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Helicopter
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Blade
Other › Brushless motor and stock 4in1 works!
12-01-2005 04:34 AM  12 years agoPost 61
skypup

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San Antonio, Texas

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Thanks. I am starting with an 8t pinion. I used this motor on a zoom 400 and it has a lot of power! Without throttle curves the 8t should keep the headspeed reasonable. My biggest concern will be glitching. I hope it isn't an issue. If this works extra power is a good thing. It can get you out of trouble at times if you have that reserve.

SKYPUP

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12-04-2005 12:54 AM  12 years agoPost 62
Dr.Ben

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Richmond, VA, USA

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I'm helping a friend with her CP.................................

Did y'all decide that the aforementioned E-flite brushless 370 with its stock pinion worked OK? And..........though many have used a 25 amp ESC, do we know what the motor is pulling? I saw the most recent post with a 15 amp. Is that more in the ballpark?

Thanks,

Ben Minor

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12-04-2005 01:22 AM  12 years agoPost 63
stealth916

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Rocklin, CA

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my trex pulls 6 amps. if this thing pulls more than 4, you got problems...

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12-04-2005 01:36 AM  12 years agoPost 64
kahunadad

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Goodyear, AZ

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I am using the E-Flight 370 (5400 Kv) and the E-Flight 20 amp controller. It seems to work very well. The motor came with a 10 and a 12 tooth pinion.....I put the 10 on it is that correct? Whats the difference. I run rc cars and I know the differrence but I have not been able to apply it to helicopters or planes..how does pinion size affect it?

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12-04-2005 08:44 AM  12 years agoPost 65
stealth916

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Rocklin, CA

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I'm starting to zero in on the Himaxx 2015-4100 for myself.

It is $77 at ALLERC.COM in combo with an Align 10A speed control. It weighs 48 grams (motor). This motor should allow a selection of performance options when using a pinion in the 6-11 tooth range on our Esky/Blades.

FYI - our main gear is 140 teeth.

I do know that quite a few Hornet flyers are using this motor. I use this motor in a 3D bipe and it is awesome - it has way more power than our brushed motors.

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12-04-2005 04:41 PM  12 years agoPost 66
stealth916

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Rocklin, CA

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I made a timing disc and tested a new stock Esky motor this morning. It is giving 9000RPM at 3.90V, or about 2300RPM/Volt under power. Keep in mind, that is just one motor tested at one voltage level. So consider it a very rough idea of the stock motor spec.

I'll try and dig up some more motors. I can't increase the voltage much without risk of seizing the motors since they are being tested with essentially no load.

That translates into about 1670RPM max rotor speed (no load) with a 9 tooth pinion at 11 volts, and less RPM in flight. I don't know if that sounds like reality.

I am still shooting for 1800-2000 RPM with good torque. So I am thinking Himaxx 2015-4100 with a 6-8 tooth pinion (if I can find them). I wont know until I fly it - that's the bottom line I guess.

Does anyone out there have an OPTO tach so we can beam this heli in a hover?



The NiCd pack was 4.1v at rest, and only dropped to 3.9v during the test - a drop of only .2v, showing the motor was not loaded by the disc.

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12-04-2005 05:40 PM  12 years agoPost 67
Mondell

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Shannon, NC.

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Can i use a dh 400 bl motor with this mod?

Thanks, Mondell

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12-04-2005 05:41 PM  12 years agoPost 68
Mondell

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Shannon, NC.

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does anyone have a stepby step sheet for this?

Thanks, Mondell

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12-04-2005 05:42 PM  12 years agoPost 69
Mondell

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Shannon, NC.

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I'm really just not sure about rewiring the elec's?

Thanks, Mondell

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12-04-2005 11:51 PM  12 years agoPost 70
Gary Hoorn

rrKey Veteran

Annapolis Maryland USA

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Mondell,
Can i use a dh 400 bl motor with this mod?
That 400DH will fly a TRex at twice the weight and eat the life out of a 2100mah Thunder Power Lipo. It would probably shred the maingear of the Blade!
Gary

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12-06-2005 12:56 AM  12 years agoPost 71
Squirrlybird

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Suffolk, Va US

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bump

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12-06-2005 01:04 AM  12 years agoPost 72
akerkhof

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Indianapolis, IN

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I'm using the himax 3600 motor in my Honeybee. At zero degrees pitch and 100% throttle, its doing 2850 RPM on my optical tach, which is kind of scary. I have it dialed down to about 80% throttle for about 2500 RPM on a fully charged battery. That's still a bit wild, but after a minute or so it settles down and flys really nice. Oh, that's with a 9T pinion.

One thing about the Himax: Its fragile. I broke it in a very minor crash... shaft popped out of the motor. I repaired it with red locktite and that's working well, but I've had another guy in my club have the same thing happen and in a thread I was discussing the repair in, some other guy had his go to. Just FYI.

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12-06-2005 02:02 AM  12 years agoPost 73
stealth916

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Rocklin, CA

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Someone else pointed this $23 motor out in another thread - 4100kv Brushless from Century. I may give it a try. I think we need a small pinion for a 4100kv motor, based on what your experiences are with 3600kv.

http://www.heli-world.com/Merchant2...&Category_Code=

I was afraid 4100kv might be way too much rev action....

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12-06-2005 03:53 PM  12 years agoPost 74
stealth916

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Rocklin, CA

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I just ordered this for $63.95 with free shipping:

Century Electron 12 ESC
Century Lightning Brushless with 10T pinion

http://www.heli-world.com/Merchant2...&Category_Code=

http://www.heli-world.com/Merchant2...&Category_Code=


Century claims this is the perfect motor/pinion combo for the Hummingbird Series. I am using a Hummingbird Elite auto gear - so this should all be good, right? I have a feeling the head speed will be way too high for my taste, but we'll see. I am going to pickup some small pinions just in case. Can't beat the price.

I went with the Century ESC because a) it was there & got me free shipping b) it's a heli ESC with two governor modes and good thermal protection

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12-06-2005 04:12 PM  12 years agoPost 75
akerkhof

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Indianapolis, IN

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I had a feigao 4100kv long can in there at first. I didn't have an optical tach at the time, but even at 50% throttle it was frightening. Again, with a 9T pinion. I think that's the motor I'm going to put in a TREX when I get proficient with the Honeybee. I don't know how low you'd have to go on the pinion to get a nice headspeed, since if I recall, you're on the mild side of the speed spectrum.

I'm thinking of bumping the 3600 down to 75%, because the first two minutes or so of a battery pack are pretty white knuckle experiences for my skill level right now. I hear that can be bad for the ESC, but it's rated for 25amps, and it doesn't even get warm right now.

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12-06-2005 04:27 PM  12 years agoPost 76
stealth916

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Rocklin, CA

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My only hope is that this motor is maybe over-rated Kv-wise? Or that Century otherwise knows what they are talking about - I say that with fingers crossed.

My calculations were that even at 80% of 4100Kv, a 6 or 7 tooth pinion would be more ideal for me. I am pulling the 10T and putting a 9 or maybe 8 on, until I can find 7 or 6.

I better start setting this heli up with my Futaba Tx and get it dialed before this motor shows up. I can tell I will need a very custom collective curve.

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12-06-2005 04:42 PM  12 years agoPost 77
akerkhof

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Indianapolis, IN

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If you've got a programmable radio I'm sure you'll get it setup fine. But there is a lot of tweaking, and I'm getting tired of it. Part of the problem is that I've been through 3 engines trying to find one that works, and each time its the same old process. First one was too powerful, second was nice but overheated, this hi-max is the proverbial "just right", but I've spent twice as much time on the bench as I have flying. Adjusting throttle curve, pitch curve, rev mixing, gyro gain, throttle to rudder mixing, take it up, do it again. It was fun at first, now its starting to feel like work.

My friend ordered a stock Honeybee last week, and when it gets here, I'm really interested in flying it. I could definately see me converting to stock if its as nice out of the box as I think it will be.

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12-06-2005 05:11 PM  12 years agoPost 78
stealth916

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Rocklin, CA

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OK - I tached my head at this morning at 1800 in idle up - zero pitch with 9t pinion, 3s lipo, and Century brushed motor.

By the way, it dawns on me now, these 4100kv motors are more likely suited for 2s lipo or 8.4 nicd.


The heli at average weight, flies well in sport mode on average 45 watts input to a brushed motor. It may only take 35 watts average input to a brushless motor to equal the performance from 45 watts into a brushed motor.

So while using 2s -vs- 3s lipo will cause the amps to go up, they shouldn't go up much. The trade off in efficiency of the brushless motor may nearly cancel out the extra amp requirement.

So I estimate with a 10T pinion, if the motor does ~80% of the 4100Kv rating under load, the head will turn around 1800RPM with 2s lipo. On 11T pinion it should be around 2000RPM. That all sounds good.

The average amp draw will probably go up to about 4.5 - 5A average in sport mode, with the lower voltage pack and higher efficiency motor. Since you only carry 2-cells, you can carry larger cells - again equaling or bettering the run time of the brushed motor on 3s. There should still be plenty of reserve for 3D with a 12A ESC.

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12-06-2005 05:36 PM  12 years agoPost 79
stealth916

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Rocklin, CA

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akerkhof - Have you tried a 2s lipo with, say a 10-11T pinion?

That is how I have decided I will start my testing with the Century 4100kv motor. I will use 10T pinion and 2s-lipo. Then I may move up to 11T pinion.

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12-06-2005 06:21 PM  12 years agoPost 80
saahbs

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Aurora, IL.

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stealth916,

Also, I assume you are using GWS50/H DD motor which probably has lower Kv than the non /H motor. It might not have enough rpm to counteract the main motor's torque with 2s. But switching to the non /H should fix that. Just a thought...

Mike.

--
I fly airplanes, sailplanes, helis; nitro and electric.

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Other › Brushless motor and stock 4in1 works!
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