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HelicopterBeginners Corner › General Flying, noob expectations ...
05-03-2005 01:27 AM  12 years agoPost 1
bkervaski

rrElite Veteran

Birmingham, AL, USA

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I just recovered from my second crash, albeit very minor at least. Just a new set of blades and a flybar.

My question is, what is a realistic timeframe (# of flights?) that most people should expect to start getting it?

Also, I seem to have orientation problems. That's what caused this last crash. I wasn't comfortably "behind and to the right" of the heli.

Any tips or insight would be appreciated.

I have reflex and will of couse continue practicing.

Team Synergy Factory Specialist / Scorpion / Thunder Power / Byron's Fuels

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05-03-2005 01:45 AM  12 years agoPost 2
yugi

rrVeteran

Maryland

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Your not going to like this answer, but there is no time frame on learning orientation. Everyone learns at a different pace. I would stress that you keep practicing on the sim. That will speed up your learning a lot. Remember, it will come to you. Just don’t get discouraged; RR is the best place to get help in any area.

Yugi

If you keep doing the same thing…...you’re going to get the same results!

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05-03-2005 01:46 AM  12 years agoPost 3
GroundMagnet

rrVeteran

St Louis

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What are you doing when you crash? If you are just trying to hover and you can you do it on the SIM and not with the real thing I would have the bird check out by someone that can fly. I learned how to do most everything on the SIM and was able to nose in hover as long as I wanted to on the first real flight. I had it down pat on the SIM though, I’m talking 15 to 20 mph winds with different heli’s .

I can do a lot on the SIM that I can’t do for real it’s a great tool but no match for stick time.


Tony

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05-03-2005 01:50 AM  12 years agoPost 4
bkervaski

rrElite Veteran

Birmingham, AL, USA

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I had my bird setup by a pro. (I say setup as he basically redid everything I had already done). I learned a lot from the 4 hours I spent with him.

I can hover no problem. No really 100% sure what a "nose-in" hover is.

My 30v2 will just about fly itself in a hover, which is how I know I picked the right guy to help me set it up. I swear, I learned more in that 4 hours that I have the 4 months I've been messing with this thing.

Team Synergy Factory Specialist / Scorpion / Thunder Power / Byron's Fuels

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05-03-2005 02:47 AM  12 years agoPost 5
pH7

rrKey Veteran

Sterling Heights, MI - USA

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Nose-in is just what is says - while you are hovering the nose is pointed in toward you. Usually, everyone finds this the hardest orientation while learning to hover.

I was using Reflex XTR for several months by just flying around and thought I was learning something. Thanks to another post here, I started doing real hover practice. I used the crappy Reflex scenery (the computer generated one) and made myself hover over the big H in the middle of the helipad. Start with tail-in and gradually work around to other orientations. After you think you are competent in all orientations, then try the Promenade option under Simulation with the same goal in mind: stay over the big H. Promenade moves the camera while you are hovering forcing a changing orientation constantly.

Now this is a whole lot more boring than flying around doing 3D in a photorealistic scenery, but it forces you to fly the heli, not let it fly you.

When you can do all that, hovering the real thing should be no problem. I started on my first flight without training gear and am making great progress so far (about 1.5 gallons).

Good luck,
Have fun

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05-03-2005 02:56 AM  12 years agoPost 6
BC Don

rrElite Veteran

Calgary, AB Canada

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Bill, as far as "how long", the answer is "it depends". I'm sure I'm over 100 flights (or close to it), I can hover, do some basic circuits, hover nose in at altitude and keep it OK in the wind. Can't do autos, just started some loops, can't do decent approachs so I have tons to learn.

I can do lots of this stuff on the SIM but not in real life.

Got Money? Send it to me, I'm a Heli Addict.

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05-03-2005 02:44 PM  12 years agoPost 7
Leif

rrElite Veteran

USA

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Flying a heli depends heavily on reflexes. A "reflex" is defined as an instinctive reaction to a given stimulus. You need to learn these reflexes just like Pavlov's dogs did.

The only way to progress is to practice until your stick inputs are automatic (you shouldn't need to think about them, just do them). This means LOTS of stick time on the simulator, but more important than just time is that you must spend your simulator time actually PRACTICING. Too many people just get on the sim and half-heartedly play... you really need to focus on learning.

Some SIM exercises that I have used include:

1. Use "follow mode" in the simulator initially. Do hovering practice at a higher altitude and SET A TIME TARGET.... Don't stop until you reach the target time (5-10 minutes should be your eventual target for this).

2. Move to pilot at fixed position. Try to hover within a fixed area no larger than 3 times the heli footprint. Again, set a time target and stick to it.

3. Hover the heli in a large circle around yourself with the tail facing you. Keep doing this until you can comfortably circle yourself both slow and fast in either direction.

4. From tail-in hover, turn the heli 45-degrees and hold this for 30 seconds. Then back to tail in, then 45-degrees the other way for 30 seconds. Gradually increase the hold time until you can hover at the 45 degree points for 5 minutes.

This is just for starters. There are plenty of additional exercises that can be developed. My favorite practice is to put in some rudder trim, get into a hover and then fly with cyclics only (not allowed to touch the collective/rudder stick). The main point is to treat the sim as a learning tool and not just a game. If every flight in the sim ends in a crash, then you're doing something wrong!

Leif

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05-04-2005 12:35 AM  12 years agoPost 8
bkervaski

rrElite Veteran

Birmingham, AL, USA

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Leif,

Thanks for the great suggestions! I'll definitely take your advice.

In Reflex, my follow mode is grayed out. Any clue?

Team Synergy Factory Specialist / Scorpion / Thunder Power / Byron's Fuels

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05-04-2005 01:17 AM  12 years agoPost 9
Leif

rrElite Veteran

USA

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Sorry, I'm not familiar with the details of Reflex. I'm using G2. I assume there is a comparable option to position the pilot "behind" the aircraft. Maybe you need to set up some parameters first like distance from model.

Any Reflex experts out there? Really the only reason I recommend starting with follow mode is to get you more time between crashes. Once you think you can hover OK from a fixed position, move on to the second exercise. I used follow mode heavily when learning inverted hovering, as it's better to develop the hand-eye coordination at the proper distance and position relative to the model than trying to hover inverted 50 feet above you.

Leif

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05-04-2005 03:34 AM  12 years agoPost 10
Ted Toth

rrElite Veteran

Myrtle Beach S.C.

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Bill for me and most I believe is how big or how much brass you have
you may not progress to fast is you don't try or take some risks
you can fly for a year or more and not wreck if you just hover around and by brass I don't mean deep pockets it is a mind set the word confidence comes to mind

.

You don't stop laughing because you grow old, you grow old because you stopped laughing.

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05-04-2005 01:29 PM  12 years agoPost 11
pH7

rrKey Veteran

Sterling Heights, MI - USA

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bkervaski wrote:
In Reflex, my follow mode is grayed out. Any clue?
The follow mode is only available in the Reflex scenery (the clunky computer generated scenery). The reason is that all the photorealistic scenes can be displayed from only one position (the position of the camera when the scene was photographed).

I wouldn't spend very much time in follow mode anyway, you won't be following it when you fly the real thing.

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05-04-2005 02:50 PM  12 years agoPost 12
bkervaski

rrElite Veteran

Birmingham, AL, USA

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Ahh, makes sense on both accounts.

I keep forgetting that Reflex has panoramic pictures as the environment. It's so realistic and they pulled it off so well it's barely noticeable.

The flight mechanics are oustanding.

Thanks!

Team Synergy Factory Specialist / Scorpion / Thunder Power / Byron's Fuels

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05-04-2005 05:55 PM  12 years agoPost 13
Zephan

rrApprentice

Lompoc, CA

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I would also recommend the "promenade mode" in Reflex. It helps a lot in finding out where your "weak spots" are. Be sure and do the promenade in both directions (use both + and - promenade rates). I am not quite there yet, but my goal is to be able to hold that sucker over the big H indefinately in both promenade directions, then actually try and slide it around to the corners of the heli pad while in promenade. I would then consider myself able to hover. Do give yourself a treat once in a while and do some flying around just "for fun" too though. By the way, I am working on my 4th gallon of fuel and I am comfortable hovering the real thing both tail in and nose in. My problem is with some of the side orientations, so for now I just don't let it stay in those orientations for very long.


Trex600N & Trex450SE... DAMN! Another radio glitch!

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