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HelicopterTurbine Helicopters › when to go jet powered!!
10-08-2005 09:05 PM  12 years agoPost 1
richie1967_uk

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London UK

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I have been drooling over the wren/predator combo and was just wondering at what flying skill stage would you guys recomend taking the plunge? I fly a raptor, moskito sport and a trex, flying circuits, hovering at all angles no problem but not 3D yet (mainly cos i am not really that interested in that style of flying) I guess getting autos sorted is a must....also is the wren/predator combo a good choice? Its not a question of if i get a turbine but when!!!

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10-08-2005 09:23 PM  12 years agoPost 2
wolfdad

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Southern Maryland

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Well, since you are a London'er, I will allow my esteemed UK colleagues to answer your question. Were you here, there is a turbine waiver that must be applied for and approved prior to flying a turbine heli at any AMA sanctioned event. To get that waiver, you must demonstrate proficiency in high-speed forward and limited aerobatic flight with a heli powered by at least a .60 sized engine. The examiner (at least one of the two has to be a Contest Director) and must observe your proficiency. He may ask you to do as much as he needs to see or as little...there are no hard, fast rules...just some recommendations on maneuvers to include loops, rolls, stall turns, lazy eights, circuits both directions, nose-in work and, probably the only thing that IS rather strongly recommended is the ability to auto the aircraft and place it where you want it. I think the rules are a bit different on your side of the pond, so I would refrain from commenting, however I really think, regardless of the proficiency, you know when you are ready both fiscally and mentally to take the leap.

wolfdad sends...

"There are those who have...and, those who will" IRCHA #2117, AMA #70068, Turbine Waiver #105

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10-08-2005 10:00 PM  12 years agoPost 3
PETER ROB

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Devon UK

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Richie Sounds like you are almost at a 'B' standard, the turbine is only the power unit, just like a glow or gasser engine, if you can afford it go for it, the experience is worth the money you will spend, ask any one who flies turbines and ask if they are bored with the experience, I know the answer I have been flying turbines for 3 years and still get a buzz on start up, if you can, try and find someone who already flies turbines and spend some time with them, don't get drawn into which is the better, buy what you can afford and stay with it, you will not regret spending the money

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10-08-2005 10:08 PM  12 years agoPost 4
richie1967_uk

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London UK

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B standard huh? whats that stand for? "Bugger it i'll get one!!" maybe i should just get one and strap it to a workmate and start it up every now and then....So whats the story with servicing, reliability etc etc....

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10-08-2005 10:37 PM  12 years agoPost 5
PETER ROB

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Devon UK

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Richie Do you belong to a BMFA club, the 'B' certificate allows you to fly at public displays, As to service and reliability, depends on who you speak to, as you have opened the can of worms, I fly JetCat with over 300 hours of engine running time reliability brilliant, service now there is no longer a UK service agent not to good as The servicing is done in Germany, Wren is on our doorstep I fly with wren owners reliability not so good but brillient servicing, I also fly with a Jacobosky owner his is still in the box, I have also flown with Len Mount Jacobosky UK agent and his machines have always appeared to be reliable but as with JetCat the servicing is done abroad I believe in Austria. I was flying today with a wren owner and will post the photo's on Monday

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10-09-2005 01:30 AM  12 years agoPost 6
Bell Bloke

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UK

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Flying my new Wren/Predator all this weekend, engine arrived in flatpack form, more fun to build it I thought. We've been showing it off and hawking it around all of the full-size airfields in this area all weekend. It has been subjected to a damn good thrashing and I've lost count of the number of start-ups we have done. So far we've done 12 gallons of fuel in just a few days! The lads were very impressed with the fact that it is free turbine as this is an elegant solution as used on their full-size ones. Power is phenomenal, beautifully smooth and relentless, free turbines sound different too, less whoosh and more whine. Predator/Wren combo has to be the easiest helicopter I have ever flown. It was quite windy here today whereas yesterday was totally still, well it didn't make any difference. A friend of Skeeter Pilots has a hummingbird, he can't do nose in yet and I wasn't about to let him do a circuit anyway. However I did let him have a hover and he was amazed at how docile and easy it was compared to his fixed pitch Hummer. One final thing, so far this heli has been low maintenance, did I say low maintenance, I meant NO MAINTANENCE. Yes that's right 12 gallons and nothing has needed tightening yet! Although I have changed the primary gearbox oil. So I say just get one, you only live once.
After all, tomorrow you maybe run over by a steam roller.

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10-09-2005 09:14 AM  12 years agoPost 7
NEIL2-UK

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UK - South East

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12 Gallons... US or UK

Hi Bell Bloke

12 gallons UK, I guess... must mean about 9 hours and "NO MAINTENANCE", that is good!

"Lost count of the number of start ups done..." Is this possibly due to flame outs or do you have one start per flight, about 38 at a guess! The FADEC could give you this info.

NEIL

PS. TT-Cuatro 173 hours and no re-builds

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10-09-2005 09:27 AM  12 years agoPost 8
RUFFYB

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HERTFORDSHIRE UK.

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Hi richie,
There are several things to consider when dreaming of a turbine.
I am in the same position as you although you might be slightly
more advanced flying wise. Bell bloke is right, if you have the cash
spend it!! I thought about it for ages and then came to the same
conclusion. YOU ARE ONLY HERE ONCE!!

Think about the type of flying you do. Do you want to do 3d or
do you want scale. There are loads of opinions out there but in the
end it's down to you. Wren are a great team and all done in the uk,
so that is a plus. I have gone for the jakadofsky because i want
to fly scale only, and this setup is best for me...

On the legal front (i have just been through this) you do NOT
need any certs to fly a turbine, unless it is for reward or display.
As long as the model is between 7 and 20 kg, fitted with a failsafe
device, your local atc is notified (if you fly in the zone) and you follow the rules in cap 658 you are pefectly legal to fly. The bmfa insurance
will still cover you.
Read cap 658 and relevant articles. Read the bmfa handbook
and then go and buy one!!!

Regards and good luck,
Gareth...

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10-09-2005 09:31 AM  12 years agoPost 9
richie1967_uk

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London UK

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Thanks for all the advice, i was anticipating some flak over wanting to go turbine so early on in my flying stage...Maybe i should buy the kit and build it over the winter.....

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10-09-2005 09:44 AM  12 years agoPost 10
RUFFYB

rrNovice

HERTFORDSHIRE UK.

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I intend to keep flying the raptor 30 and benzin trainer.
I will just start again with the turbine. Gain confidence
in just hovering until comfortable and gently build up from
there.

Regards, Gareth...

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10-09-2005 09:47 AM  12 years agoPost 11
richie1967_uk

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London UK

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Hey Ruff, where do you fly? I am in borehamwood. Where did you buy your trainer from?

regards

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10-09-2005 09:51 AM  12 years agoPost 12
RUFFYB

rrNovice

HERTFORDSHIRE UK.

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I live in watford and fly at work (wycombe air park)
I purchased the trainer from vario uk (john white).
Where do you fly?
Regards, gareth...

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10-09-2005 09:55 AM  12 years agoPost 13
richie1967_uk

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London UK

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I have my workshop where Marconi used to be in Borehamwood, they have a huge amount of land (it is a disused golfcourse) which they allow me to fly on....Are you a member of the club in watford?

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10-09-2005 10:01 AM  12 years agoPost 14
RUFFYB

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HERTFORDSHIRE UK.

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No, never really been my scene.
Just learnt myself with a few people at work.
Will send you a pm or e-mail.
Worth keeping in touch ( you might want to buy my mk wren mw54
engine!!!)

Regards, gareth

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10-09-2005 10:03 AM  12 years agoPost 15
richie1967_uk

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London UK

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not my scene either, me and my brother inlaw have been teaching ourselves, got off to a shaky start but then one day it just clicked!!

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10-09-2005 02:45 PM  12 years agoPost 16
Swash Head

rrNovice

Beaumont, California

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I went from a Raptor 30 flying circuits and hovering at all orientations, to my Jetcopter SX. My personal preference is scale flying and I dont think you have to master aerobatics to graduate to a turbine. My biggest issue was / is to try to wipe off the huge grin on my face, and getting used to the weight. My advice, if you can, go for it you will never regret it, Rob.

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10-09-2005 04:37 PM  12 years agoPost 17
NEIL2-UK

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UK - South East

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Ref BMFA cert to fly Heli Turbine

Richie

From your original question...

BMFA requirements for fixed wing Jet Planes is that a 'B' Cert is required... after all they fly fast and carry a lot of fuel and the crash is usually spectacular (Dangerous).
BUT some Clubs are requesting that Turbine Heli Pilots have a 'B' Cert, perhaps just based on the assumption of the requirement for fixed wing... but this is Not Required for Heli Turbine, except of course for Public Display Events.

Some people in clubs think that because they are turbine they catch fire easily, but not so... ALSO, They are flown just like any large Heli such as 90 and Gasser, and of course you should have the experience before jumping straight in to large machines.

The Greatest potential fire risk is with Gassers... and I know of one club that asks flyers of Turbine and Gassers to have a No Smoking sign near them when they are operating from the pit area... and Glo-Fuel does not catch fire then!
No Smoking should be common sense near ANY flammable liquid... FUEL.

And Do Not forget the fire extinguisher... the best option of which is 5kg CO2.

NEIL
HeliLeisure.com

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10-09-2005 04:44 PM  12 years agoPost 18
Richard

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Scottish Borders,​U.K.

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Hi ritchy1967, I thought the same as you, am I ready for a turbine? I've been flying my Raptors for a few years, doing basic 3D but the thought of a turbine going into the deck due to lack of experience is scary! however I have ordered a Jecopter from Eastern Helicopters in Canada. It's been about 5 weeks since I ordered it due to a Vario parts upgrade and a little mix up between Canadian Customs and Jetcat. I hope to have it in the next couple of weeks.

Richard

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10-09-2005 04:47 PM  12 years agoPost 19
richie1967_uk

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London UK

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so you think i need some experience with a larger heli? I fly a 30, and a 50, what would the advantage be with going to a bigger glow (or gasser) before getting a turbine? The larger the heli the more stable right? So if i can fly a 30 without problems wont a bigger (more stable) heli be ok for me to handle?

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10-09-2005 04:47 PM  12 years agoPost 20
1275mini

rrKey Veteran

Wirral North West​U.K.

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Just Do It you will love it !

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