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HelicopterMain Discussion › Heli Crash TOWING A BOAT!! DUMB A$$
12-10-2004 12:05 AM  13 years agoPost 41
rob10000

rrKey Veteran

Western Massachusettes

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Take your heli and tie a rope to one of the skids. Now hover it about 20 feet in the air. Yank on the rope a little. The heli might roll to one side quite a bit.
Before you try this, please stand a safe distance away.
Oh, and don't forget to record the whole thing.

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HelicopterMain Discussion › Heli Crash TOWING A BOAT!! DUMB A$$
12-10-2004 12:19 AM  13 years ago •• Post 42 ••
wurthless

rrElite Veteran

Redding Ca.

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If you took a heli and tied it to the top of a post that was bent a 90 degrees to the side....pulled the rope tight with the Heli and continued to pull up and forward (like the pilot was tryng to do while pulling the boat), the Heli would rotate in the air in a cicular motion like a wagon wheel, the hub being the boat and the rope being a spoke and the Heli being the rim,,,that is what I think you are seeing in the video and the pilot had no time to "stop the wheel". Call what you like,,,, but that what I see,,,for what it's wurth,,,,

QUICK! ,,,can someone turn the gravity off for just a second,,,,

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12-10-2004 12:42 AM  13 years agoPost 43
Big R

rrNovice

ORLINDA ,TN

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i saw the video on tv a short time ago you can not see it in the video
but the rope broke is what made the heli crash after the crash the
boat started and they helped save the people on the heli no one was
hert they were very lucky

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12-10-2004 12:51 AM  13 years agoPost 44
wurthless

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Redding Ca.

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Musta roll started the boat!!!! HHhaaahahahaaa!!!!

QUICK! ,,,can someone turn the gravity off for just a second,,,,

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12-10-2004 01:28 AM  13 years agoPost 45
AirWolfRC

rrProfessor

42½ N, 83½ W

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Dynamic Rollover . . . yes.

http://www.helicoptersonly.com/saya...rsdynamic1.html will give a description of the maneuver. The heli in the picture "pivoted" about it's port skid which was restrained by the tow rope. This prevented ANY amount of right cyclic from correcting the problem. There was also a nose-down pitching moment because of the rope attachment point being in front of the main mast of the heli.

Had the pilot lowered the collective soon enough, he might have been able to recover.

Wolfgang

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12-10-2004 03:04 AM  13 years agoPost 46
Helimex

rrApprentice

Oklahoma

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Ok, have it your way. At this point I'll heed some advice my mother gave me long ago. It was an interesting debate just the same. I'll throw away all my Army training manuals. Didn't realize what the Army has been training for so long has been wrong all along. I'll be sure to tell my helicopter buddies in Iraq the same.

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12-10-2004 07:14 AM  13 years agoPost 47
mikeflyz

rrApprentice

Westlake Village, CA

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Before you try this, please stand a safe distance away.
I don't plan on doing this

Mike
MA Fury Extreme, JetCopter SX

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12-10-2004 01:17 PM  13 years agoPost 48
Bg_

rrApprentice

Penn. State U.

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Now take your heli and (glue) (tie with a rope) one skid to the ground. Try to (take off) (move up and forward from a hover). The heli will pivot on the skid until it reaches a certain point that is non recoverable, no matter what you attempt. Viola, Dynamic Rollover.

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12-10-2004 03:05 PM  13 years agoPost 49
AirWolfRC

rrProfessor

42½ N, 83½ W

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Helimax, as far as your interpretation of your Army Training goes, don't go away mad, just go away.

With all due respect;

I think you need to re-evaluate the dynamics. Just because you went through training, doesn't mean you really learned it.

Wolfgang

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12-10-2004 03:45 PM  13 years agoPost 50
w.pasman

rrElite Veteran

Netherlands

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It seems to me that we all agree on what happens and what should be done to avoid a crash. The only issue is about the exact name of the issue.

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12-10-2004 04:35 PM  13 years agoPost 51
Helimex

rrApprentice

Oklahoma

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Airwolf
Yeah, you're absolutely right. I am not mad and at this point I will go away. Lets all give thanks for experts like yourself who seem to know it all. Sad part of the whole situation is wondering how many others are out there flying around with the wisdom you've given them. Have a nice day.

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12-10-2004 05:31 PM  13 years agoPost 52
AirWolfRC

rrProfessor

42½ N, 83½ W

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Helimas, if you can't stick to the subject matter, it would be good if you don't say anything at all.

If you can't provide adequate evedence of the technicals at hand, then just let it go. Expecting us to believe you just because you say you have been exposed to certain training is not going to cut it with me.

Wolfgang

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12-10-2004 05:33 PM  13 years agoPost 53
Helimex

rrApprentice

Oklahoma

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Yeah, ok. Have it your way. It will be funny to watch the expressions on my buddies faces when they roll their helis inverted and I tell them that according to you, the expert, they've just experienced dyanamic rollover.

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12-10-2004 05:57 PM  13 years agoPost 54
Rappy da Raptor

rrVeteran

Dorset

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Idiot

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12-13-2004 04:47 PM  13 years agoPost 55
Avropilot

rrVeteran

Murfreesboro, Tennessee

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In a sense the rope tied to the boat became the ground. Just as you would hook a skid on grass, even had he tied the rope to the skid it would have caused the same outcome. Rotorcraft fire fighters have to be weary of this scenario at all times. Loads must be applied within the center of gravity on all rotorcraft! This case was dynamic rollover. The side load was so great it redirected lift in an arc direction causing any and all cyclic input to be ineffective. = Dynamic rollover

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12-14-2004 10:44 PM  13 years agoPost 56
Helimex

rrApprentice

Oklahoma

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Call it what you wish. Low altitude and sheer stupidity does not cause dynamic rollover. It only causes an unfortunate accident.

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12-14-2004 11:18 PM  13 years agoPost 57
AirWolfRC

rrProfessor

42½ N, 83½ W

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What's the big misunderstanding here ?

Dynamic Rollover is what happens when cyclic can no longer over-come a rolling force induced by whatever, (a skid restrained by a rope in this case), be it on the ground or in the air.

Wolfgang

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12-15-2004 12:18 AM  13 years agoPost 58
Bg_

rrApprentice

Penn. State U.

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Well since you seem to have missed it:

Originally posted by Helimex:
Now take your heli and glue (tie a heavy boat with a rope to) one skid to the ground. Try to take off (move up and forward from a hover). The heli will pivot on the skid until it reaches a certain point that is non recoverable, no matter what you attempt. Viola, Dynamic Rollover.
Emphasis mine.

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12-15-2004 02:13 AM  13 years agoPost 59
Helimex

rrApprentice

Oklahoma

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What's the big misunderstanding here?
None whatsoever.

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12-16-2004 02:27 AM  13 years agoPost 60
Avropilot

rrVeteran

Murfreesboro, Tennessee

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Give a few guys a model helicopter and all the sudden their aerospace experts. I have a few hours in the ole logbook flying rotorcraft and have had experience with Dynamic Rollover first hand loading on a trailer once. Also 5 years of college in areospace physics. But hey all the Runryder Hardheads know more than us.

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HelicopterMain Discussion › Heli Crash TOWING A BOAT!! DUMB A$$
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