr. mel wrote and went to smaller tail blades and it is working fine.

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01-24-2007 02:20 PM  10 years agoPost 23
ArtK

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Temecula, Ca

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I wish I had a wheel :)

What exactly is that procedure. I would be happy to try it first just to see.

I don't think everyone has this problem and it also makes sence that if you grease it, it might not stick as well. This may be doing the same thing. However, I suspect some rubbing is always happening so you might be limiting yourself to smaller blades and less gain then what would be optimal- Another possible theory.

And by the way, the inner and out bearings do have very close OD's about .001".

Please let me know what that greasing reversing procedure is all about or direct me to the link so that I can try it.

Thanks,

Art K.

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01-24-2007 02:30 PM  10 years agoPost 24
MrMel

rrProfessor

Gotland

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Take the bearring out, clean it.
Then re-grease it.

Now, the ball-holding part looks like an U, open on one side and closed on the other, default in Align premade the open part is outwards, however, during centrifugal forces this will make the grease leave the bearring, so flip that part (only the ball-holder, NOT the other parts) so the open part is turned inwards.

Assemble the bearrings and tail rotor holders again.

You should NOT put pressure on the thrust bearring, I know you dont think slop is good, but actually, if you put pressure with the screw on the thrust bearring, its even worse, they wont move 100% freely.

92mm tailblades is recommended for the thrusted tail.

- Fredrik

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01-24-2007 02:32 PM  10 years agoPost 25
robl45

rrKey Veteran

Deerfield Beach, FL

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http://www.heli-freak.com/viewtopic.php?t=25499

remove the - in heli-freak and this should help. Its a long thread though.

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01-25-2007 03:09 AM  10 years agoPost 26
ArtK

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Temecula, Ca

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TAIL WAG- Problem Solved

wolfcbr2003 was right on.

I grinded the outer thrust bearing washer down and that did it.

Works fine with stock TREX 95mm blades. I can easily see how a little bit of poor quality control can get those thrust bearings off just a little bit.

But I must say that the solution of going back to the 450 blade grip bearings in the stock tail works just as well.

Thanks RR.

All Good info.

I also see how greasing and going down in tail size will also help the problem by freeing up the thrust bearings using grease and reducing the gain by going with smaller blades but I don't think this is optimal. I really think Align intended on people using the 95mm blades. Maybe I am wrong. You probably loose some of your potential capability this way. Not that even the 92mm blades aren't enouph for the best pilots.

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01-25-2007 03:16 AM  10 years agoPost 27
spruce

rrApprentice

toledo, oh

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Yup those new "upgraded" tail holders suck, some people( or person) over at HF have alot of people fooled.
(getting something "to work" and having something work properly are 2 different things)

The stockers with the 450 blade grip bearings works extremely well.

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01-25-2007 03:55 AM  10 years agoPost 28
chiu

rrNovice

HK

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Can the problem to be solved by replacing the thrust bearing by a bearing of size 5 X 10 X 4 inside the new tail blade holder.

CHIU

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01-25-2007 05:18 AM  10 years agoPost 29
ArtK

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Temecula, Ca

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Probably

Probably

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01-25-2007 06:15 AM  10 years agoPost 30
dkshema

rrMaster

Cedar Rapids, IA

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Odd that the OD of the thrust bearings is different. The one's I've always run across have the same OD, but the ID of the two races is different. The larger ID race goes closest to the hub, the smaller ID race goes furthest out.

I guess Align marches to a different drummer.

-----
Dave

* Making the World Better -- One Helicopter at a time! *

Team Heliproz

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01-25-2007 07:07 AM  10 years agoPost 31
ArtK

rrVeteran

Temecula, Ca

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OD's

If both bearing surfaces touch the grip, how will it rotate freely?

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01-25-2007 09:04 AM  10 years agoPost 32
OICU812

rrMaster

Edson, Alberta, Canada

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Thrusted tail on "any heli" is better it is proven. Better off tweaking abit to make a thrusted tail work for you vs a radial bearing tail etc. At high rpms a thrusted tail is critical imho. Just a thought,,,we could always use more cowbell

...Once upon a time there were Nitros, flybars and frequency pins...

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01-25-2007 02:18 PM  10 years agoPost 33
ArtK

rrVeteran

Temecula, Ca

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Cowbell?

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01-25-2007 02:46 PM  10 years agoPost 34
spruce

rrApprentice

toledo, oh

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it would be better if Align made the tail work correctly in the 1st place

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01-25-2007 02:53 PM  10 years agoPost 35
ArtK

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Temecula, Ca

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I AGREE!!!

Align should do right thing- fix it and offer a free replacement.

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01-25-2007 04:18 PM  10 years agoPost 36
MrMel

rrProfessor

Gotland

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Just a thought,,,we could always use more cowbell
Shawn, Take it easy on the beer, right?

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01-25-2007 08:06 PM  10 years agoPost 37
bparro

rrVeteran

indianapolis,in

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I just took my thrusted tail apart and it seems that the outer race is the right size already. It moves easily in the grip. Iam going to flight test it when the weather gets better. I bought it a month ago.

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01-25-2007 08:14 PM  10 years agoPost 38
ArtK

rrVeteran

Temecula, Ca

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Just to note: Mine moved freely in the grip as well.

I guess you really can't tell until the load is on it.

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01-26-2007 01:26 AM  10 years agoPost 39
smartguy

rrVeteran

Corona, CA

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i just put the 600 together and im using a 611 gryo, couldnt figure out why my tail was wagging i have the gain to 37% i did upgrade it to the new tail grips as i was building it. could the new tail grips be the problem?

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01-26-2007 01:32 AM  10 years agoPost 40
ArtK

rrVeteran

Temecula, Ca

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Yes, I am sure of it.

Its real easy,
Just pull the outer thrust bearing washer off on both sides. (The one with the small ID). Grind the OD down as much as you want as long as you don't go into the thrust bearing groove. It does not have to be perfect just lower then the original OD. Clean everything up. Grease everything up. Install it with the bearings open side facing into the hub and try it again.

I will say this though if you can illiminate the problem with reducing gain it is probably OK as long as you feel your tail rotor locks in. There should be no wag at all.

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