RunRyder RC
 7  Topic Subscribe
WATCH
 3 pages [ <<    <    ( 1 )     2      3     NEXT    >> ] 2720 views
06-01-2004 11:13 PM  13 years agoPost 1
Jared J

rrApprentice

Harrisonburg, VA

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Is is necessary? Anyone have it for doing contracted shots/videos? If so, what kind of insurance is needed?

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
06-02-2004 05:25 AM  13 years agoPost 2
gpyros

rrKey Veteran

On a beach in Mexico

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Jared:

You will find that is insurance (or the lack of it ) that is holding most people back.

On my last shoot I was required to have a $1,000,000 liability policy and name the client as an additional insured on the policy. Pretty standard stuff for an educated client, but not the sort of thing that you would have been able to get in a few days!

We've carried that for many years (I've been in business since the early 80's) and never had a claim, but if I didn't have it we couldn't have done the job.

Greg Pyros
Pyros Pictures, Inc.
http://www.pyros.com

Maxi-Joker helicam
Joker-CX helicam
Graupner Jet Ranger (elec)
Raptor-50
Logo-10
9CH

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
06-02-2004 03:42 PM  13 years agoPost 3
cainebean

rrApprentice

USA

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

So how

So how and where does the average Joe get insurance. I have seen a few people on the site say they have insurance, but no one seems to give details on where the rest of the group should look.

Bean

PM  EMAIL  Attn:RR  Quote
06-02-2004 06:37 PM  13 years agoPost 4
gpyros

rrKey Veteran

On a beach in Mexico

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Start with an agent you already know - the one who handles your house or car insurance. See if they will underwrite a business. If they won't, ask him who does! That will get you started.

Insurance companies are licensed by state, so what works in one state probably won't work in another.

Greg

Maxi-Joker helicam
Joker-CX helicam
Graupner Jet Ranger (elec)
Raptor-50
Logo-10
9CH

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
06-02-2004 06:53 PM  13 years agoPost 5
Jared J

rrApprentice

Harrisonburg, VA

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

A guy who does jobs locally told me he doesn't have insurance and it's not needed unless you have a full blown business. If it's just for pocket money insurance is optional, he just has the client sign a waiver. Not sure if that's all kosher but it's what he does.

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
06-02-2004 09:24 PM  13 years agoPost 6
Slartibartfast

rrApprentice

Round Rock, TX

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

I've talked to 3 different companies (including my regular home insurance provider, USAA) and none of them will do anything with aerial photography. It isn't that they think it is too risky, they just don't know how to handle it.

And it doesn't matter whether you are doing it for a business or for pocket money, you can easily get sued either way if you screw up. And waivers are not worth the paper they are printed on.

In fact, the *worst* case is if you are doing it for pocket money. That means that someone can sure *you* and take everything you own. If you have a corporation, the worst they can do is wipe the corporation out.

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  Attn:RR  Quote
06-02-2004 11:32 PM  13 years agoPost 7
gpyros

rrKey Veteran

On a beach in Mexico

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Not so much if it is for pocket money or a business, much depends on whether your clients need you to have it before you fly for them.

And yes, having a corporation helps.

And no, a waiver won't do you much good.

Another option is to get in under the client's insurance coverage, and have yourself named as an additional insured under their policy, but it doesn't make you look like a serious professional, IMHO.

Greg

Maxi-Joker helicam
Joker-CX helicam
Graupner Jet Ranger (elec)
Raptor-50
Logo-10
9CH

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
06-02-2004 11:39 PM  13 years agoPost 8
w7oad

rrNovice

Salt Lake City, Utah

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Insurance

Try this guy. He wrote mine, took a couple of months but was able to get the insurance I needed.

Ken Fontana 307-635-4231

PM  EMAIL  Attn:RR  Quote
06-03-2004 08:31 AM  13 years agoPost 9
blazek

rrApprentice

Greece-Athens

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

''you can easily get sued either way if you screw up''

dear Slartibartfast

i hear that very offen ''you can easily get sued either way if you screw up'' so....

by whom and y is the question...

as i tried to get an insurance for aerials in my country the most people said that is forbitten to take aerials without the permision of greek authorities.... no one says y ...
after the olympics i ll try to find a way with my lawyer how to be able to do that...
until then everything i do ...i do it just for hobby!!!
regards
john

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
06-03-2004 11:33 AM  13 years agoPost 10
groundeffect

rrKey Veteran

Canada

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

does Incorporation help????????

Does incorporating really secure/protect you from liablity issues, or just financial issues?


cheers,
Dean

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
06-03-2004 12:05 PM  13 years agoPost 11
blazek

rrApprentice

Greece-Athens

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Dean if u are reffering to me in what incoporation are u talking about?
regards
john

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
06-03-2004 01:55 PM  13 years agoPost 12
eyeisdee1

rrApprentice

Sandpoint, Idaho

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

w7oad,

I'm glad my lead worked out for you. Ken is a great guy..

Jeff


-----------------------

PM  EMAIL  Attn:RR  Quote
06-03-2004 07:32 PM  13 years agoPost 13
Polariman

rrApprentice

Annandale, Minnesota

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Incorporating into a business helps to an extent. If you have a claim they can take your business and your done. If you are incorporated and have insurance your business may survive!

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
06-03-2004 07:46 PM  13 years agoPost 14
Andrew

rrApprentice

Peoria, IL

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Even if you're incorporated, you can be held personally liable in some instances. "Incompetence" in setting up a corporation can be one way a court can pierce your corporate veil. Purposfully not having insurance to save a buck could be viewed as incompetence when setting up a business involving a flying lawnmower without a blade cover.

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  Attn:RR  Quote
06-03-2004 09:51 PM  13 years agoPost 15
Andrew

rrApprentice

Peoria, IL

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

I pay around $1200 bucks a year. I'm covered only in Illinois.

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  Attn:RR  Quote
06-03-2004 11:26 PM  13 years agoPost 16
Slartibartfast

rrApprentice

Round Rock, TX

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

dear Slartibartfast
i hear that very offen ''you can easily get sued either way if you screw up'' so....

by whom and y is the question...
My point was that the people who will sue you don't care whether you are doing it for a hobby or for a business. However if you are not getting paid at all for it, then a typical homeowners policy would probably cover it. But don't take my word for it, please.

The "whom" is the person you hit with your helicopter, or the person who owns the building/car/whatever you hit with your helicopter. The "why" is because you hurt them or their property. And the "how much" is everything you've got.

Sure, it isn't likely, especially if you are a good pilot. But even if you are a great pilot, you could bust a linkage or something and go careening into little Sally who just stepped outside to see what was going on. And then *bang* you are liable for $400,000 in pain, suffering, and reconstructive surgery.

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  Attn:RR  Quote
06-03-2004 11:28 PM  13 years agoPost 17
Slartibartfast

rrApprentice

Round Rock, TX

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

I pay around $1200 bucks a year. I'm covered only in Illinois.
That is just obscenely high, but typical from what I have seen. If you think about it, liability insurance for a car is only around $100 a month, and you are way more likely to hurt someone with your car.

I think the problem is that there is just no competition in this area. The $1200 just sounds like a wild-assed guess on the part of the insurance company.

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  Attn:RR  Quote
06-03-2004 11:31 PM  13 years agoPost 18
Slartibartfast

rrApprentice

Round Rock, TX

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

They confirmed that being incorporated is a good idea however some customers may insist the you not only sign as an officer of the company but also as the person delivering the service. Apparently this blows your shield
Yes, it does. One of the most important things as a corporation is that you never sign as yourself, but as John Doe, President. There have been many legal cases where something this simple makes the case for "piercing the corporate shield"

The scary thing is that even if you just did this for one client, it could be used against you later by someone else who wanted to get to your personal assets.

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  Attn:RR  Quote
06-04-2004 04:54 AM  13 years agoPost 19
Angelos

rrKey Veteran

nr Oxford, OX11, UK

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Becoming Incorporated or whatever else workaround someone can find to save his own ass is not a solution to me. What happens if you hurt someone and it really costs hundreds of thousands of dollars in medical expenses. Or even worst if he becomes disabled. Who is going to provide for him and his family?

I must say that we are lucky in UK to have really cheap insurance via BMFA for aerial work (or whatever other paid activity involving models). However, I believe that insurance is a necessity and I would get one whatever the cost.

I read above…
Sure, it isn't likely, especially if you are a good pilot.
Well, I have lost count of how many PCM receiver and gyro lock-out reports I have seen on RunRyder. It doesn’t matter how good pilot you are. It will always happen!

Also…
If you think about it, liability insurance for a car is only around $100 a month, and you are way more likely to hurt someone with your car.
Again, I don’t expect to loose control of my car ever in my life, but I expect to loose control of a model. The way I see it… It is just matter of time.

PM  EMAIL  GALLERY  Attn:RR  Quote
06-04-2004 05:22 AM  13 years agoPost 20
Slartibartfast

rrApprentice

Round Rock, TX

My Posts: All  Forum  Topic

Well, I have lost count of how many PCM receiver and gyro lock-out reports I have seen on RunRyder. It doesn’t matter how good pilot you are. It will always happen!
Yes, it may happen often enough. But for someone to get hurt, it has to happen at the right (wrong) time, with people nearby, etc. etc. Ideally, for a photoshoot, you would not have any spectators.
Again, I don’t expect to loose control of my car ever in my life, but I expect to loose control of a model. The way I see it… It is just matter of time.
But probability-wise, you are much more likely to hurt someone with you car. You are very often driving around other cars and pedestrians. And you probably drive at least 10 hours a week, where you might only fly 20-30 minutes a week. You also have much more control over the heli environment. You can refuse to fly if there are people around. You can't do that in a car.

PM  EMAIL  HOMEPAGE  Attn:RR  Quote
WATCH
 3 pages [ <<    <    ( 1 )     2      3     NEXT    >> ] 2720 views
 Print TOPIC  Make Suggestion 

 7  Topic Subscribe

Saturday, December 16 - 5:26 am - Copyright © 2000-2017 RunRyder   EMAILEnable Cookies

Login Here
 New Subscriptions 
 Buddies Online